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Heaven, Is on Earth, UFO's, Indian Elder, Mohammed From Street Named Killaly,

Offbeat  (tags: Heaven, is on Earth, Indian Elders, UFO's, Mohammed from street named Killaly, Scott Shaubel, love, Jesus Christ )

- 3456 days ago -
"It Came From Heaven" Giant UFO in Yukon Territory, Canada APTN, January 21, 2007 ".. 18 seconds in,.. Mohammed from street named Killaly, ha.. thats what street I live on, what a co-incidence..thats quite the word,

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Scott Shaubel (816)
Friday December 5, 2008, 5:43 am

..thats quite the word,..coincidence..I like to say it,..

its a coincidence that my dad was one of 7 sons too, ha,

Wikipedia:Coincidence is the noteworthy alignment of two or more events or circumstances without obvious causal connection.

scott,.. a Coincidence is a fact, it actually,... is

Scott Shaubel (816)
Friday December 5, 2008, 5:46 am


Deepak Chopra and other proponents of ancient Vedic spiritual and other

mystical teachings,

insist on the fact that there,

is,.. Absolutely NO Coincidence, in the world.


. (0)
Friday December 5, 2008, 6:06 am
Believing with the heart rather than with the brain. As with all mythological creation stories, a lovely little fairy tale.

Scott Shaubel (816)
Friday December 5, 2008, 6:17 am

hey Lindsey, I'm having fun,,

apparently most people have no trouble watching the world get destroyed,

.. like you,..

YOU, and ,.. they,..

all seem to enjoy bashing anyone who tries to tell them that it doesn't have to be like that..

. to everyone in the world, (not just Americans)

wake up,.. get conscious,

.. or the ride will NOT be enjoyable,.. at all,..figure it out,..

.. Rap off all you want,..

I will almost enjoy watching all you

.. non believers.. whine,.. (is not the word i woulkd like to use)

what happened to me and all the people I know of,

is going to happen to you,

I don't lie, about .. anything,

.. reality doe not have to suck..


. (0)
Friday December 5, 2008, 6:33 am
And any "saving" of the world will be accomplished by concrete action based on logic and reason - not mysticism. Anything less is merely a headlong rush towards Darwin-Awardee infamy....which is actually a good thing on a limited basis. Fewer Silly Wabbits to get in the way of the rest of us.

. (0)
Friday December 5, 2008, 7:08 am
Ah, Codex Alimentarius. That old sawhorse.

"Most people who have access to a balanced diet can usually obtain all the nutrients they require from their normal diet. Because foods contain many substances that promote health, people should therefore be encouraged to select a balanced diet from food before considering any vitamin and mineral supplement. In cases where the intake from the diet is insufficient or where consumers consider their diet requires supplementation, vitamin and mineral food supplements serve to supplement the daily diet."

Taken directly from Codex regulations.

Codex Guidelines for Vitamin and Mineral Food Supplements. (cited July 10, 2008).

. (0)
Friday December 5, 2008, 7:13 am
For the uninitiated, the battle against Codex is fought in many cases by those deluded souls who firmly believe that the proposed food safety regulations are designed by shadowy corporate and governmental figures to (deliberately and with malice aforethought) cause approximately 93% of the world's population to die off from malnutrition and starvation.

Janet Wintle (87)
Friday December 5, 2008, 8:18 am
There is a saying by Jesus that goes like this.
One should only eat liveing food.
He told his disciples about the power of the three Angels, born out of the Wind, Water, and Sun, which enters the Earth.
He told them to take of there shoes, and feel the Earths power flowing threw there feet,
All you need is the Grass, when it starts to grew, eat its little shouts.
I do not mean on your hands and knees,
Make your fresh bread from the Rye grass as soon as the seed starts to grow,
After you have allowed it to sprout, this will only take three days, for if you leave it any longer you will certainly witness the power in that grass. on the fourth day it will fill the jar.
Thought I would give you that first.
Now then,
Did you no? that nearly every thing you eat comes from Grass!
Yes it does!
Look at all the different grasses.
Then try to work out what is done with grass.
Even meat is manufactured from grass.
Yes butter, milk,cheese.
Wheat,bread cakes,
I'm not going to go through the list I will let you do that as a weekend study.
The Energy that is in this grass, can be taken in a little small amount of Oil,taken from the seeds, that can be drunk, two, or three times a day.
If you had to try, and put all the seed on a plate that was needed to make one tablespoon of this oil, you would never eat it all.
We use up most of our energy resorses by trying to turn this grass into different things.
Bless you Scott you are well on board.Janet. Thank you Father for this.

. (0)
Friday December 5, 2008, 8:28 am
We are not cows. And grass tastes perfectly dreadful.

Talk about depriving the populace of necessary nutrients....

. (0)
Friday December 5, 2008, 9:16 am
The link was clearly provided, Scott. And that link, I might add, was taken directly from a paper published on Natural News by an opponent of Codex.

The story, and quite a bit of interesting info on the tactics used by some opponents of Codex, may be found at:

Marion Y (322)
Friday December 5, 2008, 9:52 am
Another enlightening submission. I tend to believe this story before the immaculate conception of Mary in the bible. Then again, who am I to question the unbelievable stories in the bible? I wasn't there, so I don't know. However, I can take the positive information from any source that guides me to my higher self.

Thank you Scott and Janet for your wisdom and insight.

Scott Shaubel (816)
Friday December 5, 2008, 11:06 am

hers a few of the ones I put in relating to codex, there are more..

Information Democracy. TV.. It's All Lies,.. and Mis-Information to Confuse

Big Pharma Pushing to Criminalize Supplements

...Codex .. Nutricide - Criminalizing Natural Health, Vitamins, and Herbs... HELP... "SAVE OUR EARTH" ... Get Conscious .. NOW !

Population Control : Evidence of Harm, ..Biological warfare and testing on the public. Toxical, Biological, Chemical, Electo-magnetical.

Codex,.. Vitamins will be banned,.. December 31, 2009

Codex,.. is World Health Organization, is United Nations, is run by Queen Elizabeth, Vitamins will be banned,.. December 31, 2009

Vitamins Will Be Banned, Dec.31,2009 - Codex Alimentarius, Founded By the UN..HELP... "SAVE OUR EARTH" ... Get Conscious .. NOW !

- the Media creates the event,..Pat Woertz, UN, WHO, Codex, Government, Media,.. Sheeple
Media Manipulation and the United Nations

Save Our Earth From, Pat Woertz, ADM, Monsanto, She Runs Them All !


Scott Shaubel (816)
Friday December 5, 2008, 11:16 am

Lindsey, I am never angry at you, perhaps frustrated, at times..
anyways, my opinion on this ,..

The link was clearly provided, Scott. And that link, I might add, was taken directly from a paper published on Natural News by an opponent of Codex.

The story, and quite a bit of interesting info on the tactics used by some opponents of Codex,

.. if everyone could stop trying to figure out who is their opponents, and start looking at all the facts, with their own brains, and try to do the right thing,..
from what they have deduced themselves, before they are swayed, by others opinions,..

we would move forward, instead of where a lot of people are heading now..


. or one step closer to that prepaid grave,.


(save quickly, if you believe in that kind of crap)graves


. (0)
Friday December 5, 2008, 11:52 am
Unfortunately, Scott - we operate from two quite different worldviews. I place my trust in the scientific method and the knowledge we gain therefrom. And try to evaluate each claim using logic. I do not accept the mystical, the unverifiable, or anything for which there is no credible evidence. Because until such credible evidence exists for (or against) any theory, I believe that judgment should always be reserved.

Mike Tedesco (65)
Friday December 5, 2008, 1:51 pm

Do you eat corn?

Yvette Bonanno (56)
Friday December 5, 2008, 2:00 pm
Thanx for the share Scott!!

. (0)
Friday December 5, 2008, 2:42 pm
I'm a Southern gal. I eat corn in all its many forms.

Marcy S (73)
Friday December 5, 2008, 3:16 pm
Eat more corn Lindsey, you'll get even smarter than you are now.

. (0)
Friday December 5, 2008, 3:48 pm
I'll do my best, Marcy. In fact, I'm eating cornbread with dinner right now. And I can just feel those little grey cells multiplying and growing heartier even as we speak....

Darlene K (356)
Friday December 5, 2008, 9:06 pm
Scott I agree with this Truth, and thank you. Earth Science is just another belief system to me. It has produced many false-truths, regarding the knowledge we can attain in this physical plane. There are numerous examples, but for one...The Milky Way was taught as having four arms, but the development of better technology..via...the Hubble Telescope gave a different and accurate picture of the Milky Way. The scientific method of calculations didn't give accurate truth, but the Hubble gave mankind the ability to actually look at the Milky Way without relying so much on scientific calculations. Quantum theories basically rattles the whole scientific approach, and the general population has NO clue on what advancements that "the powers that be" have made over these last 50 or so years.

I agree that taking that quantum leap of faith, is not for the weak-hearted nor a sleeping soul..heh. I hope more start sensing their own truth from the wonderful information you share...Namaste

Darlene K (356)
Friday December 5, 2008, 9:07 pm
Lindsey, are you related to Sir Walkadelic F?


Kit B (276)
Friday December 5, 2008, 9:11 pm
Scott, if you post something for discussion then shouldn't you allow discussion. That does not mean that only those who believe each word are allowed. A discussion has both a consenting and dissenting point of view.

Gobble up those compliments, cause there may well be more who disagree or have a completely differing view. It doesn't mean they wrong, simply that they do not agree. That would seem to be a difficult concept for you.

. (0)
Friday December 5, 2008, 9:20 pm
Unlike in religion, there are no false-truths in science, Dar. Merely steps. As each succeeding generation builds on the knowledge attained by the previous one. What we knew little about yesterday we will better know today. And even better tomorrow. A scientific conclusion is simply the answer obtained from the best data available at any given time.

Darlene K (356)
Friday December 5, 2008, 9:37 pm
there are no false-truths in science, Dar

I agree to disagree, and 'steps' can apply to truths or false-truths. No one outside of the "circle of powers" has a CLUE of what science REALLY knows, and that is a fact. Conclusions? or Theories? There is a huge silent scientific community building, because many have gone off and done their "own" research, but if mainstream science don't give it the OK stamp, it will never make it to the mainstream population.

If particles of sub-atomic levels can react differently when they are observed versus not-observed, then in my opinion..., there is NO conclusion. Since Earth science is so subjective, it is not reliable on its own with many things.

. (0)
Friday December 5, 2008, 9:50 pm
Sorry, Dar. Every scientific conclusion is provisional. Religion, in many cases, claims to provide the ultimate and immutable truth. Science does not - and never will. Because it is self-correcting and always subject to revision based upon new and credible evidence.

Darlene K (356)
Friday December 5, 2008, 10:13 pm
Exactly, so science ISN'T reliable, and that is one of the main reasons. You and I learning what Earth Science is allowed to journalize for public knowledge, is NOT the fully accurate truth for many reasons opts. Many secrets that "we the people" haven't been privy too, doesn't give us enough information to make our own assessment. No problem if you want to hold strong to only what Earth science says is true, today..., but it really does offer very limited truth and knowledge. Everyone has choices to believe what they want :)

. (0)
Friday December 5, 2008, 10:23 pm
"Provisional" does not mean "unreliable". Science has proven that time and time again through a very reliable progression of discoveries. Reliable - because they are replicable. Because they work.

It merely means that no scientist will ever claim to have the ultimate truth. Because there can always conceivably be new information to be had at some point which will either hone a theory to greater sharpness or even, in rare circumstances, replace it entirely. But its general overall reliability can, unlike with the mystical realms, be clearly and practically demonstrated.

Darlene K (356)
Friday December 5, 2008, 10:28 pm
No, it is theories that have been tested and proven time and time again. That is what humanity has used as primative tools to try and explain phenomenoms or discover and invent new tools and gadgets! Toys for big kids...heehee.

. (0)
Friday December 5, 2008, 10:40 pm
Tools which get less and less primitive with each passing century and each passing day.

And what wonderful toys those tools have produced - ones which have increased human lifespan almost fourfold from just a few millenia ago and substantially reduced our physical pain. Which have allowed us to view distant nebulae and to walk on the moon. And which allow you to communicate instantaneously with someone half a world away by a signal bounced off a satellite orbiting this planet.

Yep - pretty neat toys.

Darlene K (356)
Saturday December 6, 2008, 12:00 am
I agree, very neat toys, while humans and animals continue to suffer and die horrible deaths. Think of all we could do for the meerkats! I would have skipped the trip to the moon, to feed more on Earth.

. (0)
Saturday December 6, 2008, 6:47 am
And I wouldn't have skipped those trips to the moon. First because the space program has made a real profit for humanity, both in terms of knowledge gained as well as a substantial financial profit for the U.S. in terms of important technologies which were developed specifically for it. But also because we need to continue exploring. Aside from the satisfaction it gives the human psyche, there are even greater discoveries to be learned - some of which may well help reduce that terrible suffering you speak of and lengthen lifespans even further.

Suffering and death will likely always be part of the human condition (I don't see science conquering death or suffering in their entirety at any time in the foreseeable future.) So waiting until those things are conquered makes no sense - since we would likely then be waiting forever.

Science doesn't have all the answers, Dar. But it will be providing yet more answers tomorrow.

Check your local listings.

Kit B (276)
Saturday December 6, 2008, 8:06 am
Dar, your limited knowledge of science is evident in what you write. Perhaps, that great conspiracy you seem to find is in the lack of depth of understanding. The term Earth Science is applied to the study of this planet, it's rock composition, soils and their viability, plate tectonics, the general circulation that is a part of weather patterns, and of course changes that will or can affect our daily lives. All of us, even those who think science and math is too difficult and therefore beyond our understanding, use math and science everyday. Example: when you enter a room your mind considers the shape and size, you may not be cognizant of this application at the moment, yet it is there. Science has no need for conspiracies, it's confirmations are in the public venue, not in the private. You use the example of the Hubble, yet say you would rather we had not gone to the moon, an odd statement. Unfortunately, had we spent every penny on food for others, we still could not and would not have resolved the problems of the hungry. As I am sure you are aware these are problems of a geopolitical nature, not simply of the lack of concern by others. The medical and scientific knowledge gained by our pursuit of what lies beyond are far too numerous to list here however, compare the condition of cancer patients in mid - sixties and now. Then cancer was almost universally a death sentence, now depending on the cancer, to know or meet someone that is a survivor is common place. Early detection is of course part of the reason, and that early detection is through advancements like the MRI and CT scans along with enhanced x ray and sonograms. Cancer is just one small part of the growth of medicine due to advancements from the space challenge. Science does not ask that you "believe in" what is offered only to consider the possibilities. That you are a skeptic (and others too) is but a challenge to work harder to make science more attainable to everyone. Consider your daily life without science, every part of your life is filled with scientific accomplishment, and that too helps to feed the hungry people of earth.

Scott Shaubel (816)
Saturday December 6, 2008, 9:17 am

Hey Dar, You are doing a fine job,

of letting those 2 talk themselves into "their" futures, let them go,

.. good ridance,

My stance from now on is,..(for everyone),

I don't care if I am offending Anyone,... at all.

- there is a Right, and a Wrong,
- there is a Light side and a Dark side,
- there is a Good side, and Bad side,
- the Vatican, and Monarchy systems, are on the Wrong, Dark, and Bad side.

I always choose the, Right, Light, and Good, Side...

Take Your Pick,

- you are with me,.. or you are not,

- take it,... any way you like,

- but it means exactly what it says.


- ( in case you can't even figure that out,.. my name. )

Kit B (276)
Saturday December 6, 2008, 9:36 am
Then Scott, what is the purpose of openly posting on a site like this? So you can demonstrate your inability to be fair or just to anyone who does not think and react as you do? You happen to think you are correct, others do not, why is that such a threat? We do not try to convince you of anything, but simply point out the obvious flawed logic. We could be as impolite as you, and demonstrate with numerous quotes, the errors of your posts, but chose to remain friendly in our disagreement of your premise. This is an open site for all members of Care2, not a private indulgence for you and like minded people only. Try to remain civil, it is the policy here. Really isn't that the true way of the side of light?

. (0)
Saturday December 6, 2008, 9:51 am
I don't offend all that easily, but anyone is certainly welcome to give it a try. Since, of course, no one has a Constitutional right not to be offended.

Scott Shaubel (816)
Saturday December 6, 2008, 10:24 am

- we still have freedom of speech(limited),.

. feel free to comment,.. as I do.

take it,... any way you like,.. say what you like,

freedom of speech, means you can do that,

- but it means exactly what it says.

Scott Shaubel (816)
Saturday December 6, 2008, 10:27 am

- what I will say about you 2, is that,.. at least you participate,

.. and at least you are not afraid to say what you think..

- even though you are wrong,

(my comment, my belief, if you will)(freedom of speech)


Janet Wintle (87)
Saturday December 6, 2008, 10:30 am
Hello my Dear Lindsey O.
I thought I would come back in on a little comment not just for you but everyone. It is as I said we eat Grass, I have tried it in its natural stat by lying in a field on a nice sunny day and chewed on a blade or two, did this when I was young, don't know many who haven't done this.
I want you now to put on a scientific head for a moment, What is it you are eating? Meat? no! it is created from grass.
What is in this grass to make the Animale so big and powerful?
Oils, Vitamins,minerals,Bacteria, and Photons, from the Suns rays.
The Cow has two stomachs, It chews the grass passing it down to the first stomach to soften it so that it can extract all the juices from this lovey fresh grass, It then puts back into the ground its pate of wast dead grass that can be aloud to dry and burnt for fuel.
Milk,Butter,Cheese, Cream, all extracts of grass.
Oil, this again grass.
All your Bread,Cakes,Biscuits, Grass, all are grasses wheat, rice,Corn.
I love Ryvita This is so good for you with all seed intact. Grass.
Every single breakfast cereal,Grass.
Every bit of green on the Hemp plant is medicine and useful for mankind and Animale.
This was one of the biggest industrial disasters of the time when this plant was band from around the world with all the lies that was told about it. Go look it up and then tell me that what I say does not make any sense when I say lets get it back in the ground for all your health benefits and jobs. Love you all. Thank you brother Janet.

. (0)
Saturday December 6, 2008, 10:32 am
And intellectual participation is always so much more interesting than merely sitting out the match as a bored (and boring) spectator.

. (0)
Saturday December 6, 2008, 10:41 am
I don't eat meat. And, yes - grains are a valuable part of a balanced diet. As are fruits. And vegetables. Obviously we require them all in order to maintain health, with no one category being more perfect than the other.

And like you I also tried, as a child, eating a fistful of grass. Not an experiment I cared to try again. I believe I will stick with pizza.

sue M (184)
Saturday December 6, 2008, 11:01 am
Lindsey, Kit and I are all friends but we disagree on some things. Here is one example. Yes, there is such a thing as the North American Union. Yes, there is a big problem with pharma and the food supply. Yes, there is a big problem with the FDA not doing it's job!
Yes, you are a spirit with a body and a mind. Science cannot explain everything nor can religion as we know it. This video is a perfect example of it. The government is known for with holding information and quite honestly I would agree with Marion on this - I would believe what is being said here before I would believe the religion side of things. We are not alone in this universe. We have no idea how far infinite goes. Truth has not been found. If truth, total truth without any little lie connected to it had been found we would not be having this conversation.
What I disagree with is how people who disagree with opinions stated are then made to feel like they need to leave. Why not welcome the chance to perhaps learn something?

Mike Tedesco (65)
Saturday December 6, 2008, 1:10 pm
Kit B.

Do you eat corn?

Darlene K (356)
Saturday December 6, 2008, 3:47 pm
Thank you Scott, and it seems that not all commenting can respectfully respond. For anyone to believe that the few dozen who control the physical functions on Earth for pure profit and greed, allow the general population all the the knowledge with Earth science that they have discovered, is really a thinking that excludes one from expanding their awareness. It is each soul's choice.

I know some very knowledgable scientist, and I am happy to know that many other scientists are not following the old paradigm to the greater controllers of this world. I think it is all in one's perspective. I learned all the wonderful math I needed in college, acquiring my degree in Business Admin. I know enough of how Earth science works and how business works on this planet that I want to know..heh. I strongly believe that they have all the cures for aids, cancer and more, but to bring that truth out would ruin the profits for the rich and greedy. Several scientists have brought documented evidence to the U.S. scientists, of how China and other nations have powerful healers. Three of these individuals shrunk a cancerous tumor in 5 minutes, with their own strong energy of healing unified among the three men. The U.S. scientists keep saying "oh, we will look at it, AFTER we find a cure for cancer." If anyone wants to understand more of this connection and these studies, I recommend Gregg Braden or John Hagelin, both are well-known scientists who have a greater understanding of what I am still learning. They have traveled to all these nations and have alot of documented evidence. There are several others too.

Most who read Scott's articles know exactly what he means and many know what I am saying, without so much explanation. OR, a response is given with one's skewed perception of what I write. I have learned that this is just how it is with a world, like ours. Many understand the comparison of the Hubble Telescope I made was for one example of how science doesn't always have truths, and can have false-truths to be shown by later developed technology. It seems that my example was spinned to serve another's purpose of antagonizing more useless discussion, because it has nothing to do with my point. lol..I obviously have a different opinion, of human beings aging into forms where many rely on the social systems. Mankind has caused most of its own plights and plagues of diseases, in which many have and are living with chemicals in so many things, pollution, destroying rainforests, and the list goes on.

I like what sue wrote..."Science cannot explain everything nor can religion, as we know it." I totally agree with this statement and is why I gave an example on the science side of this discussion. Human beings have a source within them of self-healing and so much more. Mankind has gone as far as it can in its physical growth, now it has to catch up on its growth of Light energy within..., their 'true self.' Humanity needs to reach for the stars within, just as they do in the physical world with all these wonderful and expensive gadgets of technology.

I understand it isn't everyone's choice, but it is MY choice to choose Humanity and Life on Earth as much more important than the advancements in space or any other billion dollar research. I believe Humanity has all they ever needed already, solar energy, soil to grow food, air to breath, lots of fresh water, and many resources for shelter. Now, we need to clean it all up from what we have done to it, and help the suffering and voiceless.

. (0)
Saturday December 6, 2008, 4:00 pm
Wow. I guess Chinese people must suffer from far lesser rates of cancer and substantially better survival rates than those of us here in the U.S. since they have such powerful healers. After all, traditional Chinese herbal medicine (which is used throughout China), combined with those wonderful energy healers (as well as Western medicine), must make them a largely cancer-free society.

Strangely enough, however, they seem be having some problems in that regard:

Because, of course, their cancer rates keep climbing and climbing - due to the same causes as ours - pollution, unhealthy lifestyles, and the like.

And, despite the fact that they have much more "universal" healthcare than we do, they seem to be dying in droves from cancer.

Seems their "powerful" healers aren't so powerful at all.

sue M (184)
Saturday December 6, 2008, 4:15 pm
Asia looks to cures, whereas the US looks to cover up or band aid. They were much more health oriented until the infiltration of Psychiatry. Now they have a tendency to use the same cover up senario. However, there are still those that do look for root cures and not band aids.
Here the US tells us to take out the thyroid when afflicted with hyper or hypo. Then requests that you take a pill for the rest of your life. Asia takes herbs and cures the problem.
I do not believe anyone has a cure for cancer but Aids I believe is man made and that they do have a cure.

. (0)
Saturday December 6, 2008, 4:48 pm
Considering how many cures Western medicine has come up with, I rather think that it is, in fact, searching for cures as well as trying to treat the symptoms of things for which no cures yet exist (and surely not all researchers are money-grubbing monsters who withhold cures from the populace just to enrich the coffers of the pharmaceutical industry). Some diseases have been wiped out completely. For others, only a portion of the sufferers can be actually cured (a distinct step in the right direction.)

The smallpox vaccine has wiped out the disease worldwide. Antibiotics frequently cure raging infections which once killed innumerable people (the highest mortality rate for women used to be due to infections arising out of childbirth - no longer much of a threat in developed countries due to antibiotics and a firm understanding of the germ theory of disease discovered by Western medicine) and prevent many others before they occur. Leprosy treatment is truly a magic bullet. Some types of cancer can be placed into permanent remission through chemo, radiation, and surgery (although it is never called a cure, of course - but if it doesn't return it is a de facto cure). Malaria. Diptheria. Measles. Pertussis. Typhoid. Yellow Fever. Polio. Tetanus. And a host of others.

As well as extending life and reducing pain through extraordinary surgical techniques.

Conventional medicine may not have all the answers. But it is an exceptional and ongoing success story.

Marion Y (322)
Saturday December 6, 2008, 4:51 pm
Very good points, Dar. I have not seen a medical doctor in over 15 years. At that time, I was diagnosed with two conditions that I was told "require surgery" if I was to have a fairly normal life. Surgery was out of the question for me and I fell back on alternative remedies. Through accupuncture, nutrition, exercise and clearing negative energies around me, I was able to fully heal myself. It was a slow process, but every few months I noticed enough of a difference to stay motivated and continue on with my personal healing program. No medications, no surgeries, no doctors, no great expenses, using natural healing methods that the body, mind and spirit accepts.

I'm sure several of you have your own stories too. It doesn't matter what others think about your personal healing program. All that matters is that you see success with your own work.

To take it a step further, we have the ability to heal others through our words, vibrations, good will, loving thoughts, gratitude, having a peaceful nature and giving hope to those without hope. When we are at a point of helping others spiritually, we have truly ascended to a higher level. This is where true happiness lies...helping others, not helping myself.

Yes, there is magic in the world and we are now able to explain it. Just as a smile can brighten someone's day, harsh, negative words can make others feel depressed and hopeless. Once we clean up our spirit, we have the ability to lift up others. This is what caring and sharing is all about. It costs nothing, just time and effort. And the giver is rewarded beyond measure.

Our planetary system is going through a major, transformational shift, which is shaking up our world as we know it. Many things that have been unexplained will begin to be explained. Science is limited and there is so much it doesn't yet understand because we are still using Einstein's system of relativity. E=Mc2, I think it is. For some interesting reading on this, go here.

Myth or Logic? Many thanks to Gregory for this information.

If this resonates with you, great. If not, that's also fine.


. (0)
Saturday December 6, 2008, 4:59 pm
Quite right, Marion. We do all have our own stories.

Mine is my father. Who, about 15 years ago, was literally dying from heart disease. He underwent triple bypass surgery. A complete success. He has had no further problems since and has lived at least an extra 15 healthy and happy years. Without the surgery, he would never have had those years.

My brother, Wes. Who had bacterial meningitis. Which, before antibiotics, was a deadly disease. Antibiotics cured him.

A good friend of mine. Diagnosed with breast cancer. Underwent surgery and other conventional treatments. The cancer has been in remission for over a decade.

Me. Serious, recurring, painful gallstones. My diet was altered to try and reduce or eliminate them. Didn't work. Finally the pain was so unbearable that surgery was necessary. End of problem. No complications. No problems since for about 18 years.

Yes, we do indeed all have our stories.

sue M (184)
Saturday December 6, 2008, 5:26 pm
Lindsey, there are many medicines that we need. There is no disputing that. What is disputed is that there are often alternative measures that can be taken without having to have surgery or pills.
Several years ago I was diagnosed with a Hyperactive Thyroid. I was told under no circumstance could I leave the hospital without getting Radio Active Iodine. I was told that no one could be in the room when I took it. That it would only kill the Thyroid and that I would be on a pill for the rest of my life.
I normally weighed 110llbs and went down to 60lbs within a few weeks. The Tapizol that they had me on to regulate and stabilize me was not working. I left the hospital despite being told I could be forced to have the procedure. I got straight on the net and found Chinese Herbs. Because of the condition I could not keep the three capsules down but managed to get one down. Within hours I had energy and noticed the aggravation had gone away. They were expensive but I took them because I did not want to be dependent on a pill for the rest of my life. Now 4yrs l still have my Thyroid and have not had any repercussions.
My one doctor told me sure I can take herbs but they will not work. The other doctor for my heart - because of the Thyroid refused the idea completely.
There was a discussion group posted on yahoo I think. A gal was asking for alternatives. I posted my story but the post would not go through. I kept on posting until I realized it was run by a Doctor. I posted just a regular comment anf lo and behold it went through.

. (0)
Saturday December 6, 2008, 5:37 pm
Sue, I am firmly of the opinion that all reasonable alternatives should be tried before attempting surgery or any procedure/medication which has harsher effects on the body (and many physicians, including my own, agree with that). So long as alternative drugs are clinically-tested through standard double-blind trials. And so long as any alternatives are performed/used under the care of a physician (in cases where significant illness or disease is present).

Some "alternatives" are very useful. Some are not. And some are dangerous. Just as with conventional medicine, which also contains its share of non-useful and dangerous drugs and procedures.

My main concern is with those who unfairly and unreasonably demonize medical science virtually in its entirety. And who promote "natural" alternatives as being almost exclusively good and helpful. And especially those who uncritically accept "natural" treatments when no credible evidence exists for their efficacy.

Your words are pretty reasonable and don't fall into that category of irrationality; however, a truly frightening number of people are infected with that particular brand of nonsense.

sue M (184)
Saturday December 6, 2008, 5:43 pm
I understand Lindsey and it makes sense. I agree with that. Some alternatives have not been tested. However, I find it interesting that the clinical trials do not do extensive research. My nephew was diagnosed with Osteosarcoma. He was asked to participate in a trial. There were 20 of them and it lasted for a few months before being approved. That drug has serious side effects and is only meant as a preventive after he was cleared. He is now off of it because of the drastic side effects.

. (0)
Saturday December 6, 2008, 5:59 pm
And Marion - I must say it. Other than conditions already known to be easily affected through the placebo effect, we do not "have the ability to heal others through our words, vibrations, good will, loving thoughts, gratitude, having a peaceful nature and giving hope to those without hope."

People have used kind words, good vibrations, good will, loving thoughts, gratitude, peaceful natures, and hope throughout the history of the human race - because they didn't have effective modern medical science to rely on. And they sickened and died. At far, far greater rates than today. Their lifespans were incredibly shorter. Their pain levels much higher. Their infant mortality much greater.

Prayer and kind words are nice. But they aren't cures. Not even close.

Gregory S (257)
Saturday December 6, 2008, 7:04 pm
Excellent subject. Thank you Scott.

Darlene K (356)
Saturday December 6, 2008, 9:31 pm
"Asia looks to cures, whereas the US looks to cover up or band aid."

I agree sue.., and it seems that the Western world is slowly coming around to the Eastern wisdoms, just like Marion, some haven't needed a medical doctor for years.

Looking at the whole picture is to be interpreted by each soul on its own. Everyone learns at their own pace hopefully with expanding awareness and clarity. Marion explained her perspective very well, and I agree with it. I am sure our similar view on this connection isn't just "coincidence," if I believed in them....heehee The power of prayer is HUGE if one uses strong INTENT with their prayer, as "feeling" it and not just saying it, like most of the Western world performs. Miracles are manifested everyday, if we notice them. Many don't. Much Love...Namaste

"...we have the ability to heal others through our words, vibrations, good will, loving thoughts, gratitude, having a peaceful nature and giving hope to those without hope. When we are at a point of helping others spiritually, we have truly ascended to a higher level. This is where true happiness lies...helping others, not helping myself."

Yes, and well put Marion. **big smile** I know this hard for some to grasp, and this is why it is so important to expand our awareness and consciousness. I believe, the time is over of sleeping to what has really been going on over history to humanity. All these cures and medicines wouldn't have been needed, if mankind didn't pollute the Earth, War in the name of a religion or for land, and inject so many contaminents in our food and water. Ripping up the forests and land for development, introduces more organisms into our atmosphere. Chemical and biological warfare and its other damages like DU, cause cancers just as the chemicals in many products. It is really sad that the majority of the elderly in the United States are on medications of some sort...I often wonder if we weren't meant to live longer, with the amount of destruction we seem to do to this planet and ourselves. If we have to be medicated from the diseases of today and tomorrow, in our beyond 70's...., I am not so sure it is so great to live longer. just a thought.

Past Member (59)
Sunday December 7, 2008, 7:05 am
I often find it fascinating how biblical stories correlate with the mythological ones! Love this subject and thank you Scott for sharing this!

. (0)
Sunday December 7, 2008, 7:13 am
Quite a few later mythologies, with the stories of the Bible being only one of them, were directly or generally taken from the myths of earlier civilizations and religions. Humans seem to be plagarists at heart.

Scott Shaubel (816)
Sunday December 7, 2008, 8:53 am

Maybe Ive a reason to believe
We all will be received
In graceland

Janet Wintle (87)
Sunday December 7, 2008, 9:26 am
I am a light worker down on this planet to try and get a balance back with a rightful way as given to me by my Father from the begining In deep meditation, prayer and guidance I have been shown and taught much.
We have moved out of the roll of care, into a roll of destruction.
If we do not get a balance back we will have no future.
We were created to look after this Earth and left in charge with full instructions from the Masters. These laws have been handed down since they left and in the year 2010 they will be here to do there work. It is my job to try to instruct you all in the matters of Energy and health with healing Herbs. Our Father does not make mistakes and he has given us the necessary herbs for all things. Please watch RUN FROM THE CURE BY RICK SIMPSON. This way you will see with your own eyes truth in the makeing.
I have healed many skin complaints and some were about to be operated on.
The time of my healing five days. When they whent back to the Doctors the need for an operation was canceled. Miracles are happening every day. One of them is my life.
I thank my Father every day I awake, that he has given me another chance to do something for someone. I love this World, It is a school for learning new experiences. No true wisdom comes without experiencing all things. You would all do well to by some Hemp seed Oil, Take a tablespoon each day. This regenerates all your body cells and removes unwanted Cancer cells. It boosts the immunity system. Love to you all. Janet.

. (0)
Sunday December 7, 2008, 9:42 am
Have you healed any severed spinal cords, Janet? Or any cases of end-stage renal failure? Or gangrene? In fact, how often do we ever hear clinically verified reports of faith healers ever curing any condition which is not already known to be susceptible to spontaneous remissions and psychological factors?

Because, assuming your words to be true, many skin conditions are already known to be very susceptible to psychology. Stress is often a cause of skin irritation and a reduction in that stress can often relieve it. There is no miracle in that.

Far too many people avoid necessary medical treatment in hopes of receiving cures at the hands of faith healers. Tragically, for some it proves to be a fatal mistake.

Darlene K (356)
Sunday December 7, 2008, 10:38 am
Very true Janet..., and thank you for your words. So many ways to keep us healthy, and the earlier one starts to "live" healthy then the healthier the body. I believe in reincarnations, so I see many who take on very challenging lifetimes with genetic illnesses or any other more tragic scenarios. Many blessings to all...Much Love..Namaste

Marion Y (322)
Sunday December 7, 2008, 12:32 pm
Janet ~ As always, thank you for your wisdom and healing methods. So many things you have written resonate with what I have learned, and I continue to learn even more from you, Gregory and Scott, as well as others on the path. Some of it is way out there for my understanding, but I know it is because I have not studied it and understand it yet.

As far as medical doctors go, they have a place for healing in our society. There are conditions that are so far gone, only surgery or their drugs can alleviate the excruciating pain the person is going through. What we are talking about here are conditions where there is time to correct the problem and learn to avoid it in the future.

I am not anti-doctor. I am anti-uninformed doctor. The average doctor has a limited tool kit, and that tool kit consists exclusively of drugs. Asking the average doctor to recommend a natural treatment or supplement is like asking your piano teacher to recommend a tennis racket. They are marketed heavily by the pharmaceutical industry. Doctors are taught that the solution to every illness or condition is a drug, and the competition over which drug to use is fierce. Little if any curriculum is devoted to nutrition or to any complementary medical practices in most medical schools. Medicine, at the least in this country, is a business -- and if you're in the business of selling lawn mowers, you don't talk much about golf carts.

Doctors are not nutritionists any more than plumbers are carpenters. Many are absolutely great at what they do, but they are not great at what they don't do -- teach patients how to avoid the underlying cause of disease, which is primarily lacking in nutrition, quality lifestyle and spiritual awareness.

A doctor can possibly remove the disease and mask the pain with drugs. Yet, he most likely lacks the ability to teach the patient to avoid a recurrence, which will surely happen if he doesn't understand how the condition occurred in the first place. Rather than looking at the body as a system, we need a paradigm shift that sees illness not as a collection of dysfunctional molecules that happen to reside in a body, but as a condition of the "whole person."

This means an entirely different kind of treatment, one that may include drugs, but is not limited to them, and may in many cases not include them at all. Natural medicine is a hard sell because it addresses the whole person as a system, which is absent in conventional high-tech medicine where extreme specialization is the norm. This is the opposite of holistic medicine and natural treatments. When all you've got is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail. Add the politics of medicine to the picture, and things get murkier in the world of traditional medicine.

. (0)
Sunday December 7, 2008, 12:43 pm
On the contrary, a physician's "tool-kit" consists of much more than just drugs or surgery. When I was diagnosed with carpal tunnel syndrome, my primary care physician first prescribed alterations in the physical work that I did with my hands, a different type of keyboard for my computer, hand exercises I was to do several times a day, rest periods in between typing sessions, recommendations to ice my hands down several times a day to reduce inflammation, and a variety of physical therapy sessions, which included massage and various exercises. He also prescribed general whole-body exercises to increase my circulatory health and overall general health.

And also prescribed aspirin every four hours for the discomfort and inflammation.

When all of that didn't work after awhile, I was referred to a surgeon who performed CT releases on both wrists/hands. Which substantially improved the condition to the point that I have had only very limited and livable problems with my hands since.

Physicians don't just hand out prescriptions or perform surgery on patients. They lecture patients about stopping smoking and losing weight. They lecture them about getting more exercise. They recommend healthier diets and vitamin supplements, when needed. They monitor patients' blood pressure and other aspects of their physical condition to try and catch any problems early enough so that treatment will be simpler and less invasive.

In short, they try to help us get healthy and stay healthy. And when we're not, they help alleviate the symptoms and try to cure the condition.

. (0)
Sunday December 7, 2008, 12:52 pm
Nor do all physicians jump right into surgical recommendations in other cases.

I've also had back problems for years. After my worst episode, I discussed surgery with my orthopedist. He recommended against it, saying that although it might help my condition, it also could worsen the pain. And he advised (as he ALWAYS does when seeing me), that I should lose weight, exercise more, and continue to see a physical therapist whenever the pain starts increasing.

Just as my physician has given me the honest facts about the low chance that surgery would help my chronic sinusitis. Based upon his recommendations, I chose not to have the surgery. Instead, again based on his recommendations, I use OTC sinus medicine, a NETI pot for sinus irrigation, hot packs, steam treatments, and other methods to live with the condition.

I even once had a physician send me to a hypnotherapist for pain control (which unfortunately didn't work.)

There are good physicians and bad ones. Don't lump them all into one big ball of wax.

Past Member (0)
Sunday December 7, 2008, 7:29 pm
Marion. Where did you go to Medical School? How do you know what doctors are taught or not taught. My brother and sisters are all Physicians. They went through the brutal process of becoming Doctors because they wanted to heal. My sister, an internist is in Darfur at the moment, and has learned a lot about local alternative methods of treatment. If they all worked, they would not need Sue and the other good Doctors and nurses who work with her under primitive conditions. My brother spends time with Doctors Without Borders...wherever in the world he is needed. There are no alternative treatments for cataracts, macular degeneration, or other diseases of the eye.((He is an eye surgeon. My sister, a Pediatrician, NEVER prescribes a drug for a child unless it is absolutely necessary. All three of them believe that drugs are sometimes necessary. There are diseases we can CURE with the right drugs. How would you like to be septic with no access to antibiotics? My own Physician gives me great advice on nutrition. It is because of his care, that my Cholesterol and triglicerides are normal, that, although, I am Diabetic, my sugars are always in the normal ranfe...NO medications...just diet and exercise, and the right vitamins, with a prescription for acupuncture for my back. I don't know what backwoods area of the country you come from, but you sound woefully ignorant, and that makes me sad. La di da..Let's all eat GRASS!!! Silly silly silly. And when you get ill....and you WILL...there will be a kind-hearted Physician who will help you. Don't DEMONIZE DOCTORS! You only reveal how little you really know.

Past Member (0)
Monday December 8, 2008, 3:10 am

this part,is exactly correct,from a dead Bob Marley...take note,..

But if you know what life is worth,You will look for yours on earth:
We sick an tired of-a your ism-skism game ...
-Dyin n goin to heaven in-a jesus name,.. lord.We know when we
understand:..Almighty,... God .... is a living man...You can fool some people
sometimes,..But you cant fool all the people all the time...So now we see the light
...what you gonna do?... We gonna stand up for our rights! yeah.



Past Member (59)
Monday December 8, 2008, 3:48 am
Lindsey, there are many people out there who can figure out the truth from fiction by instinct. Some call it 'inner knowing' and yet others refer to it as discernment. They may or may not be able to prove the cause for every speck of dust, but they know instinctively what the truth is. I guess personal beliefs are born out of personal experiences, regardless of who believes the story and who doesnt.

Past Member (0)
Monday December 8, 2008, 8:09 am
All this fuss because of that video?

Are we an experiment carried out by an alien species? I don't have the answer for that. No one does!

I consider myself an open minded person. I am not religious and do not believe our fate is already written down. I don't believe in a celestial father. Why isn't it a celestial mother? Isn't it interesting that all religions are dominated by men and at the same time in all of them the supreme being is a male?

This doesn't mean I'm not a spiritual person, on the contrary.
I also don't regard science as the religion of the 21st century as so many do! I don't see scientists as supreme beings or prophets. They are humans like the rest of us. They are not superior and some of them are actually not very intelligent people!

What I do know is that if we all worked together in spite of our differences, we would have evolved so much more a long time ago.
Traditional medicine and conventional medicine should work together instead of their members fighting against each other.

There are diseases that one is better at and there are others the other is better at.
Have you ever heard of the placebo effect?
That's a scientific proof of the power of the mind over the body. This is just an example.

No true scientist can say something doesn't exist or that it's false just because (s)he can't prove it. Moreover science is made of try and error...

I also know that we're not alone in the universe... I mean, come on! Are we that special? NO! Now imagine that a more intelligent evolved species comes to earth! Can you imagine what a barbaric society we would be to them? We kill each other, we make wars in the name of religion, we rape our children, we torture animals and use them as we see fit, we are destroying our own planet, the only place for us to live in. Now, those aren't the actions of an evolved species...

I also don't believe in doomsdays. We create our own fate and we're doing a very crappy job at it!
It's in our hands to create a good future our our end.

Instead of attacking each other why not learn from one another?
Look, I have no tolerance whatsoever for animal cruelty or cruelty towards other people and for the destruction of the environment... apart from that let everyone do whatever they wish or feel it's right!

Science doesn't explain everything - for all of those who believe that anything which can't be proven by science doesn't exist, can you explain to me how I managed to levitate both my arms for about 30 minutes during a meditation? I was alone, and they just lifted and spread apart and remained up in the air for that period of time without any pain or discomfort! No, I wasn't sleeping or dreaming and yes I'm a very sane person!!!

Nevertheless, I also have a very hard time in believing (no, I actually believe that's a load of crap but that's my opinion) in heaven and hell or in a god and a satan!
I know we live several lives and we're here to experience and learn as much as possible and evolve.
But I have so much more to understand and it's not going to be science or religions who are going to taught me that! It's going to be me through my effort and search...

Regarding human race being controlled... Oh yeah, most humans are zombies so easy to control!
Look around! We are leading our lives the way society wants us to. This alleged crisis (isn't it curious that it only emerged when Senator Obama - the reflection of the change people desire all over the world - was ahead in the polls and eventually was elected President?) is just another way to keep us under constant fear and thus control!
Divide to conquer! Everyone that still have a job is so willing to keep it that they won't protest against anything and will work harder and harder.

WE are in fact a very zombified society, without direction and heading towards the abyss. But this is our fault and not because of some religious prophecy.

I truly believe this is a time of change. People out there feel it! However it is up to us to change for the better and create a great future for all of us or fall asleep and ultimately create our own doomsday!

Open your eyes and do something! Don't wait for 'it' to come to you! Then you won't be given a choice!

Thank you and blessed be!

Marion Y (322)
Monday December 8, 2008, 8:33 am
Julie ~ My statements were not an indictment against physicians. Please read again my post. I'm saying most are not trained in alternative and holistic medicine. Many are now learning about the field as they realize it is a valid, growing field that people are requesting. It is a personal choice where the individual goes to get their help. Unless you have been trained in alternative methods, you are ill-equipped to discuss it.

If we all ate grass primarily, there would be less of a need for medical help as the body would be in a pure state because the blood would be pure and free of the garbage from dead meat, gmo foods, and sorely lacking nutrients in most foods.

Maybe if you ate grass, you wouldn't be so angry and feel the need to lash out in an unprofessional manner. What we think, say and do is all a personal choice. Those choices reflect in our appearance, how we think, feel, how the body responds and throws off dis-ease and the results we see in our relationships and achieving our goals.

Will your doctor tell you that back problems are a result of pent up anger, frustration and a controlling nature? Maybe, but highly unlikely that he would. Would he tell you that kidney and gall stones are a result of a heavy meat eater who avoids fresh fruit and vegetables that aren't overprocessed and overcooked or microwaved to death? That diabetes can be eliminated by drinking lots of water, and avoiding white sugar, salt, white flour and all refined and processed foods? That being in denial, living in fear and lying to ourselves keeps these dis-eases clinging to our bodies as we manipulate and play with the rules of diet and exercise?

Did you know that by attacking me in this thread perpetuates your ailments and worsens them? Learn to control your temper rather than attack others and you will see an improvement in your health. I'm not a doctor, nor would I want to be. However, I have healed my own body, helped others heal theirs and always recommend people visit their doctor before they venture off on their own.

I'm so glad we have choices.

Past Member (0)
Monday December 8, 2008, 8:34 am

I truly believe this is a time of change. People out there feel it! However it is up to us to change for the better and create a great future for all of us or fall asleep and ultimately create our own doomsday!

Open your eyes and do something! Don't wait for 'it' to come to you! Then you won't be given a choice!


. (0)
Monday December 8, 2008, 8:48 am
Considering that throughout all of humananity's stay on this earth except for the past century or so humans have eaten diets that were organic, not overprocessed, and largely in a much more "natural" state that our own diets today, it's surprising indeed that they weren't healthier than we are. Because, of course, they weren't.

The average life expectancy of those earlier humans was so substantially less than our own, ranging in earliest time from perhaps around 20 years to around the 40's at the turn of the 20th century. And they died for all the same reasons that we do today - disease, illness, injury, and the like.

It seems, therefore, that our "overprocessed, microwaved, etc." foods aren't killing us at earlier ages - in fact, our average lifespan today is in the mid-70's for Americans.


Kit B (276)
Monday December 8, 2008, 8:54 am
Geez, Marion one would have to ask, just how thin is the air way up there? As you in your near perfection attempt to throw lighting bolts on the rest of us flawed fools. Btw, I have St. Augustine grass, so how's that for munching? Should it be breakfast-lunch, or maybe with lemon for dinner? I think I'll keep my garden and leave the grass for animals who are supposed to eat grass. I have yet to meet a doctor who didn't bring alternative medicine and other ideas into their practice, so your judgement may be altered by lack of proper nutrition. You have "healed" others? In this country our healer are medical doctors, I seriously doubt you have your Medical Doctor license, and just what if you are wrong then do harm? Of course, that is probably the ill person's fault, they need to realign their thinking and be another one of the clones the repeat endlessly the same blather.

. (0)
Monday December 8, 2008, 9:01 am
Additionally, human populations have been steadily growing taller throughout the ages, which is considered to be due to better nutrition. We are today, on average, taller than even our ancestors a century ago - because we have better nutrition on average.

From Scientific American in an article about the phenomenon of increasing tallness of humans:

"....conditions of poor nutrition are well correlated to smaller stature."

Past Member (0)
Monday December 8, 2008, 9:05 am
Marion. Since when am I an angry person? I am known by all who truly know me as positive, happy-go-lucky person who loves to laugh and loves to love. My bad back was cause over many years due to injury, and the fact, that as human beings we walk upright. Back problems are in most of our futures. As for lying around all day eating I don't know what to say. I eat a balanced diet, full of grains, vegetables, and fruits. I am vegetarian. Meat does not clog my arteries. I eat only organic produce grown locally. I eat no sugars or processed food. I am not overweight. I exercise everyday. Grass is not without hazards. My horse is insulin resistant from over-indulging in grass. I have to limit her access to it. So. Whatever you want to do. Lay around and eat grass. But, the way, I see it...between the grass-eaters, and Kent, this is the silliest thread I have ever read. It's good for light entertainment, though. Listen to Lindsey. She is one of the most thoughtful, reasonable, and respectful bloggers out there.

Kit B (276)
Monday December 8, 2008, 9:15 am
huh oh, Lindsey and Julie now you've done it, gone and used some real facts, not sure that is allowed here. I do have to wonder why it is that all animals that live from grasses, become ill? Many die from these illnesses and still their diets lack processed foods of any kind. No white sugar or white flour not even the influence of man-made products, maybe they haven't been properly educated? I must agree with Julie, although it is entertaining to read all of this, it is silly.

Darlene K (356)
Monday December 8, 2008, 4:50 pm
...tippy toes back into comment, heh. I don't think anyone is implying that the whole medical community is useless..., at least not at this point of life on Earth's history. A good point is how the western world won't bring forth some truth, regarding self-healing and excellent holistic methods of healing. Not good business. Not for Pharma Industry, at all. In my humble opinion, I think there needs to be a balance. The western population should be allowed the information in the educating institutions, at the very least to have an option, if they choose, so they don't only have the medical profession and medications to rely on. Some of this discussion embraces different beliefs too. I respect others beliefs as I hope mine would be respected, too. Cid, thank you for your comment. Much Love...Namaste

Past Member (0)
Monday December 8, 2008, 8:10 pm
FYI Dar. Physicians must continue their education. They do that through seminars. Many of them involve alternative medicines and alternative treatments. Pick up a Professional journal some day...Read what your Doctors are reading.

Past Member (0)
Monday December 8, 2008, 8:16 pm
There is TONS of sugars in grass. Sugar is sugar. My horse has the human equivalent of diabetes. I treat it by limiting her grazing time, feeding her hay, and providing her with plenty of exercise.

Darlene K (356)
Monday December 8, 2008, 8:23 pm
Julie, I unfortunately do have a few doctors, and endure my own medical challenges, but SOME of them choose to further study and bring into their practice alternative medicines and alternative treatments. Many don't, in my opinion. Oh and one of my older sisters is an RN, and we have similar opinions. Thank you for your advice. Again, it is a balance needed, and I agree to disagree with your last reply to me. I respect your opinion.

Past Member (0)
Monday December 8, 2008, 8:38 pm
Dar...So you do have a few Doctors. Why is that so unfortunate for you? They must help you in some way, or you would not seek them out. My physician prescribes acupuncture for my back, and tea for my sleep problem, and other herbal teas for digestive upsets, which I had many years ago, before I became vegetarian. He does not prescribe medication for my diabetes. I control that through diet and exercise. So your sister is an RN. Okay. I respect nurses. But I come from a family of Physicians. I know what they're currently talking about...a LOT about alternative therapies, etc. They are wonderful, ethical healers. Drug company salespeople are barred from their offices. I also respect your opinion. But don't start bashing Docs, or I will rain on you. All Doctors are different. MOST docs are caring professionals who want only the best for their patients. I'm sorry if you live in a less progressive area than I do. Ann Arbor is a very enlightened area. But if you don't respect your Physician, find one you CAN respect. One who is open-minded and sincere and preferably not attached to an HMO. Feel better.

Darlene K (356)
Monday December 8, 2008, 8:56 pm
Look at the bigger picture Julie. It would have been ideal and wonderful to NOT have any medical challenges, where only the medical profession is allowed mainstream attention. That is what I mean..., and I hope this clarifies what I meant. I know many who are healthy with no medical problems, so this is can be achieved but their lifestyle is a catalyst for their energy and good health.

This is why I respect your opinion. However, I trust you will tend your "raining" on me to the rules of the site. If I don't like Doctors, or say something negative of this field, I can and will express it.., with respect. Sorry not everyone is Pro-Doctors.

Ann Arbor??? Yes, I am very familiar with it, and U of M University Hospital..., and I won't even get in this discussion, as my experiences with them haven't been the happiest, but that is just me. It is one of the best and gets oodles of funding for their continued research programs and such. There are some very arrogant doctors with awful beside manners, in that hospital, and even you can't deny that. Egos run high in this prestiges places. I live in Metro-Detroit area, in the suburbs..., yeah it cost too much for me to live in Ann Arbor, I can't afford those taxes nor mortgages. We could have used those jobs here, in my area, with Google, but we weren't their choice I guess.

Past Member (0)
Tuesday December 9, 2008, 1:37 pm
Dar, I do understand what you are saying, I just don't like it when someone makes a blanket statement about an entire profession. I am not a big fan of U of M Hospitals either. I went into the ER last years after being charged by a horse and being knocked unconscious. The first resident to see me asked me if I was "sure I had been run over by a horse." I just stared him down. Then he asked if there were any "witnesses." I said "YES, MO****-F****R!! After that I received excellent care. The U of M ER docs are famous for their lack of bedside manner, but NOT for their lack of expertise. My brother and sisters were trained at Indiana University School of Medicine...where bedside manner is emphasized. There are actually some excellent hospitals in the Metro area...Henry Ford, the Hospital in Royal Oak (I can't recall the name at the moment) My personal Physician is the head of U of M Health Center in Chelsea. I don't live there anymore, but continue to see him because he is SO open-minded, kind, and knowledgeable...especially in the area of alternative therapies and medicines. I trust him. That's what it is all about. Trust. As in any profession, sometimes it seems as if the entire profession sucks. When my kids were young, I was convinced all teachers were stupid. Untrue. Only some were idiots. The rest were wonderful. But then the Ann Arbor Public School System is rated as one of the top ten in the country. My concern about making blanket statements about doctors involves, someone more naive than you reading that who may NEED an M.D. and try useless alternatives first, and end up getting sicker as a result. Yeah. Some alternative therapies just don't work, and others work for some people, but not all. I am not exactly "Pro-Doctor". I am "Pro-Healer". Yeah. Ann Arbor is expensive. Ridiculously so. But I don't regret living in the are. It has SO much to offer. Let's make peace here, Dar. We actually agree more than we disagree. Peace.

Darlene K (356)
Tuesday December 9, 2008, 8:11 pm
Oh heck, Julie.., that is my whole problem, I am not the gal who will say what you said to get action. It is terrible that we have to get aggressive sometimes, but you are correct..., and it is probably why I get nowhere with my medical I need to take control more, with some of these guys. If they would just stop for 5 minutes and actually listen to what I am saying...., everything would go sooo much smoother. So many are always in a rush, or distracted, ugh.. I am finding that working with Love and Light, certainly doesn't work everytime with all doctors,....heh.

Yes, Henry Ford and Beaumont are very good hospitals. Pro-Healer! Yeah! me too. All good with me Julie, I agree with you. Ann Arbor and West Bloomfield are the only good public school systems that can think of, in the area. The other public school systems are pityful, just pityful. I hope we can bring some change for the public school system for the future children. Great chatting with ya, Julie. Blessings and Namaste

Past Member (0)
Tuesday December 9, 2008, 9:33 pm
In a hospital...especially an ER, you MUST stand up for yourself sometimes...I don't like to yell at Doctors. It is a last resort. But I do what I need to do to receive the care I need. Sometimes, I refuse to talk to the resident and demand to talk to the attending. However in defense of residents, they are over-worked and under-paid, AND inexperienced. Sometimes they are working on 36 hours with no sleep. I do apprecate the common ground we share. Peace..julie
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