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Jul 23, 2012
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I got this message yesterday, from S. This is the abbreviated letter, and my abbreviated answer to it. Plus some notes following.
Have you read this thread?  

There's a new troll (just joined today) who is really attacking members and calling them vile names. I commented to him basically what you told me to. Read it and see if it was OK.

'I see that you just joined today and we all know the RNC has hired a bunch of people to come and disrupt liberal blogs. If you are one of them...'{I ended the quote here. BMT}
My reply:

GOOD FOR YOU!!!

That Cause thread got very early to the point where I, personally, would just give it up -- certain subjects {such as immigration} I personally tend to avoid as much as possible, as I think my limited time is better spent elsewhere! Not that I think EVERYbody should do that -- SOMEbody needs to hold the fort. And maybe even keep arguing & arguing with the trolls -- some don't seem to mind it. It's just not my "thing" -- one person can't do everything!

That said, I'm glad you drew my attention to that, as otherwise I would've skipped it for the reasons stated above.  I think some threads just need to close, as eventually they all do. Let the troll have the "last word"! They don't change any minds!

 I have noticed that C2 is weird about "political trolls" -- they use the excuse of "free speech"; sometimes I wonder, and other people have too, if some sort of a "deal" has been made, C2 can continue to exist if the trolls are allowed to speak! After all, there are powerful forces who DON'T WANT the kind of speech on a Forum that C2 provides! Are we being paranoid? Well, it's speculation! Otherwise, hard to figure out what's going on!

Yeah, keep flagging. And, I THINK YOUR SENTENCE ABOUT THE RNC SENDING IN DISRUPTORS IS SOMETHING YOU -- AND WE! -- CAN REPEAT AGAIN AND AGAIN ON EACH THREAD THESE GUYS APPEAR ON -- BECAUSE IT'S TRUE! See, the BEAUTY of that IS -- true or not, THEY CAN'T DENY IT WITHOUT DRAWING ATTENTION TO IT -- so that puts them in a BIND!

We need to STAY CALM -- what the trolls are trying to do, is NOT to "convince" anybody, rather, they want to make us mad and lose our cool and DESCEND TO THEIR LEVEL AND LOOK LIKE FOOLS!!! THEN, people will look at Care2 "political" threads and think, this is a silly and ridiculous place for me to spend my time! I will just go elsewhere! The trolls DON'T MIND how silly and stupid they look -- AS LONG AS THEY CAN GET US TO DO THE SAME!!! Their END goal, is NOT to "win" the discussion -- but to DEGRADE and ultimately, STOP IT ENTIRELY! I mean like ENTIRELY, not just on the thread they are on!!

ONLY IF WE LET THEM, WILL THIS HAPPEN. ONLY IF WE ARE NOT ONTO THEM.

I have been thru all this BEFORE, on C2, years ago! With trolls named Jeffrey and Rusty -- who knows if these are the same ones, or new ones! no difference! [David B. sounds suspiciously the same, to me! But, maybe they are just reading out of the same playbook!]

BMutiny T       Barbara

The RNC is the Republican National Committee. A while ago, a Care2 member accessed their site, and found how they were encouraging the trolls to do their thing all over the Internet! including of course Care2; and, moreover, found the TALKING POINTS FOR EACH DAY, listed!!!!!! THAT'S WHY THE TROLLS SOUND ALIKE WHEREVER THEY APPEAR! {A recent ploy, for example, is for Trolls to say "they are Independents and voted for Obama -- but now, they've seen the light, Obama is a dictator, tyrant, Marxist, Obamacare is taking away our freedoms, etc. -- so they are voting for ROMNEY!" NOT a valid criticism of Obama from the Left, as a REAL Independent would make!!!} Anyway, that site is more difficult to access now, so we probably can't get to it! We can only see the results......

And, IT IS EXPLICITLY AGAINST THE CARE2 CODE OF CONDUCT, TO VILIFY AND ENGAGE IN PERSONAL ATTACKS AGAINST CARE2 MEMBERS. Such posts need to ALWAYS BE FLAGGED. However, be warned that Care2's enforcement of such rules, is shall-we-say "spotty". Care2's excuse is 1, they're very busy {I believe it}, and, 2, Free Speech {see my and others' doubts, above}.

Read more: http://www.care2.com/causes/arizona-immigration-law-racially-motivated.html#ixzz21SetobFj

Actually, that thread is RIDICULOUSLY long by now, I wouldn't want to encourage anybody to post there! Just note David B., the NEW TROLL!

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Posted: Jul 23, 2012 10:07am
Jul 19, 2012

Somebody asked me: "Is there a way to get rid of trolls such as E..... and S..... who are there only to cause trouble? I complain about them constantly but get no help from Care2....."

You can get rid of them if they BREAK CARE2'S RULES OF CONDUCT.

Care2's "terms of service" are at the very, very bottom of this page.

I haven't looked at them recently. Care2 used to have a "Code of Conduct" in addition to the "terms of service"; and it used to be accessible. Maybe it still is.

Anyway, according to the "Code of Conduct", it was AGAINST THE RULES FOR A CARE2 MEMBER TO PERSONALLY ATTACK ANOTHER CARE2 MEMBER. You could attack someone's OPINIONS or IDEAS. But you couldn't, for example, call them an "Idiot".

Of course, the Right-wingers on Care2 DID THAT ALL THE TIME. There were a couple in particular..... probably not these same 2! That was a long time ago! Years ago!

You realize, that for the most part, THESE PEOPLE ARE BEING PAID BY THE REPUBLICAN NATIONAL COMMITTEE, the RNC. They get their TALKING POINTS directly from the RNC. {It's good to remind other people of that, now and again!} A Care2 member actually went to the RNC site and saw the talking points posted.... now that site is more difficult to access!!!

Anyway, if you want to fight these people, you have to be EXTREMELY CAREFUL, NOT TO DO WHAT THEY ARE DOING, YOURSELF -- that is, attack personally, other Care2 members! THEY WILL USE THAT AGAINST YOU IF THEY CAN! They have absolutely no shame!

We had a big battle a few years back, against similar trolls. WE HAD TO GET UP ALL SORTS OF PETITIONS, TO GET CARE2 TO FOLLOW THEIR OWN RULES!!!!!!!!!!! Care2 would "temporarily" block these people, then these people would just come back and do the exact same thing again!!! Finally, FINALLY after a huge battle, we DID get Care2 to follow their own rules, and these people wised up, and were obnoxious but did not make any more personal attacks.

You can ONLY "get" them IF THEY MAKE A PERSONAL ATTACK ON YOU OR ON ANY OTHER CARE2 MEMBER. For example, they CAN say that "Gays are Evil", etc., that is allowed....... but they CAN'T say "Sharon is a disgrace to the human race", etc. By the exact same token, YOU can't say "Elaine is a disgrace to the human race", etc., IF YOU ARE GOING TO USE THAT TACTIC..... BECAUSE IF YOU DO, THEY ARE DEFINITELY GOING TO USE IT AGAINST YOU. Even if THEY "started it"!

There SHOULD be a way to say, These are just TROLLS who MERELY WANT TO MAKE TROUBLE and are NOT BELONGING HERE IN THIS DISCUSSION. But I guess that falls under "the right of Free Speech". I guess the answer is to ignore them, pass over them as if they said NOTHING. Or, attack right-wingers AS A GROUP, not as the people posting: as in, RIGHT-WINGERS ARE ALL IDIOTS. If you are very witty and clever, RIDICULE can sometimes CRUSH them! The BEST answer I've heard yet, is somebody recently said to a right-wing troll, "If they saw the inanity of your remarks, the Koch brothers would stop paying you"!!!!!!!!!!!! Oooooooh, so clever!!!!!!!! on so many levels! [And within the rules, too!]

Since they are often capable of nothing but what I call "one-line zingers', I like to sometimes CRUSH them with an AVALANCHE OF WELL-RESEARCHED FACTS!!! You have noticed, no doubt, that my posts tend to be somewhat long! SOMEtimes, that will CRUSH them and shut them up! Another GOOD thing to do, is to figure out WHAT THEY, THE TROLLS POSTING ON BEHALF OF THE RNC, WANT LEAST TO BE POSTED -- AND THEN POST THAT!!! By that I mean -- you don't have to ANSWER the trolls' nonsense! That is letting THEM "frame the conversation"! You can say ANYTHING YOU DARN WELL WANT TO, after the Trolls have posted! Say something really EMBARASSING [but well-researched and true!] about the Repukelican candidates, f'rinstance...... do this after each obnoxious post by a troll, so that it's INEVITABLE......

In conclusion, DON'T LET THE TROLLS "FRAME" AND GUIDE THE CONVERSATION. And, NEVER, NEVER DESCEND TO THEIR LEVEL. {I know, I have, but only once or twice, we all are tempted!} THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT THE TROLLS WANT -- WHAT THEY ARE THERE FOR -- TO DEGRADE THE CONVERSATION AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE. As much as is in their power to do so. Don't GIVE them that power. Talk AROUND them and PAST them and STICK TO YOUR GUNS!!!!!! Both intellectually and morally!

[You can actually turn THEM into a platform, for saying stuff you want to say! In other words, TURN THE TABLES on them, take ADVANTAGE..... if you have that perspective in mind!] [Trolls learned to avoid places I posted in......] So, I hope my "experience" has been a mite helpful.......

BMutiny T     Barbara

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Posted: Jul 19, 2012 11:42am

 

 
 
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BMutiny TCorporationsEvil
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