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Muslim Prof. Says Islamic Immigration 'Threatens West'


Offbeat  (tags: Canadians, Islam, Muslims, immigration, crime, culture, government, safety, society, protection )

Gillian
- 1311 days ago - themuslimissue.wordpress.com
The MacDonald-Laurier Institute and the Globe and Mail held a public conference recently on the phenomenon of Muslim immigration to the West, which debated whether or not the influx is bringing a culture of violence to Canada and other Western countri



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Gillian M (218)
Wednesday March 19, 2014, 1:16 pm
The MacDonald-Laurier Institute and the Globe and Mail held a public conference recently on the phenomenon of Muslim immigration to the West, which debated whether or not the influx is bringing a culture of violence to Canada and other Western countries.

The debate was conducted between Doug Saunders, journalist for Foreign Affairs for the Globe and Mail, and Salim Mansur, a Political Science professor at the University of Western Ontario, reports Shalom Toronto.

The two addressed the following questions: Are immigrants from Muslim countries bringing violence and values ​​that are inconsistent with Western values​​? Are Muslim immigrants integrating into Western society in the same ways that other ethnic minorities do? And, is Muslim immigration a threat to Canada or West?

Interestingly, it was the political science professor – who is, himself, Muslim – who maintained that Islam remains a threat to Canadian society.

Jihadist Terrorism: Not a Religious Movement, but a Political One

Saunders maintained throughout the debate that Muslim immigration presents no threat to Canadian society whatsoever, and stated that claims that the influx had led to a rise in extremism and violence were misleading.

To prove this, Saunders cited a study by British intelligence agencies on criminals and terrorists, which demonstrated that personal trauma, criminal activity, jail time, and especially political beliefs, are more likely to cause crime than Muslim religious beliefs in and of themselves. The study also concluded that religious education protected against – rather than fueled – violent tendencies.

“Jihadist terrorism is a violent political movement, based on territorial claims and religious separatism – a ‘clash of civilizations’ belief based on political extremism, not religious faith,” Saunders noted. “Islam does not draw people into extremism; rather, political extremism draws its members into Islam.”

Thus, according to Saunders, “eliminating Muslim immigration wouldn’t eliminate Islamic extremism from the West or even reduce it significantly.”

The Globe and Mail columnist also addressed concerns that Muslim immigrants will eventually attempt to impose Sharia law in Canada, enacting edicts that oppose secular values, oppress women’s rights, and discriminate against homosexuals. In response, Saunders noted that the possibility of the Muslim community in Canada gaining enough ground to become a political power was unlikely; demographically, he argued the birthrate among Muslim immigrants shrinks after several generations.

“This narrative is built on a basic fallacy,” Saunders stated. “Why would any family endure the trouble and expense of immigrating to a faraway country because they hate its ways? People generally immigrate to places whose values and institutions they find agreeable.” He added that 94% of Muslim immigrants hold they are “proud to be Canadian” and 81% are satisfied with Canada’s political leadership – compared to just 61% of the native Canadian population.

Muslim Immigration: A Threat to the West

Professor Salim Mansur begged to differ.

“Canadians’ mistaken notion that all cultures are equal has disarmed this nation in the confrontation with the illiberal demands of radical Islam,” he fired, noting he was “drawing upon – as an immigrant, as a person of color and as a Muslim – inside knowledge of and lived experience in the cultures of both liberal democracy and Islam.”

“A liberal-democratic society based on individual rights, freedom, and the rule of law cannot indefinitely accommodate non-liberal or illiberal demands from immigrant groups without subverting its own culture,” Mansur noted. He then identified three risk factors: the rise in birthrates among the Muslim community, the nature of Muslim culture and its relationship to non-Muslim cultures, and the West’s multiculturalism.

Statistics cited by the professor include proof that the foreign-born population in Canada has become predominantly non-Western since 1967, especially in major city centers, and that the Muslim immigrant population is growing four times faster than other immigrant populations.

As a culture, Mansur stressed, Islam became a “rigid, closed system” during the 14th century, as a result of a heavy Bedouin influence. Mansur maintains that early Islam found Bedouin culture “savage” – but it nonetheless prevailed.

“The full face of this Bedouin-ized Islamic culture that has wrecked the diversity of the Muslim world from within is to be seen in the bigotry, violence, vulgarity and misogyny of Al Qaeda, the Taliban, the Khomeini followers,” Mansur noted. “It is the nature of mainstream contemporary Muslim politics – or Islamism – to conform to the Bedouin disposition.”

This disposition, Mansur claimed, characterizes contemporary Islamic values – even in immigrant communities. The things heard in Canadian mosques are “intractably opposed to liberal democracy,” and aim to “ruin from within” Canadian and Western values, according to the Professor.

Multiculturalism, meanwhile, threatens to allow this attitude to rear its ugly head in the political sphere, according to Mansur.

“In having swallowed the toxin of official multiculturalism, Canada has disarmed itself of the ability to discriminate between immigrant groups which are importing cultural baggage that is harmless, and those that are toxic to the values of liberal democracy,” Mansur concludes.
 

Gillian M (218)
Wednesday March 19, 2014, 1:21 pm
It is interesting that those in the West, with no understanding of Islam, defend their immigration and the person who knows and understands the evil ideology of Islam, condemns them coming into a democracy.

When will the West realise that Islam is in direct conflict with the UN Convention of Human Rights? That Islam is not a religion of peace and understanding? That we need to stop allowing Islam to stop promoting their way of life over ours?

I'm sure that they are laughing at us and our bending over backwards to allow them to destroy our democratic way of life.
 

Evelyn B (62)
Wednesday March 19, 2014, 1:28 pm
A hate message from a hate site
Sad
 

Sue Matheson (79)
Wednesday March 19, 2014, 1:59 pm
thanks
 

. (0)
Wednesday March 19, 2014, 2:33 pm
"Islam remains a threat to Canadian society".....finally, it is said out loud.
 

Stan B (123)
Wednesday March 19, 2014, 3:12 pm
You don't need to be a genius to work this out.
 

Madhu Pillai (22)
Wednesday March 19, 2014, 4:17 pm
agree
 

Gillian M (218)
Wednesday March 19, 2014, 5:33 pm
Evelyn, how can it be a hate message when it is a Muslim saying it? Do make your comment appropriate to the article.

 

P. L. Neola (21)
Wednesday March 19, 2014, 7:38 pm
Even I, like Professor Salim Mansur, beg to differ.
After reading the book, Modern Day Trojan Horse: The Islamic Doctrine of Immigration, Accepting Freedom or Imposing Islam?, I would suspect the journalist for being an enemy of the West. The book is only around 139 pages but very informative!
Sam Solomon and E Al Maqdisi, the authors, explain in detail how immigration imitates and emulates the life of Muhammad and is meant to spread and STRENGTHEN Islam for achieving a worldwide caliphate. They also introduce their readers to all the components of the system of Islamic Doctrine of Immigration and explicitly explain how each component works. The Islamic Doctrine of Immigration was designed to destroy other cultures from within.
Muhammad’s first journey with his followers was planned for two years before they left Mecca. They journeyed to Medina, after spending those years in negotiation with two Arab tribes, for annihilating the ancient Jewish tribes of that region. The Jewish tribes were wealthy and successful in trade and commerce. Two Arab tribes settled in that region and began coveting the ancient Jewish tribes’ wealth.
Muhammad’s mother and grandfather were blood related to one of the Arab tribes. Muhammad and 73 leaders or influential members of the two Arab tribes made a pact to infiltrate, deceive, and slowly kill the tribes one-by-one, and they did just that. They also established the system of dividing the spoils before leaving Mecca because, after all, that was the purpose of the journey.
Muhammad helped the two Arab tribes in conquering and possessing what belonged to the Jews and in turn the two tribes became Muslim followers of Muhammad.
 

DaleLovesOttawa O (198)
Wednesday March 19, 2014, 7:48 pm
"Are immigrants from Muslim countries bringing violence and values ​​that are inconsistent with Western
values​​? Are Muslim immigrants integrating into Western society in the same ways that other ethnic minorities do? And, is Muslim immigration a threat to Canada or West?"

No doubt that there are obviously some immigrants that do bring violence and inconsistent values with western democracy into Canada, but not all of them. Some beliefs about women and other issues are obviously not the same values or beliefs as is the Western societal norm.

There are some immigrants, from say, Somalia who have entered Canada. As a result of a civil war there, many have been scarred by violence and some of those immigrants have brought a culture of violence into Canada, however, not all Somali immigrants are violent or dangerous. just some of them who have engaged in criminal activity.


Regarding integration, one could say this about a variety of non-western immigrants when it comes to fully integrating within Canadian society. Some very large Chinese communities exist within Canada and some of the older Chinese do not ever completely integrate into Canadian society, they speak Chinese, read Chinese newspapers and in some cases, have Chinese language radio/TV. Canada has a multicultural federal policy which encourages immigrants to keep their own cultures/languages, ways of life if they so choose. Many integrate, some obviously do not.


Many governmental services offer translation services if a Chinese or other foreign language speaker is dealing with a provincial government on the phone for example, so some older immigrants will never truly 'assimilate.'


Since Canada is a multicultural society and does not seek to use the American melting pot there will be more immigrants that do not totally assimilate into the dominate Western-based Canadian culture. (But, even in New York City there are some immigrants that have not totally assimilated into American society, keeping their languages, ethnic newspapers, etc, or even some of the Cuban-Americans in Miami for instance).


Since Canada is a pluralistic democracy and has the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms, it is unlikely that Canada will adopt a policy of barring anyone who is Muslim from immigrating into Canada.
Does This mean that if there are some extreme fundamentalist Muslims who are immigrating with the sole purpose of trying to spread violent propaganda within Mosques, or become a terrorist later on (sleeper cell), then yes, obviously such people will be able to get into the country if not discovered in any background check. Obviously those sorts of immigrants are a threat to society. Is every single Muslim who wants to immigrate to Canada an automatic threat to Canada, I don't believe so.


Short of having an all out policy barring of banning all Muslims entry into Canada as immigrants, I don't know what the Canadian government is really supposed to do. Being a pluralistic, multicultural democracy will leave one open to bringing in those people who are extreme fundamentalists who will be at odds with a democratic state, so in that regard all democracies are more vulnerable to anyone who immigrates who espouses violence or non-democratic values more than are any non-democratic nations.


I don't believe that every Muslim/Islamic immigrant is a threat to Canada (for example, the idea that Muslim immigrants are going to result in an eventual Muslim takeover of Canada in the distant future) and I believe that Canada and other Western nations are able to cope with any extremist fundamentalist threat within our borders.


There are always going to be fundamentalist extremists in the world, that is never going to change. They will have to be dealt with by the intelligence community within all western nations.


Ontario has already banned the allowance of the adoption of any form of Sharia law within the province and most democracies tend to avoid allowing such laws to be integrated within the legal system.


"In having swallowed the toxin of official multiculturalism, Canada has disarmed itself of the ability to discriminate between immigrant groups which are importing cultural baggage that is harmless, and those that are toxic to the values of liberal democracy,” Mansur concludes."


He is assuming that pluralism, multiculturalism is in and of itself some form of 'toxin'. That is ridiculous, as there are many cultures within Canada, (not simply the one that he is focused on). Does multiculturalism make it more difficult to prevent THE immigration of extremists? Yes, it would appear so. Does that mean everything about multiculturalism should be trashed? I don't believe that should be the case as I enjoy seeing diverse cultures across the country.


However, he appears to worry that if Canada keeps multiculturalism in place, it will be eventually taken over by hordes of Muslims rushing into the country to somehow subvert it. If people are that worried, simply have immigration where equal numbers of people from all areas of the world are accepted as immigrants so that no one specific religion or culture comes into the country at the same time.


I grew up in Ottawa which is a fairly multicultural city, when going to university I saw a lot of Muslim women walking around in traditional garb, it did not send me running to hide under a bed because they were a visible minority.



If people are that worried about Muslims growing within Canada because they have more children, they can always play into the Quiverfull Movement or do what Québec did long ago and have a 'Revenge of the Cradle' movement where they had more children to offset the influence of the English speaking community in Québec.


Since the Canadian government is unlikely to issue a two child policy per Canadian family, I suppose those that really worry about the supposed Muslim influence/larger family numbers had better start having more children. This is unlikely to happen but if the presence of every new Muslim immigrating into Canada causes this worry for some, then, I guess those people had better get busy and have larger families since it is unlikely that Canada and most Western nations are going to adopt a No Muslims Allowed as an immigration policy.)


Since multiculturalism is not going to be dropped as official federal policy, then obviously as a democracy, when it comes to dealing with outside threats to internal security (such as extreme fundamentalists recruiting recruits to a terrorist cause within Mosques) there will be those who are engaging in nefarious activities within Mosques. It's up to the intelligence community to come up with better ways of dealing with this.


It is also unlikely that other provinces or the federal government will be adopting Québec's policy where all civil servants cannot go to work wearing religious clothing or symbols, thereby banning Islamic dress, turbans, the Jewish Kippah and the like from what civil servants can wear to work.


There are some who believe that anyone who is a Muslim is an automatic threat to Canada or the Western way of life, that everything about Islam is evil or people from that religion are all therefore potential terrorist recruits/double agents in the future.


I suppose that there are some who only wish that immigrants to Canada only be sourced from Western nations or all non-Muslim countries. However, I believe that Canada and other Western nations are able to cope with any threat from within as it has always done. Democracies are strong, our plural values are on one hand a weakness when it comes to dealing with non-democratic ideas and forces, but on the other hand, our democratic values are also our best advantage.


Perhaps it is a hate message (re Evelyn) if a certain Muslim despises and hates his own group entirely and believes that all are somehow evil. Some people may themselves be Muslim and still be anti-Muslim. This is also the case for some who are black, women, or whatever group that they happen to belong to.) There are even people who hate all humans as they despise humanity itself and wish for our total annihilation as they see humans as a cancer plaguing the entire planet. So, it can be possible to be Muslim and despise Islam/Muslims, I imagine just as one can be a woman and stand opposed to any form of equality for woman and wish women to be subjugated to the whims of the male populace or be human and want the entire human race to be purged from Earth so that the animals can have the place to themselves without human greed, pollution or whatever else.

 

Shil O (0)
Thursday March 20, 2014, 4:34 am
I think this Professor needs to whisper in D.Camerons ear

@Dale O
"Does This mean that if there are some extreme fundamentalist Muslims"
and
" (such as extreme fundamentalists recruiting recruits to a terrorist cause within Mosques)


Exactly what is an extreme fundimentalist muslim - It is not a term recognised within Islam

Their beliefs (almost prefaced that with religious" preclude the ability of any muslim to live in peace with his non muslim neighbour and they also hate each other if their sects are different

Their definition of peace is that it cannot come about until throughout the world...,All is for Alla
An admission that they cannot integrate and backed up with the koranic views on non muslims
who are regarded as the "Worst of Mankind" as even identified by the term Kafir

As to your statement
" our democratic values are also our best advantage. " -- This is the baloney of those who do not understand Islam,its goals or its values- Throughout the world Islam is perpetrating murder, rape,torture and mayhem- do you think these people are believers in a different Islam from those who are being imported.
Its wakey wakey time
 

. (0)
Thursday March 20, 2014, 6:06 am
Truth be told; 90% of most people regardless of what religion they are are secular. They go to church or mosque because it is the acceptable thing to do in their cultural sphere. Any demographic group will have that ratio. There is always the 10% minority that espouses criminality of one venue or another and radical Islam is no different.
Most of America's founding fathers were not Christian perse although church attendance on Sunday was an acceptable practice for them. Witness Thomas Jefferson; a deist or Abraham Lincoln who rarely set foot in church except when it suited his purpose.
So it is with other religions. It please one's cultural community and one's parents. The Catholic Church for example has been one of the largest offenders; a religion of convenience. White collar crime figures and mafia adherents get the indulgences as long as they can pay and benefit the church.
Per the demographic plot to take over the western world I can only say that yes there are people who exhort others to have large families even as resources dwindle. It is irresponsible, myopic and in the long run puerile and self defeating. The Muslims aren't the only ones practicing this. A white local politician went to a meeting in Scarborough, ON. That community is predominantly non-white. A Hindu man whom he was sitting next to asked him why he was there since it was predominantly a Hindu gathering. He said, I'm your political representative. Not for long replied the Hindu man. You get the picture?
There is no excuse for rape, violence or murder in the name of this mythical god or that one. Yes it occurs all to frequently in the Muslim world but it also occurs in the Hindu world too or any other place where there is religion.
Then we wonder why if there is an intelligent species out there why they won't let us out of our solar system? They are smart enough to not want to make contact with a violent, vicious two year old who doesn't play well with others.
 

Patricia Martinez (63)
Thursday March 20, 2014, 8:15 am


"Truth be told; 90% of most people regardless of what religion they are are secular"

Well that could very well be the truth for many religions, but unfortunately is definitely does not hold true for Islam. I would say that 90% of Muslims in the world are religious. In other words, the exact opposite is true here.

And again unfortunately, the tenets of the Islamic faith bode very badly for non-Muslims.

While it's true that there are other countries, religions and populations who are dealing with some of the same problems as Islam, these populations do not have as their ultimate goal of colonizing the entire globe and forcing everyone not Hindu or whatever to be beholden to Hinduism or whatever the case may be.

Islam is unlike any of these other political and religious systems in that way. Islam's oft-stated goal is to bring the entire globe under Sharia, and that's not a pretty picture for non-Muslims, if you have any idea of the history of dhimmitude.

 

Gillian M (218)
Thursday March 20, 2014, 9:54 am
What Dale, and others, are missing out on is that Islam is totally incompatible with the UN Convention of Human Rights and is a hate filled ideology. Regardless of whether or not a Muslim is moderate, they are following a religion which clearly states 109 times that non-Muslims should be killed, forced to convert or to pay jizya which is a tax for the right to live.

The religion itself was set up by a sociopath who was sex mad including paedophilia and necrophilia and an untrustworthy bandit. The religion is justified by a mish mash of ideas stolen from both Judaism and Christianity. The men are encouraged to have no self control and we can see the violence perpetrated by groups such as Somalians by looking at rape crimes in both Sweden and Denmark. In both of these countries the police have stated that virtually all rapes have been by those from the Muslim religion. In Europe, hate crimes against Jews have dramatically increased fuelled by Muslims.

Then we have to look at the riots by Muslims over a cartoon or a film! Yet when was the last time you saw a band of Presbyterians or Methodists rioting over an insult to their version of the bible? When did you last see the Chinese insisting that their laws be used in a Canadian court? The Chinese live peacefully with their neighbours and do not force their views on anyone else, not true of Muslims. I regularly see articles on schools where the girls wear hijabs or pray Muslim prayers without any other religion being discussed. Where halal becomes the norm and Christian rights are removed.

Michigan school district imposes religion test for job promotions

http://www.speroforum.com/a/SAROBAUZRP49/74793-Michigan-school-district-imposes-religion-test-for-job-promotions#.UyrL6U1F3IU

It is insidious forcing of Muslim practices into various systems that is of concern and it is in every country regardless of what you think.
 

Carol D (346)
Thursday March 20, 2014, 1:33 pm
Just received this this morning and it sure does appear to fit the Muslim agenda!!

Everyone seems to be wondering why Muslim
Terrorists are so quick to commit suicide.
Lets have a look at the evidence:
- No Christmas
- No television
- No nude women
- No football
- No pork chops
- No hot dogs
- No burgers
- No beer
- No bacon
- Rags for clothes
- Towels for hats
- Constant wailing from some idiot in a tower
- More than one wife
More than one mother in law
- You can't shave
- Your wife can't shave
- You can't wash off the smell of donkey
- You cook over burning camel shit
- Your wife is picked by someone else for you
- and your wife smells worse than your donkey
Then they tell you that "when you die, it all gets better"??
Well no sh*t Sherlock!....
It's not like it could get much worse
THE MUSLIMS ARE NOT HAPPY!

They're not happy in Gaza ..
They're not happy in Egypt ..
They're not happy in Libya ..
They're not happy in Morocco ..
They're not happy in Iran ..
They're not happy in Iraq ..
They're not happy in Yemen ..
They're not happy in Afghanistan ..
They're not happy in Pakistan ..
They're not happy in Syria ..
They're not happy in Lebanon ..

SO, WHERE ARE THEY HAPPY?

They're happy in Australia .
They're happy in Canada ....
They're happy in England ...
They're happy in France .....
They're happy in Italy ..
They're happy in Germany .....
They're happy in Sweden ..
They're happy in the USA .....
They're happy in Norway ..
They're happy in Holland ....
They're happy in Denmark .

Basically, they're happy in every country that is not Muslim
and unhappy in every country that is!

AND WHO DO THEY BLAME?

Not Islam.
Not their leadership.
Not themselves.

THEY BLAME THE COUNTRIES THEY ARE HAPPY IN!

AND THEN; They want to change those countries to be like....
THE COUNTRY THEY CAME FROM WHERE THEY WERE UNHAPPY!

Excuse me, but I can't help wondering...
How damn dumb can you get?

Michigan School District Imposes Religion Test for Job Promotions
http://www.care2.com/news/member/907581929/3754255
 

Gene J (290)
Thursday March 20, 2014, 3:25 pm
“This narrative is built on a basic fallacy,” Saunders stated. “Why would any family endure the trouble and expense of immigrating to a faraway country because they hate its ways?"

This is the supreme arrogance and stupidity of political correctness. I am an unabashed liberal, but I am not a fool, and I sadly say many of my thinking are as well. Islam IS a closed system, it has at is core a mission to overcome the world, nothing has changed about that in 14 centuries. The same pattern has played out wherever they have gone, start small, propagate, as their numbers grow, so their demands and as their numbers get large enough you have riots in the streets over rumors. Everywhere they have gone. Everywhere. Why this is so hard to track for liberals is based on their own misguided view of the world. They think that behind every beating heart, but for a little exposure to the light, is a liberal.

Well, they are wrong. A smart liberal is also a pragmatist and does not ignore history for fear of repeating it. In natural selection (I have been enjoying the rebirth of Carl Sagan's Cosmos) they will eventually die off, because they are weaker than liberals who have pragmatic natures as well as shiny souls. Those who think appeasement is the only way, well, in biology most of those species are now extinct and so too will be, eventually, this kind of liberal. They will die off or be killed. In either case, those of us who believe in the ultimate triumph of good over evil also know that history has at times demanded that people of peace take up arms to defend against a threat to the community, as has been the case through recorded history. Those who do not, are extinguished. Natural selection at work.

But there are many of us who believe at our soul level all humanity is worthy of love, but that does not mean we won't defend ourselves against another part of humanity not that evolved who comes at us, or our loved ones, with arms and knives and bombs. There will be a time of reckoning between Islam and the rest of the world. I would like that to end peacefully, but I am prepared to do what is necessary to protect hearth, home and my own values. For if you let a bully go unchallenged, what has the bully learned? That his tactics work, and you will have a split lip for not acknowledging that sometimes people of peace must fight people who would deny the rest of us that peace. As was the case with Hitler and with other despots and tyrannical regimes throughout history. Islam is just the latest such challenge and while we can maintain our loving hope, we can also know that if defense is needed, our liberty will again be redeemed with the blood of loving souls, pragmatic liberals among them.
 

Helen Porter (39)
Friday March 21, 2014, 8:08 pm
I think it's important to remember that Muslims threaten Muslims.

And all that entails.....
 

Debra Tate (17)
Sunday March 23, 2014, 8:56 pm
noted
 
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