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Saudi Arabia: Two Men To Stand Trial For Converting Woman To Christianity, Illegal In This Sharia Ruled Land


Society & Culture  (tags: Saudi Arabia, Apostasy, Conversion to Christianity, Death Penalty, Intolerance, No Religious Freedom, crime, religion, rights, women )

Rob and J
- 821 days ago - barnabasfund.org
After apparently converting, the woman went to Lebanon, where she received help from a Christian group, and she is now said to be in the UK. Conversion to Christianity is punishable by death in Saudi Arabia. Islam is the only legal religion.



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Comments

Past Member (0)
Sunday August 26, 2012, 4:45 am
"The young woman's father filed a police complaint against the two men, with whom his daughter worked in Al-Khobar, eastern Saudi Arabia. He claims that her expatriate Lebanese boss, Henna Sarkees, a Christian, influenced his daughter, encouraging her to leave Islam. Investigators have concluded that the Saudi man, whose name has not been made public, helped the woman get the papers required to leave the country, without her family's knowledge.
The two men are due to stand trial on 15 September in what is said to be an unprecedented case. It has sparked outrage in Saudi Arabia, with some calling for a harsh penalty.
The Lebanese man reportedly gave the Saudi woman books on Christianity and invited her to take part in online religious chat rooms. After apparently converting, the woman went to Lebanon, where she received help from a Christian group, and she is now said to be in the UK.
Conversion to Christianity is punishable by death in Saudi Arabia, where an extreme and puritanical version of Islam, Wahhabism, is strictly enforced.
Women are not allowed to have a passport without the permission of their guardian (father, husband or other male relative)."
 

Bernard Cronyn (31)
Sunday August 26, 2012, 4:47 am
Saudi Arabia is the birth place of the peaceful and tolerant religion of Islam. At least those are the favored adjectives used by their Left wing supporters on Care2 and in the Obama administration. We will have to be careful not to criticize in any way the legal system of the birth place of Islam otherwise we will incur the wrath and name calling of those that say that the policy of an Islamic country has absolutely nothing to do with the majority of supporters of said religion. Logic as always is buried beneath PC rhetoric.
 

Carola May (20)
Sunday August 26, 2012, 4:49 am
Why is Saudi Arabia allowed in the UN, along with all the other hate states (no Muslim ruled land has freedom of religion, conscience, speech or press) who refuse to even pretend to believe in the UN Declaration on Human Rights (Muslim ruled countries have their own 'Cairo Declaration' based on Sharia law which contradicts most of the UN Declaration on the rights of women, children, LGBT people and all freedoms westerners take for granted)?

I'm sure the usual 'liberal' Islam boosters will flock here to defend this atrocity and blame the victims, yet if this was a Christian converting to Islam and being given death sentences or any punishment they'd scream bloody murder. What hypocrites, all of them. A true Liberal always stands for freedom and the victims against all ideologies of hate and tyranny.

For those faux-liberals who will scream 'hatemonger' and 'islamophobe' at those of us who condemn this kind of hate and support the rights of the victim, let them tell us they actually believe in Islam's hate and intolerance because it does teach these barbaric things:

"...for the Prophet said, 'If somebody (a Muslim) discards his religion, kill him."' Sahih Bukhari, Book 52, Volume 4, Number 260 AND:
Mohammed said to kill apostates, for there is a reward for killing of those who go out of Islam. Bukhari vol.6 book 61 no.577 p.519

The following website,' ask the imam', gives clearly the Islamic command to kill apostates with a list of hadith:
http://www.askimam.org/fatwa/fatwa.php?askid=ed789a1ea6f6b16dfe39247bb10735ac

All four major schools of Sunni Islamic jurisprudence state that the apostate is to be put to
death. Mawdudi cites the writings of the four schools:
http://answering-islam.org/Silas/apostasy.htm
 

Rob and Jay B. (121)
Sunday August 26, 2012, 4:54 am
Good question Carola M! And another very good one is why do so many Western leaders, Obama in particular who actually bowed to the 'king' of this tyrannical, intolerant, oppressive, totally lacking in any basic human rights religious dictatorship? They criticize China on human rights, but China is a paradise compared to Saudi A, and many other Islamic dominated lands. It can't be just the oil either as many countries now have large reserves so oil from these despotic tyrannies aren't needed. Beggars belief.

Let's see if Obama speaks out against this as he would if it were a Christian country punishing conversion to this 'religion of peace and tolerance'. Don't wait up...
 

. (0)
Sunday August 26, 2012, 5:00 am
Islam teaches, female subjugation, violence and death; Christianity teaches equility for all, peace and love. Is this so difficult to understand? Obviously.
 

Carola May (20)
Sunday August 26, 2012, 5:05 am
BTW, I wonder if the UK will have the courage and cojones to stand up to these primitive despots and protect this woman? She will probably have to live in hiding so as not to be killed by Orthodox Muslims living in the UK or Saudi assassins sent to 'redeem their honour'.

Channel 4 TV here did a documentary on the difficult lives of ex-Muslims who have converted to Christianity here. They estimate some 3000 live in hiding due to death threats and violent attacks against them. Why does our government turn a blind eye to this hate and barbarism that goes against every thing we claim to believe in?
 

Azaima A. (224)
Sunday August 26, 2012, 5:11 am
thanks
 

Tommy S. (11)
Sunday August 26, 2012, 5:52 am
Welcome to islam- Satan is in his heaven
 

Sandra K. (8)
Sunday August 26, 2012, 7:11 am
Pam B: Christianity most definitely does NOT teach equality for all, regardless of what you might wish it teaches. I'd suggest reading your bible a tad more thoroughly.

I worked with several people in Indonesia who had converted to both Islam and Christianity due to the Indonesian government's archaic laws which will not allow a Muslim to marry a Christian, or a Christian to marry a Muslim. As a result, these people's families had disowned them. This is a far bigger tragedy in that country than it might be in a Western country due to societal/familial connections within Indonesian culture. Those who had converted to Christianity were often harassed & threatened with violence by hardline Islamic freaks, while those who converted to Islam were pretty much left alone. Saudi Arabia is even more backwards, as can be seen from this article. Saudis often hire maids and other 'domestic workers' & labourers, many of which end up raped, mutilated, executed, beaten, murdered or disappeared at the hands of Saudis. Yet the Indonesian government keeps sending their own citizens to this sh1t hole, knowing full well what happens to them. And every time something like this happens, the Indonesian president - I loathe that man - makes empty promises to his people, promising to 'do something' so his citizens can stay home & make enough money to feed their families. There have also been forced conversions to Islam of maids who are Christian by their 'employers'. 'Slave keepers' is a more appropriate and true term to use for these pigs with penises in dresses. Any Western person who tells you they've lived & worked in Saudi Arabia with no problems is clueless. Foreigners like this live in compounds for the 'rich white people', separate from the rest of Saudi society, where they can drink, fornicate and do pretty much whatever they please. They have no clue what day to day life is truly like in Saudi Arabia.
 

Sandra K. (8)
Sunday August 26, 2012, 7:17 am
And incidentally, such laws restricting women's freedoms exist in Indonesia as well. In order for a woman to get married, she must have the permission of her father. If her father is not alive, then she must have the permission of her oldest living male relative which is closest to her, such as a brother, uncle, cousin, etc. In order to leave the country, a married woman is technically required to have a letter of permission from her husband. Same rule pertains to leaving the country with her children. Permission must be shown in the form of a notarized letter. Islamic countries are hell on earth for anybody without a penis.
 

Rob and Jay B. (121)
Sunday August 26, 2012, 7:41 am
Your comments are particularly important, Sandra K, as you are an ex-Muslim and have lived in this area. We hope you and your husband are safe and can get on with your lives without fear of reprisal for leaving Islam. We have read of the thousands of Muslims who have left Islam or converted to Christianity in the West who must live in fear and hiding for doing so, even here. All the best to you both.

Why aren't these oppressive, brutal, intolerant countries ostracized by the civilized world? The US has been trying to isolate and destroy Cuba for decades, and it is a paradise of human rights compared to most Muslim occupied countries, yet US presidents and other western leaders bend over backward to do the Saudis bidding in everything they desire, from overthrowing Saddam to backing the so-called Arab Spring, which was a Saudi, and their Muslim Brotherhood lackies, goal and dream.
 

Teresa W. (696)
Sunday August 26, 2012, 7:57 am
outrageous
 

Joan H. (20)
Sunday August 26, 2012, 8:19 am
Carola that was a very good question. There's probably a money trail somewhere is my guess.

Pam I know what you meant to say. I'll take Christianity anyday over Islam.
 

Beatrice B. (115)
Sunday August 26, 2012, 10:32 am
Pam: Some - no, many - think that their Christian freedom allows them to believe exactly as they please. This is a misconception, for God places a boundary around our thoughts as well as around our actions. Sadly, a majority of Believers have a motley collection of thoughts that they call 'theology', but it is not God's theology.

A certain truism states that 'there is freedom only in restriction'.

http://www.christiandoctrine.net/doctrine/articles/article_00002_what_are_christian_freedoms_web.htm
 

Carol Dreeszen (362)
Sunday August 26, 2012, 10:45 am
Islam is totally insane!!!!!! Thanks Sandra K for your informative and true input!!
 

Stan B. (122)
Sunday August 26, 2012, 4:44 pm
There's one law for Muslims and a different one for everybody else. I wonder for how long "everybody else" is
going to put up with this duplicity.
 

Marc H. (5)
Monday August 27, 2012, 4:40 am
islam should be banned. It is much worse than Nazism. Most people are offended by Nazism, and yet they defend islam and say it's "just another religion". it clearly is not. at least if you open your eyes. actually, half an eye is enough. islam goes against most of the US constitution, and it clearly violates most UN conventions. WHY is this HORRIBLE INSANE ideology allowed and AT ALL tolerated by the FAR FAR SUPERIOR and WAY MORE progressive non-muslim countries??!? It's crazy!

I say ridicule it, expose it, and ban it! There is NOTHING to be gained from it, so why at all let it in?
 

Gene Jacobson (255)
Monday August 27, 2012, 8:33 am
"Why is Saudi Arabia allowed in the UN, along with all the other hate states (no Muslim ruled land has freedom of religion, conscience, speech or press) who refuse to even pretend to believe in the UN Declaration on Human Rights (Muslim ruled countries have their own 'Cairo Declaration' based on Sharia law which contradicts most of the UN Declaration on the rights of women, children, LGBT people and all freedoms westerners take for granted)?"

The "news" only gets worse from these most intolerant of nations, freedom isn't a word in their language or their law. I saw a story this morning of 17 Afghan citizens being beheaded, including two women, for attending a party that had music. 17 cold blooded, and very horrificly bloody murders, over MUSIC. There is no excuse for barbarism anywhere in this world, and Carola is right any nation that practices such should be excluded from the United Nations and shunned by the civilized world. My real fear is for the people of those countries left alone to fight terroists sanctioned by their "state".

 

Frans Badenhorst (558)
Tuesday August 28, 2012, 3:46 am
ridicilous in my opinion
 

Giana Peranio-Paz (386)
Tuesday August 28, 2012, 4:45 am
The pendulum is swinging to the end of the earth - to these terrible right religious extremes - very frightening! How will this end?
 

Stan B. (122)
Tuesday August 28, 2012, 1:32 pm
Here's another example of Saudi " justice " which the Egyptians have been quite happy to keep quiet.

CAIRO — Human-rights activists are demanding the release of Nagla Wafa, an Egyptian wedding planner and designer sentenced to 500 lashes and five years in prison in Saudi Arabia following a business dispute with a princess.

Wafa ran afoul of a royal in the Saudi kingdom over the finances of a joint business venture, according to her family. She was reportedly accused of cashing a check from the princess but not following through on their deal to start a restaurant.

“As of May of 2012, Ms. Wafa has been subjected, on a weekly basis, to 50 floggings per week within the ‘Al-Malz’ Prison. She currently faces 200 more floggings ... despite her suffering from distortions to her spine,” the Egyptian Organization for Human Rights said in an online statement.

Accusing Saudi Arabian authorities of unlawfully detaining the 39-year-old mother of teenage twins, the organization said the case was a “blatant violation” of human rights and filed a complaint with the United Nations Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs.

Nashwa Ismael, Wafa’s mother, who lives in Cairo, said her daughter wasn’t accused of fraud charges until about 20 months after she was arrested in 2009. Ismael said the family wasn’t able to find a Saudi Arabian lawyer to take Wafa’s case until June, when they first went public with the issue.

“Nagla’s case should have appeared before a business court and she should have been notified of her accusations right away,“ Ismael told The Times.

Ismael added that since the family decided to go public, Saudi Arabian authorities have kept Wafa from outside contact. She was previously allowed one phone call a month.

“Last time I spoke with her was about a month ago. She was utterly devastated and tired because she lost everything, her sons, her livelihood,” Ismael said.

Egypt’s National Council for Women has also sent a letter to the Saudi Arabian ambassador in Cairo demanding Wafa’s release for “lack of conviction.” The council urged Saudi Arabian authorities to halt Wafa’s flogging sentence.

About 2 million Egyptian expatriates currently live and work in Saudi Arabia. Over the years, Egyptian human-rights activists and protesters have repeatedly accused Saudi Arabian officials of mistreating Egyptian nationals, who travel to there seeking better job opportunities.

In April, the two Arab countries had a falling out when hundreds of Egyptians protested outside the kingdom’s embassy in Cairo for the release of Egyptian lawyer Ahmed al-Gizawi, who was arrested on drug charges while traveling to Saudi Arabia for a pilgrimage.

The protests forced the kingdom to recall its ambassador and shut down the embassy. At the time, analysts said Egypt-Saudi relations hadn’t witnessed such a strain since Egypt signed the Camp David Peace treaty with Israel in 1979.

As Egyptian human-rights advocates continue to demand Wafa's release, Saudi Arabian and Egyptian officials have not commented on the case.

Essam Al-Arian, vice chairman of the Muslim Brotherhood’s Freedom and Justice Party, has become one of the few Egyptian politicians to push for her freedom.

“The [Egyptian] foreign ministry is still silent about Nagla Wafa, who is imprisoned in Saudi Arabia. Why doesn’t the kingdom announce the truths of the case so that such regretful mishaps do not recur? We need clarity,” he said on his official Twitter account.

Wafa’s mother said Egyptian officials have failed to reach out to the family to learn more about Nagla’s case.

“The Egyptian ambassador in Saudi Arabia is more worried about his prestige and salary, rather than doing his job by helping the Egyptian people residing in Saudi Arabia. These kinds of problems have affected many Egyptians abroad, not just us,” she said.

The last paragraph speaks volumes.
From the LA Times: Aug 27.
 

Henrik Thorsen (28)
Tuesday August 28, 2012, 2:38 pm
In a Dark Age theocracy like Saudi Arabia, insanity is the rule and sanity the exception.
 

marie c. (168)
Tuesday August 28, 2012, 4:17 pm
Can not currently send a green star to R and J as you have done so within the last week
Such good honest comments on this thread running out of green stars
 

anne barusta (0)
Tuesday August 28, 2012, 5:40 pm
thanks
 

Christopher Fowler (84)
Tuesday August 28, 2012, 7:51 pm
All you Islam-bashing, far right Christians piss and moan about this sort of thing, but I wonder if you would be so outraged at a nation that did the same to those who converted someone away from Christianity.

Those of you who are claiming that this is a Christian nation, or are trying to turn it into one, take heed; The Middle East is exactly what you will get, if you get your way. The only real difference will be what religion makes the laws.

Be careful what you wish for; you may not like it once you get it.
 

Past Member (0)
Wednesday August 29, 2012, 12:33 am
Let's cut to the chase, people. It is time we acknowledged that no real foundation exists within the canons of Christianity, Islam, Judaism, or any of our other faiths for religious tolerance and religious diversity. Words like 'God' and 'Allah' must go the way of 'Apollo' and 'Baal' or they will unmake our world. We must find our way to a time when faith, without evidence, disgraces anyone who would claim it.
 

Bernard Cronyn (31)
Wednesday August 29, 2012, 1:20 am
So often on the Internet I am just blown away by the awesome intuition and knowledge of writers, be they commentators or journalists. Take Mr Fowler he intuitively knows enough about people who have an issue with Islamic law as applied in this case to label them “Islam-bashing, far right Christians”. He also knows exactly that these detractors (suitably labelled) will bring to the USA; “The Middle East is exactly what you will get, if you get your way. The only real difference will be what religion makes the laws.” I am not a follower of any religious faith but in my limited knowledge on this subject, the only declared Christian (non-secular) country I know of is the Vatican State. I scratched my head and Googled far and wide and still could not come up with any recent incidences of el Papa putting people on trial for a similar offence. In addition I could find nothing indicating recent Papal ordered stonings, beheadings or even application of the Saudi style, 200 lashes. My I am so non-intuitive!
 

Tom Edgar (56)
Wednesday August 29, 2012, 1:38 am
I only wonder at the reaction if she had converted to the one ideology that is esteemed lower than a cesspit, (certainly below Islam), in the U S A. Atheism. In spite of the estimate of 25% non believers in the U S A. The stigma is so harsh that most will not publicly declare, knowing full well they do not even enjoy the social status of Homosexuals. You even have some States that actually prohibit atheists from public office. Stop being so bloody holier than thou until you clean up your own act.
 

marie c. (168)
Wednesday August 29, 2012, 4:10 am
Can not send a green star to Bernard Cronyn as have done so within the last week
 

Rob and Jay B. (121)
Wednesday August 29, 2012, 5:46 am
Christopher Fowler, when's the last time you read of someone converting from Christianity to Islam (or any other ideology) who was stoned or beheaded? What Western advanced nation, built on the ethics of Judeo-Christian morals, is it illegal to leave Christianity or Judaism? Not even in Israel. ONLY in Islam is it the death penalty to leave this ugly cult of death and intolerance, just like the mafia.

Your bigotry against Christians is blinding you to defend the most hateful and intolerant ideology on earth today. Where did Jesus ever call for the killin of anyone, let alone anyone who rejected him?

Mohammed did command the killing of those who criticize or leave Islam, along with gay people and rape victims. Your ignorance of the tenets of these different teachings is embarrassing. Just because right wing bigots in the US may call themselves Christian doesn't mean they are.

Here's what the Reliance of the Traveller, the premier text on Sunni Islam jurisprudence/Sharia law says:

FROM ‘THE RELIANCE OF THE TRAVELLER’ (http://www.islamicbulletin.com/free_downloads/resources/reliance2_complete.pdf )
05.4 (0: There is no expiation for killing someone who has left Islam, a highwayman (def: 015),
or a convicted married adulterer, even when someone besides the caliph kills him.) AND
“Leaving Islam is the ugliest form of unbelief (kufr) and the worst…..When a person who has reached puberty and is sane voluntarily apostasizes from Islam, he deserves to be killed…
There is no indemnity for killing an apostate…” (‘Umdat al-Salik, Reliance of the Traveler, Chapter 08.0-08.4)

Here's what the mass murderer, rapist, sex slave owner, pedophile, bandit Mohammed said:

"...for the Prophet said, 'If somebody (a Muslim) discards his religion, kill him."' Sahih Bukhari, Book 52, Volume 4, Number 260

The following website, ask the imam, gives clearly the Islamic command to kill apostates with a list of hadith:
http://www.askimam.org/fatwa/fatwa.php?askid=ed789a1ea6f6b16dfe39247bb10735ac

Now please show us the verses from the Gospels where Jesus said any such thing? He even said love your enemies, but Mohammed said for Muslims to only care about each other and to show harshness and to kill non-Muslims.

Your hatred is making a fool of you.
 

. (7)
Wednesday August 29, 2012, 8:46 am
Congratulations, Rob and Jay, on having this article make front page. I'm tickled to see it there. There are literally thousands of articles like this that need to be made known. This, and others that are being posted more and more, are a welcome sight to counter the outrageously and overtly deceptive pro-Islam propaganda that C2 and other Liberal-Left web and media sites put out.

I cannot seem to note this article, sorry to say.
 

. (7)
Wednesday August 29, 2012, 8:49 am
It looks like Care2 took this article off the "most active today". There seems to be a pattern when a negative article about Islam gets to the Front Pages. Could it be that Care2 is again using a heavy hand in censoring articles unsympathetic and dead-on accurate about Islam?
 

. (7)
Wednesday August 29, 2012, 8:52 am
It just occurred to me that THAT may be the reason I cannot note the article, because its addtional and increasing Note count would be that much more justification to be on the Front Page and listed in "the most active today" and offer people a chance to read about the oppression and tyranny inherent in Islam.
 

Paula M. (39)
Wednesday August 29, 2012, 3:14 pm
Thank you for this article.
 

Ruth R. (219)
Wednesday August 29, 2012, 6:32 pm
Excellent website. Good find.
 

Gloria H. (88)
Wednesday August 29, 2012, 7:29 pm
thats what happens when you don't separate church and state.. I question whether this was about her converting or that she left the country without papers. (not that she could get any in the first place).
I am more leery here about fundamentalists who pound on my door trying to convert me. After all...these guys know where I live.
 

holly masih (66)
Monday September 3, 2012, 6:59 am
Regardless of anyone's opinions about islam,Christianity,or any other religion,everyone should be entitled to choose whatever religion they want to,and no one should have a right to take that away from them.Religion does not cause all of this strife-intolerance in the name of religion does.No one should persecute anyone for their religious beliefs,whether it is by passing biased laws,or just insulting their intelligence because of their beliefs.It all falls into the category of intolerance.If you are going to fight for human rights,that is great,we all need to do that,but please do so for everyone,not just those who share your opinion.
 
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