my care2
make a difference

community & fun

groups

get together & make a difference

 
 
Video: Why Tofu and Nonfermented Soy Is NOT a Health Food January 13, 2007 3:00 AM

Dr. Mercola is a licensed physician who has his own lab for testing and research. He is dedicated to inform the public about healthy lifestyle. Avoid being deceived by the soy industry and learn the reasons why you are better off avoiding tofu and all forms of nonfermented soy...

 [ send green star]
 
Vegan Society March 14, 2007 4:47 AM

Q:  Is soya safe?

A: Soya beans and soya products have had a very mixed press, being praised by some as a superfood and condemned by others as a poison.

Soya foods are a traditional part of the Japanese diet and the Japanese show better health and longevity than most Western countries. This provides good assurance of the safety of soya foods consumed in the quantities and forms common in Japan. The Japanese consume about 10 g of soya bean protein per day, mostly as tofu, roasted beans, soya milk and fermented bean products such as natto and miso. 10 g of soya protein per day translates to about 100g of tofu or half a pint of soya milk. This is more than most vegans consume so vegan soya use can be presumed healthy on the basis of the Japanese experience.

The use of TVP and fake meats is a recent Western innovation and therefore does not carry the same assurance of safety, but there is no direct evidence to suggest that such foods are not safe. The use of soya formulas for infants is clearly inferior to breast-feeding, but evidence from the USA based on decades of use of soya infant formula indicates no adverse effects compared with cow's milk formula.

There is moderate evidence that soya can reduce menopausal symptoms and bone loss and good evidence that large amounts of soya protein reduce cholesterol levels. Certain other claimed benefits, such as reduced breast cancer risk, are more dubious.

Overall, there is no reason to avoid moderate use of soya which has been a useful part of Japanese and Chinese diets for millennia and provides a useful source of protein and other nutrients.

Source

 [ send green star]
 
 March 18, 2007 12:38 AM

what is the best kind of not real meat to eat? Angie  [ send green star]  [ accepted]
 
 March 18, 2007 1:41 AM

Hello Angela,

Unfortunately, I'm not sure about the answer to that. I eat those stuffs in moderation to none. I survive mostly on natural fruits, grain, vegetables etc., and less on fake meat. Perhaps, others in this group who are more experienced on this can give you the answer you are looking for. Lets wait and see...

 [ send green star]
 
hi March 18, 2007 9:37 PM

Some of the studdies that say soy is bad, are based on testing done on rats or mice , and the flaw with that is, rats or mice react differently to soy than humans do. The studdies i read that reported soy was bad were later refuted by other doctors who did enough research to show why the ratts had trouble with soy and noted that humans have a different reaction to soy which does not lead to cancer as it does in ratts , or mice.

Also there is alot of hype about young kids eating soy may end up with messed up gender developement. But i have seen no research that supports such claims. i think its safe to say that a young man who eats soy will not suddenly start haveing female mamary glands, its redicoulous and just a scare tactic ,to put fear into people. I ate tons of soy when i was vegetarian and i had no ill effects. I ate big portions more than the average person would and i had no problems with it at all,and i did that for more than 15 years.

 [ send green star]  [ accepted]
 
 March 19, 2007 11:57 PM

thanks nick I eat all veggies and others also, I'll check around.. Angela   [ send green star]  [ accepted]
 
 March 20, 2007 12:29 AM

FoXyJanuary 19, 2007 1:28 AM
Well as river said elsewhere
River R
Sunday, 1:52 PM
Consider your source: Dr Mercola also advocates the eating of salmon,
fish oil, raw milk products, kefir, raw eggs, grass-fed beef and
ostrich meat, among others - none of which we'd touch with the
proverbial 10-foot pole. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Mercola and also http://www.soya.be/mercola.php among others. (If you want a bit of fun, try googling on Mercola quack.)

This is an old story from Mercola (he is not btw a nutritionist) - as
from some others. Those who are suspicious of unfermented soy or are
allergic to it are free to choose recipes which can be made without it.

Thanks, all

&

"Soya foods are a traditional part of the Japanese diet and the Japanese show better health and longevity than most Western countries."

all those japanese can't be wrong now can they?




This post was modified from its original form on 20 Mar, 0:31  [ send green star]  [ accepted]
 
Mercola and Soy March 20, 2007 6:37 AM

Hi,
It is very helpful to know a bit about the person before buying into what he or she says.  Mercola is "in bed with the Organic Pastures Dairy Company ( OPDC ) who is a HUGE supporter of the Weston A. Price Foundation (WAPF) who also gets HUGE support from independent cattle ranchers.   The WAPF paid Kayle Daniels to do a "study" on soy which, to no one's surprise ended up being anti-soy.  Can't offend those who pay your bill can you?  Mercola also strongly advocates the consumption of raw milk and raw eggs.  He also says that only animal products can provide absorbable B-12 and that fish is the only good source of Omega 3.    Do you, as a vegan follow these guidelines also knowing that he is wrong and that we can get adequate, absorbable B-12 from fortified foods and nutritional yeast and that flax, walnuts, canola oil, etc... provide us with more than enough Omega 3's?  I am assuming you do not or you would not call yourself a vegan.  So why are you buying into his myth on soy? 

Dr. Reed Mangels, Ph.D., R.D.  is a world registered dietician.  Her many, many articles on nutrition are listened to in both vegan and omni circles.  Here's what she wrote back to me when I asked her about Mercola: 

Generally I've found the information on Mercola's website to contain partial truths and to be misleading.  For example, in a section on vegetarianism, he says that it is a myth that vitamin B12 can be obtained from plant sources.  This is certainly true.  However, he goes on to say "The only reliable and absorbable sources of vitamin B12 are animal products, especially organ meats and eggs".  This is not true.  Vitamin B12 supplements and foods
fortified with vitamin B12 contain reliable and absorbable sources of vitamin B12.

Similarly, he says that it is a myth that the body can convert omega 6 fatty acids into omega 3 fatty acids.  He is correct.  Omega 3 fatty acids are made from other omega 3 fatty acids.  What Dr. Mercola neglects to mention
is that there are omega 3 fatty acids in the vegetarian diet (from flaxseed, flaxseed oil, soy products, canola oil, etc) that can be used to make necessary omega 3 fatty acids...I've written an article for VJ [Vegetarian Journal published by the Vegetarian Resource Group] that looks at a number of myths about soy including some from Mercola's
website. http://www.vrg.org/journal/vj2003issue3/vj2003issue3hotline.htm

One last comment here; I have been eating soy products for 35 years now and have no adverse affects from them and am healthy as can be.   My children are 1o and have been vegan sice conception.  THere are no ill-effects they have experienced either and their omni pediatrician is as happy as can be with theri growth and development.
 [ send green star]  [ accepted]
 
lentil burgers April 03, 2007 7:01 PM

My favorite meaty sandwich is a lentil patty, you can take any assortment of lentils and veggies and mix in something to bind the foods , then patty them and pan fry , browning the edges,

delicious!


and in regards to soy

Ive started a soy is toxic group to go along with website

soy Toxicity Group

soyistoxic.com

Yuk has been my experience with soy and I am beginning to learn why



 [ send green star]  [ accepted]
 
Soy under attack April 04, 2007 10:26 AM

So, is it possible that the whole "soy is bad" debate is focusing, not on actually soy, but on chemically-processed, fractionated soy proteins and isolates?

"Food" manufacturers are using chemicals and other processes to separate out the protein from soy, and parsing out all the various elements of soy, and then using those products in "food" rather than using "natural" soy.

Add in the fact that MUCH of the soy used by "food" manufacturers is GMO soy, and it gets worse.

Many, many "soy" products from these "food" companies (owned, when you go upstream, by the mega-conglomerate corporations that don't give a rip about anything but the bottom line) don't actually contain what we think of as soy... that is, whole soybeans, or stuff made with whole soybeans.

A lot of "soymilks" aren't even that! they are a mixture of powdered soy proteins, water, preservatives, flavors, and vitamins.

I do believe that if people who THINK that they are using soy, and having a problem with it, were to actually use whole soy, naturally made soymilks, fresh, organic, whole soy tofu, etc., they MIGHT discover that they DON'T have a problem with soy!

(I used to have a serious, horrible reaction to "soy"... but, that was only when I used the "soy protein" that was an incredient in a couple of things, and when I tried a "soy protein flour" I got once, years ago. It took many years before I'd try soy again!)

Great source for soy information: http://www.notmilk.com/

 [ send green star]  [ accepted]
 
Milk does a body bad August 02, 2008 10:53 AM

As pointed out above, the source of this particular article turns out to be the milk industry. I believe that the seeds of doubt about soy are planted by scared cow torturers.

 [ send green star]  [ accepted]
 
anonymous Another scare tactic. August 03, 2008 1:55 AM

Typical industrial scum. They really are determined arent they? Theyll do whatever they can to persist with their lies. Doesnt matter how many new ways they try to decieve people, its too late for them we know the facts, its just a matter of time and awareness then theyre finished.

 [report anonymous abuse]  [ accepted]
 
 August 03, 2008 3:10 AM

IMO, soy is a health food, but in moderation. And not GM soy

 [ send green star]  [ accepted]
 
Soy Alert! August 04, 2008 1:38 AM

Soy Alert!
Health & Wellness  (tags: soy, danger, toxicity, health, vegan, vegetarian, humans, illness, food, disease, children, diet, nutrition, prevention, protection, risks, study, science, women )
- westonaprice.org
The Weston A. Price Foundation is a nonprofit, tax-exempt charity founded in 1999 to disseminate the research of nutrition pioneer Dr. Weston Price, whose studies of isolated nonindustrialized peoples established the parameters of human health and determ  [ send green star]  [ accepted]
 
 August 04, 2008 7:28 AM

i dunno, the price foundation seems a little wack to me...
http://www.westonaprice.org/mythstruths/mtvegetarianism.html

 [ send green star]  [ accepted]
 
 August 04, 2008 7:37 AM

from link above, price foundation's myths & truths about vegetarianism...

"
Agricultural animals have always made a major contribution to the welfare of human societies by providing food, shelter, fuel, fertilizer and other products and services. They are a renewable resource, and utilize another renewable resource, plants, to produce these products and services. In addition, the manure produced by the animals helps improve soil fertility and, thus, aids the plants. In some developing countries the manure cannot be utilized as a fertilizer but is dried as a source of fuel."  [ send green star]  [ accepted]
 
 August 04, 2008 9:45 AM

and this...

Along with the unjustified and unscientific saturated fat and cholesterol scares of the past several decades has come the notion that vegetarianism is a healthier dietary option for people.[...] As we shall see, many of the vegetarian claims cannot be substantiated and some are simply false and dangerous.


I wouldn't trust the above source Pel,
to tell me what's good and what's bad.



This post was modified from its original form on 04 Aug, 9:45  [ send green star]  [ accepted]
 
 August 04, 2008 7:10 PM

How do you know if you're buying GM soy or not?

 [ send green star]  [ accepted]
 
anonymous  August 04, 2008 8:29 PM

Now you all are letting it get to you.

 [report anonymous abuse]  [ accepted]
 
 August 05, 2008 2:19 AM

GM soy and all GM products are forbidden here in Finland. I'd not eat any of those. It seems to me that these people opposed to soy have their own agenda...

 [ send green star]  [ accepted]
 
 August 05, 2008 6:19 AM

"Agricultural animals have always made a major contribution to the welfare of human societies by providing food, shelter, fuel, fertilizer and other products and services. They are a renewable resource, and utilize another renewable resource, plants, to produce these products and services. In addition, the manure produced by the animals helps improve soil fertility and, thus, aids the plants. In some developing countries the manure cannot be utilized as a fertilizer but is dried as a source of fuel."

Well hippie, reading this, there is nothing i see that is not true: non humans are nothing but mere means to human ends, aren't they? & this website is not an animal rights website

now foxy, i don't see why some texts should not considered as true, even if most are not. i mean, in every website full of info, there can be many correct ones, yet some false, & the contrary also. One perfect example is mercola's website! Yet, he gives some pretty good info soy but also some health issues.
Like for everything, there are things to be taken & others to be junked, & humans have this possibility.
Now it is up to us to experience things to validate or not them
This website uses many articles based on test made, tests made on both humans & non humans. Because i agree with aaron comments about not trusting tests made on rats or other non humans as a guide for humans.
This group has many good articles against soy in its archieves. You might like to check them out.
Anyway, as mentionned in many articles & websites (even for the use of soy), except for soybeans sprouts, soy HAS to be cooked to be digested... ie it cannot be good raw, so... it is not good for humans unlike cheekpeas that can be eaten raw if they are soaked. Just my personnal experience, but if you can't eat it raw, then why eat it at all?

cissy, do you know the reasons that pushed the government to ban soy in your country??
 [ send green star]  [ accepted]
 
 August 05, 2008 9:23 AM

I am sorry Pel, but we disagree on the idea if you can't eat it raw, it's not good for you. Humans can eat raw eggs, does that make them good for human health? I don't think so.

 As for researches and such, I pay very close attention at the source of where news come from (who they are getting paid from, are they basing what they say on animal testing etc). When the same institution you are siting as being right about soy, states that you can't be healthy on a vegan diet, for me - they are discarded right away. They have some agenda, and that makes them propagandise against soy the same way they are propagandising on their site about REAL MILK, cod liver oil, how healthy beef is etc.

 

doesn't sound like a reliable source to me. Sorry.



This post was modified from its original form on 05 Aug, 9:25

This post was modified from its original form on 05 Aug, 9:26

This post was modified from its original form on 05 Aug, 9:26  [ send green star]  [ accepted]
 
 August 05, 2008 9:35 AM

Pelagus, SOY is not banned in my country, but all GM stuff is.

 [ send green star]  [ accepted]
 
 August 05, 2008 9:48 AM

"How do you know if you're buying GM soy or not?"

organically grown soy is not genetically modified
if the soy is nonorganic, then there is a good chance it is a gmo
unless the product specifically states "from non-gmo soy"
however there are issues about genetic pollution in almost all grain crops nowadays
many seed suppliers can no longer guarantee their nonorganic/non-gmo seeds as gmo free
the problem is also infiltrating organic agriculture especially in the midwest u.s.
where there is so much grain crops grown & higher risk of genetic drift...
btw, most high fructose corn syrup is now made from gm corn

 [ send green star]  [ accepted]
 
 August 05, 2008 10:00 AM

Cissy in Greece too! GM is banned.

anyway, while we talk about soy, you could listent to the veganfreaks podcast about the issue. It's funny.

Show 97: OMGWTFBBQ soy is evil!

Yes, there are more sensationalistic headlines in the news these days about the evils of soy, and we use some of our critical thinking skills to analyze why the studies aren’t necessarily what they seem on the surface.

Listen to this episode:

 [ send green star]  [ accepted]
 
 October 12, 2009 10:03 AM

well whatever all this says, i still eat soya products. it is still better than eating animal products. there are many other sources of non animal foods also. i love almond milk instead of soya milk.

there are many alternative meat products for those who want something to replace meat in thier diets. not all of them are Vegan but there are vegetrian.

i love the products by Wothington foods. most are canned so last forever on the pantry shelf.

Morning Star has some fantastic frozen alternatives. many have similiar textures and look like thier meat counterpart.

no alternative meat tastes like meat. it is a veg product. but many of them taste really good, and are great alternatives to meat.

i have many friends who eat my meals and never realize that they are eating alternative meats. even tofu is delicious once you learn how to cook with it. it is a great chicken replacement in recipes. it is great for replacing eggs in recipes. it is very versitle since it has no favor of its own, and obsorbs the favor of whatever sauce or spices you put on it. it is great mariated in your favorite sauce before cooking with it.

 [ send green star]  [ accepted]
 
  New Topic              Back To Topics Read Code of Conduct

 

This group:
Vegan
14065 Members

View All Topics
New Topic

Track Topic
Mail Preferences


Copyright © 2009 Care2.com, inc. and its licensors. All rights reserved