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Anonymous
9 years ago
but Latest Dna Research proves all human being migrated from the warmest continent of Arctic Age,Africa... was based on shamanist practising as Ancestor worship... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genealogical_DNA_test
Anonymous
!
9 years ago
but Latest Dna Research proves human being migrated from the warmest continent of Arctic Age,Africa was based on shamanist beliefs inspired as Ancestor worship... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genealogical_DNA_test
Anonymous
Sibirs,
9 years ago
As I know and They use the some symbols,bells,feathers (robs etc.).the Kams are generally very poor but very humble,chaste, people believes they Ascends to Sky when trancing. They have famous drums for dance that they decorates no other allowed to use it except it's owner , his parentscustom dismembers the drum soon as after the kam died, one can be a shaman by other Kam, inspiration, sometimes by epilepsy or by a protector spirit especially from the Ancestors, otherwise that can be very dangereos . Today their numbers remained only 650.000 by the help of Assimilation,Underestimating etc. those claims Shamaism superstatious, etc., . , Sibir people say American indians went America from There.
Anonymous
10 years ago
I think I would enjoy that school in Michigan...there would be much to learn about American Indian origins!
Anonymous
10 years ago
I enjoyed the post "Star People". I have enjoyed all of the posts very much.

I also liked the one with the interactive map. It would suggest my ancestors settled in Alabama/Florida and around that area.

As for what they teach in schools in my area, according to my niece and nephews, mainly who they learn a bit about are Inca, Mayan and not a whole lot about more recent American Natives. My niece has done much of her own research, thankfully.

I found this interesting:

"The mission of the Center for Native American Studies is to enrich the knowledge and understanding of the Aboriginal Indigenous people of North America from a Native American perspective."

"The mission of the center is to provide an academic setting where the view of Native American History, culture, and current issues can be viewed through multiple lenses."

http://www.nmu.edu/nativeamericans/webpage/mission.html


Anonymous
Cosmology
10 years ago
Agreed.  I was going to say that "if" we have to include "migration" as part of our cosmology, THEN I would say that the most logical belief for me is that our ancestors simply moved northward, rather than over some ice bridge.  It is also quite plausible that "if" migration was part of this cosmology, it could be that our ancestors came over to Turtle Island from canoes launched from islands in the Caribbean.....or....from the fabled Atlantis.  Oral traditions include many explanations for The People.
10 years ago

I also believe its a relection of what they could never obtain. So they create thier own theories.

If it don't make sense, they will make it make sense.

10 years ago
I believe my relatives have always been here because that is what our stories say. I believe alot of this is from people who are trying to assuage their guilt at what they have done to a whole race of people. JMHO!
Anonymous
Star People
10 years ago

I do not believe my ancestors came from this land bridge in Alaska.  I believe mine migrating NORTH from what is called "Latin America."  Some of my ancestors were also Vikings, so they came from that area.  (Yes, I am a blond Indian.  DeSoto found blonde/blue-eyed and redheaded Indians when he made his first contact with Cherokees in 1542.) 

My dad's DNA was tested and they HAVE isolated "markers" for NA genes.  DNA proof is legally submissible evidence in a court of law these days.  I called Washington, DC and spoke to an administrator in the Native Arts Commission.  He said this is legal proof of my NA blood. I am not a geneticist or a forensic scientist, so I do not know how this works, but I know it is proof for those who seem to need such things.   I know and have known who I am since I was born. 

Personally, it is my belief we (speaking only about Cherokees now) are Star People.  Call it "souls from heaven" or whatever you will, our souls come from what our ancestors called "The Seven Sisters," aka The Pleiads.  We are "spiritual beings having a human experience" is more than just a maxim to me.  It is a reality which filters through and in all that I think, say, and do.

To speak directly to the person asking about what is taught in schools today about Native Americans --- it varies greatly by locale.   In my area, starting from about 3rd grade, we discuss the people who were indigenous to the USA (Turtle Island) prior to European contact (conquest).  Going up in the grades is like going up in a timeline.   From Aztecs, Incas, Myans, etc. in the elementary levels, to Latin American aboriginals in the middle schools, all are discussed briefly, and it completely depends upon the comfort level of the teacher and their own perspective as to how these topics and People are studied.

I would agree with Jim W. about a wolf and dog having the same DNA markers (dogs came from wolves), however, although I am Wolf Clan, I am not a wolf or a dog, and markers have been isolated to identify NA blood.

With respect...

Hi Anna,
10 years ago

Case in point is the "discovery" of the oldest known mummy in North America. The mummy, named the Spirit Cave man, was found on the shelves of the Nevada State Museum. Discovered in Nevada in 1940 it was originally thought to be 2000 years old. Recent radiocarbon dating has pushed its age back to 9,400 years (7,400 BC).

The most intriguing facts is that the mummy was wearing moccasins and shrouds of woven marsh plants. The weave of the shrouds indicates that it was made on a loom. If these findings turn out to be true it would mean that there were people in North America more than 9,000 years ago with the knowledge and technology to weave cloths on looms. Such a level of sophistication again pushes back the dates of early civilization and should makes us question some long held assumptions about the primitiveness of ancient people. DNA and other tests are being undertaken.

http://www.activemind.com/Mysterious/Topics/Atlantis/oldest_mummy.html

http://www.cabrillo.edu/~crsmith/spiritman.html

http://www.cabrillo.edu/~crsmith/anth7_hist1.html

http://archure.net/liberty/liberty3.html

10 years ago
Hi Melissa, We aren't taught much about the history of Native Americans or the USA in Polish schools. Lessons focus on Europe. I remember that we were told about people travelling through continents, their ways of life or which peoples were hunters or farms or nomads. Then straight to colonialism, the genocide and white settlers dominance, African slavery, Boston incident, then the North-South War, America during the WWI and WWII. We had few lessons on South America being colonised. That's about it. We had more lessons on Africa and Asia probably due to European countries possessing colonies there. Pardon our ignorance... I asked these questions because I was wondering if NA history and legends in the USA are regarded similarly as Greek culture and mythology in Europe. We were taught about Athens and Sparta, and also about Rome and Carthage etc. as a basic history of Europe. And I didn't mean learning religion in school in a spiritual matter but rather as acknowledgment of facts - you know, if you are taught about Asia you have to know what Buddhism is. Thanks for answering, Melissa!
Hi, Anna
10 years ago

How are you?  It's seems like it's been a hundred years since my school days...but, I remember learning basic's in elementary school.  When I went to school we would stand at our desks, facing the flag and pledge allegiance to the United States of America. Those were the days when the government was paranoid about communism.

 The pledge went out with the Lord's Prayer by the 70's. At least in West Forest H.S. and I don't remember ever learning about religion in school, that was taught at home. But, in 7th grade my science teacher taught evolution. I imagine there are subtle differences in the schools through out the country. 

We learned a lot about the first settlements and Native Americans. We touched on all the better-known tribes and their basic customs. I remember being glad that I wasn't living during that time (but, who knows...maybe I was. I would have been NA, though. ) and found myself being angry with the way the Whites treated the Native American.

It seems that the saying, "The more things change, the more they stay the same." is true. Look at what's happening in the world today. The people of Iraq have done nothing wrong and they are being subjected to the atrocities of war, for control of 'black gold'. 

What kind of history did you learn about the Native American Indian, in your schools in Poland Anna? 

10 years ago
Hello, I have a question but I'm not sure if it belongs to this thread. How much of the ancient American continents' history is thought in primary and high schools? By ancient, I mean long before Europeans stated to settle on these continents. Are children taught about diversity of tribes, different ways of life, forms of communities, religious beliefs, various legends of world's creation, I don't know what else? Are these various theories of Native People's origin discussed in schools? If not, what year/century/event is the beginning of history lessons in schools? Thanks, Anna
Wow, Mitchell!
10 years ago

That link is great! I LOVE that interactive map...I had to write this first now, I'm going to go back and study it some more...I don't quite understand the part about landing in New Mexico then traveling to the north, though.  

Pre-Clovis
10 years ago

   It seems that science is beginning to accept the evidence supporting human live in the americas that pre-dates the 13500 years ago that has been taken as gospel for decades, by 2000 years or more. This evidence requires a re-think of present theories.

It may be that chopping firewood for the Elders is the quickest way to the truth!

Anyway,here's a link to a site that contains some interesting information; http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/stoneage/clovis.html

Hope this helps.

I always wonder about that too, Jim...
10 years ago

How can they trace ALL humans to one ancestral female??? I'd like to know how exactly that's done.   Would that be Eve?? Thanks for posting that SilverWolf...very interesting article.

I was reading about DNA earlier today, because of Jim or John Koda mentioning the lost Kennewick Man.

http://www.runestone.org/kmfact.html

http://www.common-place.org/vol-01/no-02/kennewick/index.shtml

Here is a link about how DNA tells the story...

http://www.ridgenet.net/~do_while/sage/v8i8n.htm

I thought that this little paragraph was particularly funny...

If mice and rats shared a common ancestor 12 to 24 million years ago, and man and ape made a similar split from a common primate ancestor only 5-10 million years ago, and evolutionary change was apparently faster in rodents than it was in primates, why are there more differences between a man and ape than there are between a rat and a mouse?

I can just picture the rat saying, "Now how could you ask that? Can you not see how much bigger and smarter I am than the mouse?"

                                          

Anonymous
DNA TEsting..accurate? Or Not
10 years ago

"""The study focused on mitochondrial DNA, genetic material that is passed maternally and found in every human cell. All humans can be traced via this specialized DNA to a single ancestral female who lived about 150,000 to 200,000 years ago, many scientists say. """

I have seen many similar "test" results.

My problem is this. If these same scientists can NOT tell the difference in wolves and dogs through dna testing, how then can they tell the difference or similarities in humans?

"""

Wolves and dogs each have 78 chromosomes arranged into 39 pairs. Wolves are physically different from dogs because they have a number of genes located on these chromosomes, coding for wolf characteristics, that dogs do not have. But which genes differentiate a wolf from a dog? How many are they and on which chromosomes are they located? Unfortunately, the answers to these questions are not currently known.""""

These answers do not exist for humans either. They do not exist because the technoligy to do these tests does not exist at this time. 

With Respect,

Jim

 

Anonymous
Melissa an Idea
10 years ago

I think petitions are ok, but I think there is a more effective way in some situations.

LOL A bit of the  felonious mind I must add.

I think if enough people would send direct emails to the  University, it just may clog up their email system...That would get their attention...

I suggest that everyone make not only a request of teh  group members, but ask your network friends and friend offriends to also send emails.

Send them to the president of the university his email is pres@jsucc.jsu.edu and his name is Bill Meehan.

I am sure that enough emails in his inbox will get his attention.

What Ya'll think?

Jim

Thank you Cougardawn, Mitchell and Windwalker...
10 years ago

Your responses are very much appreciated. Jim, if you know the head of management of that archeological summer camp to be dishonest then, I'll join Cougardawn in sending an email to object to his digging up and stealing Native American artifacts. Maybe you or Cougardawn could start a petition at the Care2 site so we can all sign and then send it via email? There are almost 800 members here. That can be an advantage to make a statement.

P.S. If you gave us all semi-temporary  N.A. Indian names it would look very official. Relax, I'm just kidding. I'll be more than happy to earn my name...but first we have to get some of the Nation back here in PA. And I already told Koda about this but, I'll tell you all here that I have a cousin who really wants to give his land back to the Original Owners. I thought that it was 125 acres...but he informed me that he has 164 acres. I realize that it might not be enough for doing a whole lot, it could be home to at least 20 families. How can this be done? It has lots of trees and some already cleared fields. There is even a small stream on it. 

Mitchell...I was thinking more along the lines of 'SisterCrazyHorse' because of the crazy horse that tried to get me off his back. I stuck like a burr to his back though, and he tried everything...headed straight toward a thicket of trees, (to knock me off with a low hanging branch) along a barbed-wire fence (to tear up my leg) then along the edge of a pond (He was hoping that I'd fall off his back into the cold water)...it was the fastest ride and the craziest ride that I've ever had.  Even crazier was the fact that I knew what his intentions were, so reacted appropriately and saved an emergency room visit.

~Love~Light~Laughter~

Anonymous
Why is it a bad thing.
10 years ago

"Why is that a bad thing? One of the women teaching the culture and customs is a Native American. I agree that digging up buriel grounds and sacred sites is wrong, but this is just a summer camp, to teach how to recognize artifacts."

First of all, in the  United States, just because someone calls themselves "Native" does not mean they are.

Digging artifacts is not just a hunt for curious objects. It is teh destruction and disturbance of the site.

Less that 20% percent of the Tribal sites that once existed in the  Southeast are still in existance today.

How can someone...anyone dig up artifacts and teach about the culture from teh artifacts alone? They can not!

TRhe culture is more than what remains in teh  ground. It is the language, the traditions, the spiritual beliefs. The artifacts are the evidence of  the existance of those things... remove the artifacts, and you remove the evidence.

I have seen many things in my short life. I have seen a time when I was thrown out of bars for being Indian....Then I saw a time when it  was  a fad to be Indian.

I have seen people send for book and tape lessons to learn to speak Cherokee, only to see those people get laughed at for trying to speak the  language to "talkers"...not because people were making fun of them...but because Cherokeee people have a great sense of humor and if it is funny...you can bet someone is going to laugh...LOL Me included. We are also capable of laughing at ourselves as well..

I suggest that if Archiologists really want to learn about Indians...they should move to a reservation and spend a year helping elders. You know...chopping wood, bringing watter, mowing grass...what ever is needed. If they do this, they will have earned a right to learn what they wish to learn.

What they seek is NOT a "God Given Right"...and all  teh  demands in the  world will not make it so..

Nor will their willingness to sidestep the traditional wayas and "Make things upas they go". So now you see the connection between this discussion and my previous post.

In order to learn "Tradition" it is essential to learn it from those who live it.

Many say that  Tradition is dead today. It is not...not even close. It is closely guarded as it has always been..That is why certain things are required, adn always have been. Therights of passage are not new....the problem is, that many people want tradition...they just want it in their own way.

Archiologists are no different.

Teaching a school from Artifacts. It is not a "school" It is a gimmic to get help to dig artifacts. They are looking for labor, nothing more or less, and they rae going to charge people $400.00 for t eh  privelege of being labor for an artifact dig.

The sites here in the Southeast are among some of the  oldest anywhere. And the  only Tradition being taught by those People are the ones started by Andrew Jackson the coward. Those traditions are...remove teh  Aboriginal People and then remove ALL traces of their existance. In that way, there will be no future claims to the land.

It should be noted that Andrew Jackson was impeached for his views on Indian Removal and  his disdain for the U.S. Supreme Courts ruling in Worcestor vs Georgia. He ignored the  ruling of Justice John Marshall and  did just as he pleased. He was indeed impeached, yet like Clinton was never removed from office.

I know these People who are running this Dig and Harry Holstien is one of teh largest artifact collectors in teh  United States. Including funiary objects that he has personally removed from more than one site.

He is a very sneaky little man. He is more interested in teh fame he can get than any information that may be achieved....

I am  still not sure how attending a "school" to study aretifacts can make anyone an Indian...I am still trying to get my simple mind wrapped around that one.

With Respect,

Jim

Anonymous
Can one make up a native name?
10 years ago

"I wish that I had a Native American name. I was born in America, I'm a native....would it be wrong if I made one up? "

My question is, " Can you make up a Native Name?"

When I recieved my name it was given to me  by a  Traditional Elder and done through ceremony. For myself I can not imagine of it being done any other way.

While people can and do call themselves what ever they choose to...is it really a Native Name? Not in the way I learned it isn't. In that way it would just be a nick name.

I won't post farther on this subject here. Because it is off topic of the discussion that needs to be focused on here.

I believe that the discussion is important enough to stay focused on it.

With Respect,

Jim

Native names
10 years ago

   Mellissa,I think you should choose a Native name if you want to.How about "Star lady" or something like that.Just a thought.

  Everyone, Not sure what I'd do if I found people digging around in the family buriel plot,but I'm sure I wouldn't like it.Actually,several cemeterys were moved here years ago to make room for a power dam but I was pretty young then and don't remember how they went about it.It seems to me that they should have to have permission from the most closely related people to even enter a burial area,and certainly to disturb anything.

    Thanks for the info on east facing graves.It goes along with some other traditions I'm aware of,but,like you said,traditional ways of communication need to be respected.Hope to meet you all some day.

      Love and light,

              Mitch.

10 years ago

Melissa, First let me thank you for the addy. You ask the following:

"Why is that a bad thing? One of the women teaching the culture and customs is a Native American. I agree that digging up buriel grounds and sacred sites is wrong, but this is just a summer camp, to teach how to recognize artifacts."

My reply: YES, It is a bad thing. It is one thing to teach people how to recognize artifacts. It is another when the artifacts used to teach with are excavated from Sacred Ground sor Burial Grounds. As far as this being"Just a summer camp" there are many ways to educate people. You say one of the teachers is a Native American woman. She, of all people should have respect for that which is sacred and desire to teach people in a "good way." 

In Love and Light,

Cougar

CougarDawn...
10 years ago

The e-mail address was on the registrations page.

fieldschool@jsucc.jsu.edu

Why is that a bad thing? One of the women teaching the culture and customs is a Native American. I agree that digging up buriel grounds and sacred sites is wrong, but this is just a summer camp, to teach how to recognize artifacts.

Here is an interesting link...I don't know about factual.

http://www.thewildrose.net/pleiades.html

Mitchell...I think that the stars DO have something to do with being buried with the grave facing East...that's where the Sun will rise. The other planets do influence the Earth...just as the Moon does with the gravitational effects. Our tides. Maybe the alignments and conjunctions don't influence anything...but, I love astrology even if it is a bunch of hooey. I believe in everything except WAR.

I wish that I had a Native American name. I was born in America, I'm a native....would it be wrong if I made one up?

No, not CrazyButtHead either.

10 years ago

Canada is home for the Blackfoot

It's Snown'100%Canadian

hmmmmm
10 years ago

Jim, I purged my cookies and temp internet cache. That seemed to do the trick. Thank you and I will be contacting them to express my feelings on this matter. i am going to write a letter to send snaiol mail as I am having trouble locating a direct e-mail to whoever is in charge.

In Love and Light,

Cougar

Anonymous
Try this one
10 years ago

Try this one, it is the  one I wanted everyone to see any way.

http://www.jsu.edu/depart/epic/archcamp/index.html

Thanks for letting me know...

Jim

Anonymous
hmmm
10 years ago

not sure what teh  problem is, I just clicked it and it worked... try refreshing t he page...perhaps that will do it...Once in a while I dump my cookies that will almost always wor...though lots of people don't like to do that...LOL It works for me cause I never allow autofill.

If that does not work, I am not sure what to say.

You might try right clicking and open it in a new page...Sometimes that will work too...

Sorry you had problems,

Jim

RE: I will say this though...
10 years ago

Jim, I tried to get to the site by your link however it wouldn't work *frowns* Do you have another link to that site so that I may check it out and voice my opinion on the matter? I feel as you do. It is highly upsetting and should be stopped.

In Love and LIght,

Cougar

Anonymous
I will say this though...
10 years ago

For those who may not understand my anger at Archiologists, please visit this link. You will find that many things are done in the NAME of Indians which may or may not be with the Indians approval.

I will say this, I can not see myself approving of any such program.

http://fieldschool.jsu.edu

To me the gist of it is that for $400 you can dig artifacts and "BE" an Indian.

Please feel free to email their President and tell him to take the picks and shovels away from the Archiology dept.

One of the reasons they dig so freely here is because they make up the history as they go along.

The term Creek Indians was used originally to refer to any people living near streams, rivers or tributaries.

Not until teh 1800's did it become used to Identify teh Musckogee People. It should be noted that teh Musckogees began their migration from the Red River Region around the 12th Century.

At any rate, this is what we deal with here adn I am  sure others deal with it in their areas as well..

With Respect,

Jim

Anonymous
many answers to a simple question.
10 years ago

"I think it may have something to do with Venus rising before the sun and at time rising in conjunction with Mercury just before dawn.Just a thought.Anyway,it's certainly an interesting topic. "

Actually I suspect that many Nations would share the same exerience if that were true. Though is some way it may indeed have a bearing.

Burial Sitting facing the  East it is said by most Traditionals that I have spoken to indicates the direction of our origin. Of course over the years I have asked many questions that I never got answered.

Once I asked an Old Man where we came from. He looked up at teh sky..I asked him what he was looking at. He just said, "The Dog Star".. I did not take it to mean he was saying we came from the Dog Star. And indeed he was not. He was comtemplating my question.

For an hour by a fire he explained what he thought  to me.

I do know this much, burial is ceremonial. Everything pertaining to it is sacred.

I also know that the direction on teh sacred circle is important and that it is connected. More on that I will not expound on. Those things move to teh Spiritual levels. Those things should be spoken in person through oral Tradition. I realized after I had made my post that I may have said too much. I hoped that it would go unnoticed...LOL well observant readers always catch those slips.

I am just a man, so I know so little. But if you ever find the time to visit those who live in the traditional areas of the Cherokee in  N.C. or Oklahoma where my family is from, if you ask them those questions, I am sure they will answer them for you if you ask in a way that is respectful.

LOL one word to teh wise...never expect a speedy answer...it could take a couple of days.

As for how many are burried, I am not sure if you ment at Moundville or in the southeast... if you mean Moundville...thousands...if you mean southeast, then thousands more. LOL Not real informative I know, but the best I can do. Since all have never been found in either place.

With Respect

Jim

Healthy scepticism.
10 years ago
  I applaud Jim and Coda's healthy scepticism concerning archeolical theorys.It would seem that evidence that doesn't agree with the popular theorys has a tendency to get lost or swept under the rug,and I seem to recall a site found around the great lakes here in Canada that pre-dated the time of the migration theory.It's funny how little was made of that. As long as we start with theorys,accept evidence that supports those theorys and reject evidence that doesn't,we're bound to convince ourselves that we were right all along,but that's not the way to find truth.It would be better to gather all the evidence first and let the evidence suggest the theory,but human nature being what it is,that's not likely to happen.Anyway,it's certainly a fascinating subject.I'm still waiting for Jim to explain why folks are buried facing east,although I think it may have something to do with Venus rising before the sun and at time rising in conjunction with Mercury just before dawn.Just a thought.Anyway,it's certainly an interesting topic.
10 years ago

Hello, I don't post here often.  I enjoy reading and learning.  I do have a tiny thought about this thread however.

I am Lenape.  I wasn't raised traditionally and really within the last 10 years or so have tried to research about my Tribe.  I do recall reading the Wallam Ollum, which by Lenape writtings say we did cross the Berring Straight.  But of course as many writtings are, there is much controversy regarding its translations.

I would like to say though, it has always been my thinking that if we were able to trace back our lineage ALL the way back that most people would be surprised what is actually in their heritage.  Is there really ANYONE who can trace back their heritage to truthfully know where and when?  I think you can only go back so far as records have been kept or knowledge passed from generation to generation.

This is my motto:  One World, One Race Human. (at least until other worlds and species are made known )

LOL, You had me laughing...
10 years ago

And I said at the start that it was a childish map! Most likely designed to show George Bush where Texas is located!

I just wanted to show MY reason for thinking and that's why I used that map. The Australian theory doesn't make as much sense to me although, I'm sure that the possibility is there...for the ocean currents to have brought a few natives over from Australia. But, Chief Runningfox makes sense when he stated that the road goes both ways...Native Americans could have very easily traveled or drifted to other locations and planted seeds/DNA. And for those of you who think that we oozed out of a swamp...there are swamps everywhere to have oozed out of...the creationism theory, I don't quite believe, but I don't believe we evolved from monkeys either.  As you said in an earlier post Jim...why would you go north in the winter and south in the summer? I doubt that early American man would have gone north to the ice and snow. But it seems likely that those from the colder regions in Siberia would have come across the straits and down.

I don't mind if you think me simple...because I happen to think that it's a very good trait...the old  'k i s s' method...keep it straight and simple.  Look how long it took scientists and archeologists to figure out that the dinosaur didn't drag his tail. I mean how can you take it for granted that the pile of bones laying in a heap in the tar pits or where ever...are of just that one creature? They may have had the stegasaurus head on the T-Rex's body. It's ALL speculation and theory or trial and tribulation...but, I try to keep my eyes, ears and mind open.

Taking into account the continent dividing, plate tectonics colliding the fact that life could have started in any old swamp...I just don't buy the Australian Origins...To tell you the truth I think that a big old pterodactyl   came along picked up that Native American and flew off to Australia to feed it's nest of young...the one sitting atop that huge red rock...Ayers Rock...Jim, how many do you think are buried there? Why ARE they buried to face the East?

             Aerial view of Ayers Rock. Uluru-Kata Tjuta National Park, Northern Territories, Australia

Silver
10 years ago

I know that .Just having fun with a picture .they have columbus journey on maps and he discoverd America (not ) but that shows a light version of Natives finding texas

Koda

Um Question
10 years ago
Not to be a smart butt ....But the map that was posted does that mean Indians discoverd texas ????
No One Knows
10 years ago

Everyone can guesstimate how we got here or if we was here or even maybe that they came from us ,Its a fact that cocca.and tabbaco has been found in Mummies in Egypt .those products are from this side of the ball ,History is dictated by the ones who won the wars or at that time could write..my version of Histtory  is HIS Story .The ice bridge therory does not hold water .it has been estimated that we crossed the ive bridge 10 to 20,ooo years ago ..But there was a discovery a few yrs back in central america of the remains of a human dating back 37.ooo years ago ( THE GUY WAS REALLY LOST )

Also there has been remains uncoverd of a caucasin male near Portland that is 7 to 15 000 years old ( so i guess the old Chris Columbus was not the one who found this side of the ball )

and another tail does not hold water ,One min they said we came across the ice bridge ..Ok....But in the same breath they said that people of that time only traveled 35 to 40 mile from where they was born HMMMMMMMMMMM so what is being said is that a bunch of people said to themselfs hey its cold here lets go over there and create a new civilization in a warmer part of the world so that in a few thousand yrs they can find us and almost wipe us out

Sounds kinda dumb if you think about it

Anonymous
I agree with Koda
10 years ago

All that can  be learned from digging bodies and sites, HAS been learned. Any thing beyong that is simply grave robbing and artifact stealing. Destruction of sites is nothing new.

Andrew Jackson ordered it done shortly after the removal of Tribes in the South. The only difference in now and then, is that now the army is not sent out to do it... Universities do it much more effectively.

I have in my lifetime actually seen road construction stopped because of teh presence of sites....only to see those construction crews ordered to work under the cover of darkness to buldoze the sites.

We were halting Progress. Who's progress?

In mopst cases it would have even been possible to detour around the sites...But this was not an option that would be considered. If  destruction of teh site was not a goal, then why would  a detour around it be such a problem.

With Respect,

Jim

Anonymous
Hi Melisssa
10 years ago

Yes qn interesting map indeed...although it is about as fictional as clan of teh cave bear. I read that by the way...Also watched the mocies. Entertaining, but factual? Well that is another story.

Archeologists are people I have faced many times in the last 30 years. I find them to be for teh most part entertaining as well. A few, very few actually understand what is happening.

For example, I live in Alabama where the University of Alabama has been digging at a place called Moundville for over 60 years. They have decades of exposed bodies in cardboard boxesa stored away. What have they learned... Not much.

They look at teh bones and from the understanding of their own thought process, decide how others though and acted. Without speaking teh language, understanding the Spirituality, and the culture of these people, they KNOW them. I say that is BUNK. They have been dealing with me for many years and they still don't know me and that was in person.

The efforts to "Prove" That First Nations People do not Orginate here is simply one more step in the effort to eliminate any claims we have to our own land.

There are ancient burial sites not far from where I live. I know who they are. I know because my grandfather told me, his grandfather told him and his grandfather told him and on and on.

I know teh difference in square stack grave and round stack graves.. I also know why there is  adifference.

I know why those burried in tehm face the East. Something Archiologists have puzzled over for years.

The funny part is, any Cherokee with traditional upbringing can tell you  teh answer to these questions. Archiologists rarelt bother to ask questions. They prefer to give their own answers.

They do not trust us to tell them the truth, yet they expect people to trust them to KNOW..

Over the years of dealing with Archiologists that in my opinion are little more or less than grave diggers, depending on how you look at it, I am convinced that they are even more confused now than before they started digging.

Recently in our area somecivil war graves were robbed. People were looking for belt buckles...you know...artifacts. The new coverage was unbelievable. There was an outrage. Yet right down the road a couple of miles an entire Indian Burial Ground was being excavated. The only outcry came from a handful of Indian People ...So forgive me if I do not see archiology to be a very exact science.

Archiology is a science developed to aquire grant funding for universities. Other than that...it has little practical use.

The exception are the few Warriors who are dedicated to preservation through Archiology. People like Doc Mel. I am here to tell you...I wanted to list an entire group of names with Doc Mel. Unfortunately, I do not know of any others, only that there are a few out there.

More than one Archiology site in my area has found me there. De-bunking as we go. I have been asked and ordered to leave, I have stayed claiming my rights to do so persuant to 42 USC 1996.

They threaten to call local authorities, I promise to call Federal Authorities if they do.

If they are not willing to be challanged in person, then what exactly is it that they fear?

Just my opinion.

With Respect,

Jim

This map...
10 years ago

shows that it is easier to imagine early Americans coming from the colder regions of the northern Siberia making their way south through Alaska...the Eskimo/Inuit people certainly have a facial feature similar to some of the more southerly Native Americans.

 I know that this map may seem a bit childish...hee, hee I think it may have been how George Bush was schooled just before he became President...it says put an x on the Bering Land Bridge and a star on Texas...LOL! He probably flunked...and Cheney told him where Iraq is located!   Anyway.

If you've ever read Jean Auel's series of books...beginning with 'The Clan of the Cave Bear' to her last...'The Shelters of Stone', these books although fiction are very well written and she has corroborated with archeologists.  The early man traveled around a lot! There is no reason why different groups couldn't have originated in various places at different times. Always in search of food and shelter.

Also, It is true that the earth has had several times, of what seems like drastic changes even though it has taken thousands of years for it to happen. When I was out west...the Salt Flats was once the bottom of an ocean! Where did the water go? Yes, John Koda, I too, think that the plate tectonics were responsible for peoples being separated. And Jim Windwalker...Siberia is more northerly than the Americas if you look at the globe below. Besides, if the earth can change as scientists have sure proof...why is it not possible that the poles have undergone changes? They have found proof of vegetation far below the arctic ice. The Earth's rotation may have changed slightly due to various reasons...meteor? The moon falling into the Earth's gravity belt? Who knows? Journey of the First Americans

If the USa stops Destroying Sacred Sites we can Not prove anything about our Ancestors
10 years ago

Native Earthworks Preservation is working to stop the abuse of sacred site no matter what state they are in ..This is an issue that needs to be addressed Now before everything is gone

Koda

Anonymous
Consider experst as well.
10 years ago

There are sites in teh Southeast that are said to date back as far as 20,000 years....even the ruins of teh Anasazi were shown to be built on top of ruins. Dating back possibly even farther.

Dating depends on the process used, the credibility of those performing the tests and the theory one is attempting to prove or disprove.

Which causes one to have to have serious questions over the credibility of all tests considered. 

With REspect,

Jim

Has anyone ever thought
10 years ago
That when the techtonic plates split we stayed over on this side and they stayed on theres ????
Anonymous
Hmmmm
10 years ago

Wel as an Investigator of some nearly 30 years, I can only hope that teh DNA results rae more effective than the ones used in court cases over the last 10 years. DNA results which have released rapists who were positively identified and DNA tests which have sent people to prison who were indeed know to have air tite alibies.

Thet can use DNA tests to determine that these people were not related to First Nations People but the same DNA tests can not tell the difference in dogs and wolves? ..ok...

Now, as a young man my family lived mostly off the land. In reguards to the Ice PackTreck Theory, I ask myself this question. At what time in history has wildlife Migrated North in winter and south in summer?

Those who were said to haev crossed an Ice Bridge that may or may not have existed would have had to follow a known migration path since it would have been impossible to pack enough provisions, especially since they would have had no idea where they were heading having never been there to start with and having no idea what food source may have been available once they arrived.

I tend to believe the different creation stories of the many different Nations. Each was created in their own time in their own place. Placed upon the earth where they were needed and when they were needed to complete the balance.

For those who believe in Creation, why is that so difficult to accept? If one Creator can Create one poeple, why could not One Creator, create thousands of different kinds of One People and place them where he chose?

Just my humble opinion.

With Respect,

Jim Windwalker

I believe...
10 years ago

early man traveled from the northern part of Russia across the Bering Strait into Alaska moving ever southward to a warmer climate.

10 years ago
omg r u kidding me !!! that's great something else the gov. can hold back on........ LOLOL  (ALTHOUGH NOT FUNNY) But even so they still took everything from the american native reguardless!!!!! For we occupied north and beyond before the white man got here.But I will try to find something.  
Native American origens.
10 years ago

    It seems to me that First Nations and Native American peoples have much in common with Oriental peoples which,I suppose,favors the Siberion link,though an Austrailian connection sounds interesting as well.

    I do have a theory that Phonecian traders sailed with the winds from Africa to South America,traded up the coast to Nova Scotia,then sailed with the winds back to Europe,but that's just speculation on my part. I do think,however,that anchient peoples were more advanced and got around better than we give them credit for.

American Indian Origin Theories
10 years ago

There is much speculation by many scientists on just where the original inhabitnts of what is now known as North America and South America originated...I would like for our group members to join in with me and post some of those theories here on this topic thread..

While I was surfing the web I came upon the following theory which was posted at: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5927028..It is a very unique theory and actually has some basis..

Did first Americans come from ... Australia?

EXETER, England - Anthropologists stepped into a hornets’ nest on Monday, revealing research that suggests the original inhabitants of America may in fact have come from what is now known as Australia.

The claim will be extremely unwelcome to today’s native Americans, who came overland from Siberia and say they were there first.

But Silvia Gonzalez from John Moores University in Liverpool said that skeletal evidence pointed strongly to this unpalatable truth and hinted that recovered DNA would corroborate it.

“This is very contentious,” Gonzalez, a Mexican, said with a smile at the annual meeting of the British association for the Advancement of Science. “They (native Americans) cannot claim to have been the first people there.”

Evidence from skulls and DNA
She said there was very strong evidence that the first migration came from Australia via Japan and Polynesia and down the Pacific Coast of America.

Skulls of a people with distinctively long and narrow heads discovered in Mexico and California predated by several thousand years the more rounded features of the skulls of native Americans.

One particularly well preserved skull of a long-faced woman had been carbon-dated to 12,700 years ago, whereas the oldest accurately dated native American skull was only about 9,000 years old.

“We have extracted her DNA. It is going to be a bomb,” she said, declining to give details but adding that the tests carried out so far were being replicated to make sure they were accurate.

She said there were tales from Spanish missionaries of an isolated coastal community of long-face people in Baja California of a completely different race and rituals from other communities in America at the time.

These last survivors were wiped out by diseases imported by the Spanish conquerors, Gonzalez said.

The research is one of 11 different projects in America, Africa, Asia and the Middle East being funded over a four-year period by Britain’s Natural Environment Research Council.

The projects — focusing on diet, dating and dispersal of people down the millennia in the face of climate change — aim to rewrite anthropology.

“We want to make headlines from heads,” said Professor Clive Gamble of Southampton University. “DNA will give us a completely new map of the world and how we peopled it.”

Copyright 2005 Reuters Limited. All rights reserved.
I have my own personal theory and I believe American Indians were great explorers and they fanned out from the America's to many other countries..Why do scientists not take that into consideration because the road is the same distance from the America's as it is from the other countries to the America's...To me it is just as likely my ancestors explored the world and they of course left some of their DNA behind..  
Cherokee Legends and myths say we originated on another planet which orbits around one of the stars in the PLeides..
What is your take and theory on this ? Do you have a theory and if you do will you please share it with us ?