If you agree that our government, our electoral system, and our economy is broken please participate in this thread that will have only one rule:  Do not place blame.

Being able to identify, acknowledge, and discuss the cause of the breakage is essential to finding then rooting out the cause of it so that repairs or rebuilding, not bandaging, can begin.  But when the discussion of what has gone wrong in our country devolves to a blame game ultimately dividing the people and robbing them of the unity they must have to effect change, the fair maiden we all wish to protect - Liberty, and America - is whisked away right out from under our noses.

When it comes to blaming it doesn't matter who broke it as much as it matters how it got broken.  What is of greater importance is how to put it back together again and protect it from getting broken again.

In keeping with the core philosophies and principles of Liberty and Live and Let Live set out in our Constitution, in what ways do you see Americans being able to come together to take back or rebuild their government so that the government serves the people instead of the people serving the government while, again, holding to the principle of Live and Let Live, which put another way is Live free but Do No Harm.

It's not a question of 'can we' come together but rather 'how' are we going to come together - because we must come together like we all know Americans can do better than anyone when push comes to shove.  Right? 

Let's come together, right now.

1. Abolish political parties. They are not mentioned in the U S Constitution and are unnecessary. They concentrate power in two or more centers and encourage politicians to answer more to their party machines rather than the people they represent.

2. Outlaw lobbying in Congress. The only ones representatives should be listening to should be his own constituents who send him letters or e-mails that he reads. NEVER people outside his district or State who come to make offers to him!

3. Allow no bills to be passed that are longer than a certain number of pages (maybe ten or twenty). All bills must be read aloud in session before the entire body before the final voting.

That's all for now. I'm eager to hear others' ideas.

One thing that's been bothering me is non-local people getting very involved in local elections. The Al Franken/Norm Coleman election had "Hollywood" money coming in. I was watching Hannity the other night and he was heavily involved in "reporting" the Virginia and New Jersey races. These aren't national elections and should be decided more on the local level. Having said all that I don't know how one would fix it. There's a lot of money supplied to local candidates from the 2 parties.

There's a lot of money supplied to local candidates from the 2 parties. ~Dan

True, the 2(for one) parties are national players.  Maybe there shouldn't be a 'national' party pool of money used for state elections.  Maybe 'national' party committees should not be allowed to use funds to sponsor state candidates at all but only Presidential candidates.

Or maybe elections should be publicly funded, state and federal?  I like that idea better and getting the purchasing of candidates and elections out of our elections.

I understand your point and concern for outside influences effecting local elections, especially for state level offices, like Governor, but I also understand people outside one state taking issue and working for or against a candidate or incumbent running for a congressional seat in a different state when those office holders' votes end up effecting not just those people in their district or state but effecting federal policy and laws that applies to everyone nation-wide.

"1. Abolish political parties. They are not mentioned in the U S Constitution and are unnecessary. They concentrate power in two or more centers and encourage politicians to answer more to their party machines rather than the people they represent.

3. Allow no bills to be passed that are longer than a certain number of pages (maybe ten or twenty). All bills must be read aloud in session before the entire body before the final voting."

Dale,

I don't think it would ever happen; the parties have too much power now, but it might not be a bad idea. I think I read that in the early days our politicians would line up on one side of the room or the other depending on the particular issue, not the party they were in.

I really like your third point. These ridiculously long and convoluted bills seem to be unique to the federal government. I think bills in state legislatures are more on the order of a page or two. At least in my state a bill is focused and doesn't have a bunch of non-related things attached. These 30 pound stacks of paper our federal politicians come up with are way too big.

1. Abolish political parties. They are not mentioned in the U S Constitution and are unnecessary. They concentrate power in two or more centers and encourage politicians to answer more to their party machines rather than the people they represent.

2. Outlaw lobbying in Congress. The only ones representatives should be listening to should be his own constituents who send him letters or e-mails that he reads. NEVER people outside his district or State who come to make offers to him!

3. Allow no bills to be passed that are longer than a certain number of pages (maybe ten or twenty). All bills must be read aloud in session before the entire body before the final voting.

Dale:  All three of these are excellent ideas.

I would add, create a ceiling on campaign finances. 

Allow a certain amount of televised advertising, equal time for all candidates to a specific office. 

In Iowa I am told it takes over ten million dollars to run for a state representative office.  This is ludricous, as stated above, the elected officials should be held accountable to the people, not to the special interest that can raise finances for them.

I'm new here but I hope you appreciate a little humor for a most serious subject.  I am a risk taker so here goes:

The Fix

There recently was an article in the  St. Petersburg Fl. Times. The Business Section asked readers for ideas on:  "How Would You Fix the Economy?" I think this guy nailed it!
  _____

Dear Mr. President,

Please find below my suggestion for fixing America's economy.  Instead of giving billions of dollars to companies that will squander the money on lavish parties and unearned bonuses, use the following plan.
You can call it the

"Patriotic Retirement Plan":


There are about 40 million people over 50 in the work force. Pay them $1 million apiece severance for early retirement with the following stipulations:

1) They MUST retire.
Forty million job openings - Unemployment fixed.

2) They MUST buy
a new American CAR.
Forty million cars ordered –
Auto Industry fixed.

3) They MUST either buy
a house or pay off their mortgage – Housing Crisis fixed.

It can't get any easier than that!


P..S. If more money is needed, have all members in Congress pay their taxes....

Mr. President, while you're at it, make Congress retire on
Social Security and Medicare. I'll bet both programs would be fixed pronto!

The last line was definitely funny.

thanks

I have posted the article The Lawless State, by Karl Hess which I think is relative to this topic.  It's in a thread of it's own because it's not a quicky article.  I hope everyone will be able to take a few minutes to read it and finds it as interesting and enjoyable to read as I did.  I hope it will rekindle the mostly lost American spirit for others as it did for me. 

You'll find it  HERE

Abolish lobbyists.

Add the line item veto.

Insitute the Fair Tax.

- Term limits (3) and must win consecutive terms to qualify for pensions and benefits ... once u are out u r out! if u don't pay your taxes - u r not allowed to hold an office of any kind .... if u are under investigation for something u should be sidelined until it is over

- Abolish your federal reserve - America should be taking care of and accounting for its own tax money (sides it would really piss off the likes of George Soro's) .... Our government tax money is audited every year and though we are up to our ass in debt we know where most of the money is ....

- No Czar's ... they are undermining the elected officials that u the people sent to the hill - If the president needs counsel tell him/her to call mom ....

- fair tax .... I really like that system but either way you cannot continue to have 49% of your population in America paying no tax - leaves 51% to carry the burden and that is a ridiculous idea ....

.... When elections are run in Canada and CBC interviews someone who is running for office - they are obligated by law here in Canada to give equal opportunity to the opposition .... You need that in America  

.... limits on campaign spending is good as is a limit to be spent on the inaguration - it is not a coronation ....

.... no more pork .... huge amounts of money in America have been wasted on absolute crap .... all it is is vote buying

.... candidates for President should be openly and properly vetted and all records made available to the public .... If there is something to hide they do not belong in your White House - Congress or Senate

.... Have Canadians over see all your elections ---- and u handle ours .... only let retired people do it though because I am thinking of returning to work .....

Boycott stupid rich people (like Hollywood stars) who use their status to influence the hearts and minds of people when an election is going on .... Americans are smart - let them make up their own minds .... When they do open their mouths find them a million dollars a word and use that to put in a fund assist with the cost of your personal health care bills ....

Most of all as Americans, no matter what line you stand on LISTEN AND HEAR AND CONSIDER what you say to each other and how you say it (I need to take this advise as well) .... You live in a Republic so guard it well ....

You are an amazing country that the whole world is jealous of because of your love for your country. When times get tough around the world Americans get going ..... I am going to post something some of you may have already read - it was written by a Canadian writer I admire a great deal and says it all about you, the American people and your country ..... I hope you like it ....

America: The Good Neighbor
=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=

The following excerpts, from a Canadian newspaper, is worth sharing..."America: The Good Neighbor". Widespread but only partial news coverage was given to a remarkable editorial broadcast from Toronto by *Gordon Sinclair, a Canadian television commentator. Although presented on his radio show in 1973, Mr. Sinclair's message most certainly touches the hearts and lives of many Americans and their allies today, after the senseless loss of innocent lives on Sept. 11, 2001...

This Canadian thinks it is time to speak up for the Americans as the most generous and possibly the least appreciated people on all the earth. Germany, Japan and, to a lesser extent, Britain and Italy were lifted out of the debris of war by the Americans who poured in billions of dollars and forgave other billions in debts. None of these countries is today paying even the interest on its remaining debts to the United States.

When the franc was in danger of collapsing in 1956, it was the Americans who propped it up, and their reward was to be insulted and swindled on the streets of Paris. I was there....I saw it!

When earthquakes hit distant cities, it is the United States that hurries in to help. This spring, 59 American communities were flattened by tornadoes. Nobody helped.

The Marshall Plan and the Truman Policy pumped billions of dollars into discouraged countries. Now newspapers in those countries are writing about the decadent, war-mongering Americans.

I'd like to see just one of those countries that is gloating over the erosion of the United States dollar build its own airplanes. Does any other country in the world have a plane to equal the Boeing Jumbo Jet, the Lockheed Tri-Star, or the Douglas DC10? If so, why don't they fly them? Why do all the International lines except Russia fly American Planes? Why does no other land on earth even consider putting a man or woman on the moon?

You talk about Japanese technocracy, and you get radios. You talk about German technocracy, and you get automobiles. You talk about American technocracy, and you find men on the moon - not once, but several times - and safely home again.

You talk about scandals, and the Americans put theirs right in the store window for everybody to look at. Even their draft-dodgers are not pursued and hounded. They are here on our streets, and most of them, unless they are breaking Canadian laws, are getting American dollars from ma and pa at home to spend here.

When the railways of France, Germany and India were breaking down through age, it was the Americans who rebuilt them. When the Pennsylvania Railroad and the New York Central went broke, nobody loaned them an old caboose. Both are still broke.

I can name you 5000 times when the Americans raced to the help of other people in trouble. Can you name me even one time when someone else raced to the Americans in trouble? I don't think there was outside help even during the San Francisco earthquake.

Our neighbors have faced it alone, and I'm one Canadian who is damned tired of hearing them get kicked around. They will come out of this thing with their flag high. And when they do, they are entitled to thumb their nose at the lands that are gloating over their present troubles. I hope Canada is not one of those....

Stand proud, America!

I am really tired and just wanted to check in and say hello to everyone.  I have briefly read some of the above posts and what I'd like to add is that I think to fix the overall picture for all of us, that we need to fix ourselves as well.  The American people need to once again have a mutual respect for sameness and differences amongst us.  Judgement of each other needs to be left at the door.  Conversations and sharing of ideas need to met with a desire to try to understand and compromise if necessary for the ultimate good of all.  I think once we fix ourselves than we can work as one to fix the bigger problem.

Don't know if that makes any sense, possibly just a ramble.

I should be back in full force after tomorrow.  I am holding out the greatest hope of hopes that it will bring a new day.  Take care all.

Northern, thank you for appreciating all that is wonderful about America and sharing that.  I know we are not perfect, but I love my country and have every faith that we are not the demons some make us to be.

oh and if the following story is true - remember that a hand up is a lot better than this kind of hand out .... RIDICULOUS!

Subject: Your tax dollars at work

I had a former employee call me earlier today inquiring about a job, and at the end of the conversation he gave me his phone number. I asked the former employee if this was a new cell phone number and he told me yes this was his “Obama phone.” I asked him what an “Obama phone” was and he went on to say that welfare recipients are now eligible to receive (1) a FREE new phone and (2) approx 70 minutes of FREE minutes every month. I was a little skeptical so I Googled it and low and behold he was telling the truth. TAX PAYER MONEY IS BEING REDISTRIBUTED TO WELFARE RECIPIENTS FOR FREE CELL PHONES. This program was started earlier this year. Enough is enough. The very foundations that this country was built on are being shaken. The age old concepts of God, family, and hard work have flown out the window. You can click on the link below to read more about the “Obama phone”…just have a barf bag ready.

Concerned & patriotic American

https://www.safelinkwireless.com/EnrollmentPublic/home.aspx

Is blood shooting out of your eyes yet?

Northern...I might have to call your wife on you again.....TAKE A BREATH 

This post was modified from its original form on 02 Nov, 18:35

awwww ...

Not to completely derail this thread from it's topic, but I wanted to address the "free cell phones for welfare recipients" claim made by yet another inflamatory email forward in circulation that is a lie:

ANALYSIS:

Is there a U.S. government program that provides free or discounted phones and wireless service to low-income Americans?

Yes. It consists of two parts: "Link-Up," which helps income-eligible people set up new home phone service, and "Lifeline," which helps income-eligible people pay their monthly phone charges. (Source: FCC)

Was this program instituted by the Obama administration?

No. Nor was it just instituted "earlier this year," as the email claims. The program was created over a decade ago by an act of Congress, the Telecommunications Act of 1996. (Source: Lifelinesupport.org)

Does the program offer every welfare recipient a free phone and 70 minutes of wireless service?

Not necessarily. The specific benefits vary according to locale and service provider. Examples: Safelink Wireless | ATT Lifeline and Link-Up | Verizon Low Income Programs. (Source: FCC)

Is it accurate to say that taxpayer money is being 'redistributed' to provide these services?

Basically yes, though not in the sense one might assume. Apart from being administered by the FCC, it's not a federally-funded program. Since its inception, the program has been financed via the pooled contributions of commercial phone service providers, which in turn impose small monthly fees on their regular customers to recoup the cost. (Source: FCC)

So, it was Clinton's Congress in 1996 that passed this 'act.'  What is accurate is that this program is yet another of the zillions of ways Americans are "taxed," but to call it an "Obama phone" for "welfare recipients" is nothing but a flat out purposeful lie to further inflame those who already oppose (hate) President Obama. 

Who has time to sit around and dream this shyt up?  Sure, take issue with the the feds finding yet another way to chip away at every dollar we earn, that is a valid argument, but the lying? 

How is that supposed to unite the divided?

Thank you, Katii, for stating the truth!

Personally, I am tired of the broadside of lies - absolute lies and accusations - that accompany any discussion where Barack Obama's name comes up.

Katii, you have attempted quite clearly - and productively! - to have a thread that asks members to contrubute their opinions of HOW TO FIX what is broken - and you stated quite clearly, WITHOUT BLAME.

Those were the "rules" you set out for the thread.

I suggest and I ask - I plead with members - to read what Katii asked at the beginning of this thread - and please adhere to the "rules" Katii has set out in this discussion.  She wishes this to be a positive discussion - without blame! - and without diverting what she is trying to accomplish in this thread.

Please, everyone, let's not get side-tracked.  Let's please drop the political posturing and the political blaming.

Her question is: What do we need to do to fix it?  Without blame.

Rachel, thank you for the levity - that's always appreciated

40 million people over 50 in the work force. Pay them $1 million apiece

Sounds good but would cost $40 Trillion - that's about 4 times the national debt we already have.

make Congress retire on Social Security and Medicare. I'll bet both programs would be fixed pronto!

That is funny, but I think it's an excellent idea that I woud be first in line to support.

Thanks Katii, I thought perhaps I was out of line for I know how important this thread is to you.  Thanks for your kind words.  This is a fascinating thread.

Dale made 3 suggestions that I would support:

1. Abolish political parties.

2. Outlaw lobbying in Congress.

3. Allow no bills ... longer than a certain number of pages ... All bills must be read aloud in session.

I would add to Dale's list by requiring our representatives to show up for work every day, and requiring everyone be present for all debates.

I would particularly like a rule that requires every representative to vote on any and all legislation - no obtains, only YEAH or NEY.  If they are unable to be there in person due to health reasons then they can vote by proxy, but either EVERYONE votes or there's no vote.

I'm not sure I support "Comittees" either, but I know I don't support a 'comittee' or panel being able to stall or kill a bill before it's heard on the floor. 

I would like to see a system where all bills have to pass a Constitutional & Bill of Rights vetting process before it goes anywhere.

No more unrelated "add-ons" to existing bills, such as happened recently when a hate crimes law was attached to a 'certain to pass' budget for the Pentagon.

Thank you, Rachel.  I don't know how fascinating it is but I hope it's a good exercise in unity and recognizing or remembering the importance of Liberty when it comes to governance.

I would love to hear if anyone thinks any of the suggestions put forth here are things that would cause (or perpetuate) a divide among the people if they were implemented.  And if so, how we could come to a workable solution that doesn't  offend or undermine our unity as Americans - or Liberty.

Dear Katii,

Apologies for not contributing to this thread - yet - but I hope I'll have the time and energy later today to say a few words.

See you then..

I support Dale's three rules. In addition I've always thought that there should be a time limit for each law that is passed. After a certain period of time...the law should expire...unless enough legislaters consider it important enough to pass again. This would cause people to look at each law and decide if it was currently relevant. It would eliminate laws which have no purpose in present society. This would also keep Congress busy enough so they didn't have as much time to spend on corporate projects.

Eliminating one house of Congress could also be a way to reduce the deficit. Having two houses of Congress makes it take twice as long to get any meaningful legislation passed. I would pick the Senate to close down. The Senators seem to be allied more closely with the large corporations. The House of Representatives appears to be closer to the people they represent. I would also give the people the means to remove legislaters who refuse to follow the wishes of their constituants.

All funding for elections should be provided by the government. There should be a reasonable limit on the money spent and each candidate should be provided will free television time. All time provided should be equal for all candidates.

I also applaud Rachels idea on Congress retiring on Social Security just like the rest of us. after all, we're all created equal....aren't we?

And how about a rule where they have to READ the bill before they vote on it.

Back in the 70s, they were already "borrowing" from social security and about the time I had my first job, we were being told that there wouldn't be any for my generation. 

SO, people back then had pensions.  They also started IRAs shortly after that.  My father also contributed extra money to something that was the pre-cursor of the 401 K.  I was raised with the idea that I better be saving for my own retirement.

Point being,  Most people did (and still do) have  other retirements other than social security.  As for Congress, I admit that I don't know.  But federal employess (I was one for a brief period of time) get a TSP (Thrift Savings Program- similar to a 401 K or 403 B).  Why shouldn't they?  They would get that working for a company?  Same with health inusrance BTW.  I had fedblue and it was NOT the best insurance I ever had.

Now I know that the President gets special retirement after he/she is no longer president.  I don't know about Congress.  But at the very least, they are entitled to the same type of health insurance and retirement programs that they would get working for a company.

But at the very least, they are entitled to the same type of health insurance and retirement programs that they would get working for a company.~Nancy

Which today are in near non-existance.

Now I know that the President gets special retirement after he/she is no longer president.  I don't know about Congress. ~Nancy

The President gets $180,000/year - for life - as a pension.

The President and the Vice President are also provided money to "facilitate transition to private life." The 2005 fiscal budget requested (and got) $7.7 Million for transition expenses.

For a full accounting of Presidential benefits go HERE

Congressional retirement benefits are not as straight forward, but as of Oct. 2006 270 retired representatives were recieving $60,000+ per year.  Go HERE to read all about it.

You can get a good overview of their mostly tax-payer funded health insurance HERE

"Which today are in near non-existance."  Katii

For many people yes, but I have both medical insruance as well as a retirement plan that my job contributes to.

And I think for the kinds of jobs that these Congress people would go to, yes, they would get those benefits.

And what about term limits?

Congressional benefits ( retirement and pension ) are tied to the amount of time they can remain in office. One reason they avoid passing term limits, and how many times have you seen that if a congressman dies while in office, a spouse or son is appointed to finish a term in office?

In my own local congressional district, when our representative was under a cloud and being investigated, he was able to resign from congress and have his son take over with all of his political connections. This son being so stupid that he failed in all the other businesses his father set him up in. That was about ten years ago and he is still being reelected year after year because our constiuents love the pork he brings home. No one else sees the handover of power being wrong...I'm sure they would judge it wrong if they saw it happen in a neighboring district! How do you influence selfish thinking like that?

You serve 1 term in congress (6 years senate, 2 years house) and you get a pension, even if defeated in the next election.  

I don't know nor could find information about how many employees enjoy an retirement plan contributed to by their employer, but to the point of tax-payer funded retirement for representatives in Congress, what civilian wage earner is going to enjoy $60K per year in retirement?

Which reminds me, I think the feds taxing S.S. benefits, as puny as they are, is just so W R O N G.  I would do away with that.

Beverly, you've added some good ideas.

I've put some thought to eliminating the Senate myself - it seems it's purpose is be where legislation for the people goes to die.  And as I suggested earlier I agree that publicly funded elections is the best way to go if we're to keep them free of big business interest influence.

I have also advocated for, as Northern suggested, equal air-time for all qualified candidates.

"

I don't know nor could find information about how many employees enjoy an retirement plan contributed to by their employer, but to the point of tax-payer funded retirement for representatives in Congress, what civilian wage earner is going to enjoy $60K per year in retirement?

Which reminds me, I think the feds taxing S.S. benefits, as puny as they are, is just so W R O N G.  I would do away with that."

on your first point,  I agree that they should have to rely on what they save in their TSP.

on your second point- ABSOLUTELY!

HOw about get rid of all television ads for any and all politicians.  No more idiot sounds bites.

I appoligize for the 'Obama phone" reference - my intention is again to point out that programs like that - no matter who brought them in - are programs that are not being utitlized in the manner in which they were intended .... that is what happens when there are good intentions behind something and someone finds a way to circumvent the idea of the program.

It is an unfortunate result of many government run programs and we have more than our share of them here in Canada .... Give a free phone for emergency purposes to my mother because she is elderly and cannot afford one (plus many other reasons) is a good thing - but to allow the unemployed to run around with one is INSANITY! Use someone else's number if you don't have a telephone to find out whether you get the job or not. I did when I was in that predicament many years ago. If you can't figure that much out for yourself I don't know if I as an employer would want you working for me. Hand up - not hand out.

Our government needs to tighten up programs that are being abused and in some cases get rid of them. It would save both our countries tons of money! But again we need politicians in office who are willing to do the work to weed all the "pork" out of our programs.

I have a friend I knew in local politics here in Delta. She was just elected to a seat in the Parliament here as an independent and beat out a heavy hitting liberal (senior moment but he was our legal eagle in BC) ..... Viki ran as an independant and it was the first time in forever that an independant ran and won. I sent this story to her. I also sent information about Acorn to her as they are trying to make international inroads and are establishing bases here in Canada under a new name. They are corrupt and I do not want them here. She is the watchman for those of us who beleive that politicians work for us - and she believes in service .... Very humble lady, very strong voice and though she is a 'gang of one' they cannot shut her up and the news here pays attention to her because as the voice of one - she speaks for us!

So the point is you change things by becoming aware of what is wrong and then look for individuals who share your concerns and then work with them - and it grows .... like a pebble thrown into water - it grows when you become part of the solution - pull your head out of the sand, stop the blame game and take action .... 

Dear Northern,

No apology asked or needed!

It's only a request to focus on what Katii asked.

Your concerns and your posts, Northern, are always welcome here.  This request just means your posts will get better exposure and response, sometimes, in certain threads.  So let's explore your concerns about that in a better place; a better thread.

I'm glad to see your recommendations on how to improve and "fix" government - and I hope others, too, are considering what you are saying.

Thanks, Northern!

programs that are not being utitlized in the manner in which they were intended ~Northern

Northern, any public assistance program being used in a way unintended, which  happens in all public assistance programs, is wrong wrong wrong.  I haven't checked into the quaifications for this program; if you have can you tell us in what way is the phone assistance program not being used as it's intended? 

I am sure that the intention was to help unemployed people with no phone have greater access to job interveiws, etc. 

From what I read above, there are a certain number of minutes given for free.  That would help with things like Phone Interviews.

But yes Northern and Katii, I am sure they get used for other things.

I think the program is a fine idea but I'd rather see the providers of it be charitable and pay for it themselves with recycled phones and minutes that cost them next to nothing to begin with instead of passing the cost (which undoubtedly is 'cost plus') onto the consumer or tax-payer.

Well, it started in 1996 so I am guessing that it may not be cell phones.  Maybe now it is. 

I do like the program and didn't mean to imply otherwise.  (in case I did)

Nancy, I took it that you thought it was a good program.  I was agreeing with you.

Hell, if the phones are just to have a 'lifeline' it's a good program.  I would not feel secure at home without a telephone to call for help in case of an emergency

It's funny how we come to depend upon technology.  It starts out as a convenience then sooner or later it becomes a necessity because communities become to 'officially' reliant  upon it for survival.  We've gone from 'sounding the alarm' and the town comes running with buckets of water to put out a fire to needing a telephone to dial 911 that registers our name and address at the other end.

To Robert T.

Yes, it is true that you receive a pension from Congress after serving five years...but the large, exorbitant pensions go to the Congressmen who manage to spend their entire career there. The amount of their pension is tied to years served.

Correction only:

In my initial posting here I mentioned it took ten million to run for the state house.  It is one million, I still find that to be ludricous. 

Good discussion on term limits and pensions, it gives me something to think about while putting up insulation in the basement. 

Have a good day. Kati, great thread.

"Yes, it is true that you receive a pension from Congress after serving five years"  Beverly

And most corporations give you full vesting of your retirement account after five years.

If you spend your life in congress, then why wouldn't you be entitled to the same type of retirement that the federal employees have.  (At the very least)

Revolving Door:  Most of the payoffs for the DC Political elites comes not from campaign contributions, but from fat jobs in Corporations after they leave.  This must stop.  Every person working for the Federal Government would be required to sign a contract saying they will not take a job in an industry that they were involved in procurement or legislation.  For 10 years.  Same pledge for Spouse or anyone living in the same household. 

Disclosure:  Anyone testifying before congress on an issue would be required to file a conflicts in interest statement.  This would be employment, stock ownership and financial affiliations.  For the entire households. I am a little uncomfortable with this one.......I'm sure these suggestions can be better stated.  These are off the top of my head.

Excellent recommendations, Jim.  Thank you.

If you spend your life in congress, then why wouldn't you be entitled to the same type of retirement that the federal employees have.  (At the very least) ~Nancy

That's a good question.  But I don't think representatives should be allowed to make a 'career' out of being an elected official - especially if the tax-payer, who by and large doesn't have access to the same kind of benefits for themselves, is expected to pay for their pensions.  I don't even think they deserve their $200k salaries - they sure don't earn them!

It just doesn't seem right for tax-payers to be burdened with paying for elected public servant lifetime benefits. 

Federal employees?  Well, it's a unique situation because it's not like the tax-payer isn't the 'employer.'  First, if I had my way the number of Fed. employees would shrink considerably and shrink the tax-payers obligations considerably, but since they don't work for pivate for enterprises I think they should have to pay to play in the same manner tax-payers do.

We need congressional term limits:  One salaried term with medical insurace paid for in the same manner tax-payers pay for it, and social security - unless tax payers get to enjoy the same benefits opportunities.

You serve 1 term in congress (6 years senate, 2 years house) and you get a pension, even if defeated in the next election. 

Jim, I think those are some really good recommendations too, with the exception of the campaign funding breakdown. 

I am all for public financing of elections but I wouldn't want to see any 'party' being favored in any way based on anything.  I think that would only serve to allow the D/RNC to continue the monopoly they already have in our elections and government.  I think I'd prefer a system that made 'parties' insignificant, preferably making them obsolete.

You serve 1 term in congress (6 years senate, 2 years house) and you get a pension, even if defeated in the next election.

What kind of pension?  Who works for two years and gets a lifetime pension for it? Sure, let them contribute to their pension and let them take it with them when they leave but tax-payers can't afford to pension the number of 'retired' representatives under a term limits rule - the number of them would explode.

Maybe it would be better to let all tax-payers keep that portion of their dollars that pay for those pensions to help plan for their own pensions.

"It just doesn't seem right for tax-payers to be burdened with paying for elected public servant lifetime benefits. "  Katii

I do agree with that.  But some have made a whole career out of it.  It should be like anyother job, IMHO.  I want good people in Congress and they should be treated the same as they would if they were working at a corporation.  They should get fedblue healthcare, if that is what federal employees get.  And they should have access to that same TSP program with five year vesting. 

More than that?  maybe they do, but maybe they shouldn't.

Obama's greatest gift...light at the end of the tunnel. Of course, those of us already part of the elitist mainstream core need more greed, not more HOPE. I sort of like the shift in prioroties...perhaps we will become a community someday.
Next we must suffer economic disaster when China calls our debt to China due...to save the people and religion of Tibet; that will be the real test of Obama's, and our collective, strength and courage.
The only other thing I can think of is to take the profit motive out of private contracts for military and public 'goods and services' - sort of a mandatory patriotism for the capitalist pigs.
O, and while we're at it, how about a return to representative democracy...and a return to peace and freedom. Jack.

Sometimes blame is useful to identify and analyze reality. Why tap dance?

Jim, I see your point but I'm of the belief that we'd be better off voting for individuals than a party's frontman/woman.  Political parties are like religions in that they become too big, powerful, and influencial thru the same mechanics that religions are able to get millions of people to follow them based on little more than lip service and faith.

That's great news I didn't know that there are more registered Independents than party followers - now if we could just get some courage and muscle behind the Independent spirit, like what is stated in the Declaration of Independence...

Congress was never meant to be a full time job! The original intent of the Founders was to have a Congress made up of people from different walks of life. By maintaining their professions,it was thought Representatives would be more in touch with their constituents and thus more likely to vote in their interests.

I wish those in Congress would follow the example of Ron Paul (an OB-GYN) who refuses his congressional pension and refused to allow his children to cash in on government benefits.

This is possible especially if we reduce the size of government!

People who make politics a 'lifetime' job ARE the biggest problem in America .... that is why I think term limits are something you must demand .... With all due respect when they start to think they own the job rather than are elected to serve the people it is time to get rid of them. Our senate here in Canada is a disgrace because all members are appointed and it always runs along party lines as vacancies come up .... lifetime appointments of all things so u either have to resign or die .... It is a joke here - I want the ability to elect our Senators but more than that I want to know exactly what is it they do here in Canada - maybe I will apply for the job as it appears they do not do much as they have no power ..... I also want our ties to the Royal Family gone (though I like them). We are Canada - not England and its costs us millions to maintain this facade here ....

What you the American people can do is bring yourselves together with what you agree upon - put all the differences in your political thinking aside and draw up a list of 'demands' that should be taken to your representatives over and over again - until you the people get what you want ....

A Good Idea! Except Canada is actually NOT sending out stimulous checks:

Sometime this year, we taxpayers may receive an Economic Stimulus payment.
This is a very exciting new program.  I will explain it using the Q and A format:

Q. What is an Economic Stimulus payment?
A.  It is money that the federal government will send to taxpayers to help stimulate the economy.

Q.  Where will the government get this money?
A.  From taxpayers.

Q.  So the government is giving me back my own money?
A.  Only a smidgen.

Q.  What is the purpose of this payment?
A.  The plan is that you will use the money to purchase a high-definition TV set, thus stimulating the economy.

Q.  But isn't that stimulating the economy of China?
A.  Shut up.

Below is some helpful advice on how to best help the Canadian economy by spending your stimulus check wisely:

*      If you spend the stimulus money at Wal-Mart, the money will go to China
*      If you spend it on gasoline, your money will go to the Arabs.
*      If you purchase a computer, it will go to India.
*      If you purchase fruit and vegetables, it will go to Mexico, Honduras and Guatemala.
*      If you buy a car, it will go to Japan or South Korea
*      If you purchase useless stuff, it will go to Taiwan.
*      If you pay your credit cards off, or buy stock, it will go to management bonuses and they will hide it offshore.

Instead, keep the money in Canada by:

                              1      spending it at yard sales, or
                              2      going to ball games, or
                              3      spending it on prostitutes, or
                              4      beer or
                              5      tattoos..

(These are the only Canadian owned businesses still operating in Canada.)

 I'm going to go to a ball game with a tattooed prostitute that I met at a yard sale and we're going to drink beer all day!

Well here is crazy thought, we could create a two-four year mandatory public service requirement in local, state or federal govt.  Perhaps we could create a better Union in this matter.

Anthony, with exceptions I might go for that - like, an exception one's service wouldn't necessarily have to be in 'government,' unless that includes all aspects of operating government - everything from maintenance of government facilities to legislating, and age appropriate. 

I think older children could start to pay off their service obligations early by volunteering for certian age appropriate jobs to fill their summers with.  I do not approve of this American idea that children are exempt from any social/civic responsibility.

The mandatory aspect I speak of would include everything from a page in the mayors office to garbage collection.  Individuals who wanted to, after mandatory service, could be considered for advancing towards elected position in govt, or carreer officials.  Of course age restrictions for office would still apply, a certain amount of maturaity is required, although we see little of it emminiently from Washington. 

For that matter, we could have a mandatory service for all 18-22 year olds.  Either in the gov. sector, military, foregin service, forestry and natural resources.  While I am agaisnt a draft, and many would call this a draft.  While I am agaisnt blind nationalism and many would see this as means to accomplish that goal. 

I would view this as an attempt to create a patriotic citizen and infuse within them a better understanding of their nation and respect for it. With an array of public service options to choose from, this would also be a way to help advance the educational system of our country.  After all, I think a 22 year old with four years of work experience is better able to decide what course of collegiate activity they would prefer to pursue.

Just some daydreaming thoughts here.