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How Could This Happen in America?

US Politics & Gov't  (tags: abuse, americans, congress, cover-up, crime, dishonesty, freedoms, Govtfearmongering, lies, media, police-state, politics, propaganda )

- 2363 days ago -
Why is the armed might of the state, (necessary in waging war against foreign enemies) being applied to domestic policing of local communities and peaceful protests?

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Kit B (276)
Tuesday November 29, 2011, 7:07 am

"Is this still my country?"

In the past few days, those and similarly poignant Twitter posts have appealed to fundamental American values in objecting to the notorious U.C. Davis event, where police pepper-sprayed seated protesters, and to cities generally cracking down on the Occupy movement. The crackdowns have brought a military level of combativeness to what many Americans -- even those not in sympathy with the protesters -- would normally see as a police, not a military matter.

Police, not military. The distinction may seem academic, even absurd, when police are bringing rifles, helmets, armor, and helicopters to evict unarmed protesters. But it's an old and critical distinction in American law and ideology and in republican thought as a whole. The 17th-century English liberty writers, on whose ideas much of America's founding ethos was based, believed that turning the armed might of the state, (necessary in waging war against foreign enemies), to domestic policing of local communities tends to concentrate power in top-down executive action and vitiate treasured things like judiciary process, individual liberty, representative government, and free speech.

Constabulary and judiciary matters, high Whigs came to think, should never be handled by what they condemned as "standing armies." It's true, on the other hand, that keeping public order, not just aiding in prosecutions, is a duty of local police. When concerted crowd violence occurs against people and property, policing may be expected to be pretty violent too, and distinctions between combat and policing sometimes naturally blur.

From the article published by William Hogeland in Alternet, please read full article at |Visit Site|.


Agnes N (703)
Tuesday November 29, 2011, 12:49 pm
Thanks Kit..
what my view about USA...they sent soldiers to war..
that make USA must make system secure double around country...
after 9/11 that showed
many things turned rough and rough in USA

Vallee R (280)
Tuesday November 29, 2011, 4:30 pm
I no longer feel as if this is my country - not that which began in 1776. We are losing our rights - our Constitution is gone - our amendments are gone - we have no bill of rights - what happened to 1776?

Sir Walk F (124)
Tuesday November 29, 2011, 4:44 pm
Seriously, people. This has been happening for decades.

Sometime I wonder where all of you have been during the massive protests in N. America for the past two decades.

Yvonne White (229)
Tuesday November 29, 2011, 5:31 pm
The thing about the bullying of civilians now days is that it is more Open & suddenly Completely Legal!:( Which means they don't really have to explain or apologize, or even Bother to hide it (unlike the Veteran's Tent City destruction after WWII outside D.C. - which Most Americans Never knew about).. next they will censor Internet "news" items, etc... History repeats..:(

Brenda Bracey (2)
Tuesday November 29, 2011, 6:03 pm
Civil unrest has been anticipated for quite some time. Soldiers, especially reservists, are sent into towns to find out what is being said, planned and how people feel about the government in general. There are interment camps in the midwest built for whatever reason and said to be for immigrants but seriously to hold anarchists and whoever resists the "socialism" about to befall us. It can all be found on YouTube and other sites I have long forgotten. I just know it is coming. Life as we know it will not exist in a few years.

Terry King (113)
Tuesday November 29, 2011, 6:52 pm
To the Oligarchy, we are a greater threat than any foreign enemy!

Susan L (150)
Tuesday November 29, 2011, 6:55 pm
I can't send another star, but Yvonne, I believe you've got it right. Sir, you are also right when you tell us that this has been going on for decades. We have always had some form of abuse of powers. Used to be, people of color weren't "deserving" of fair and equal treatment, nor were many others, based on the locals' affection for violence, etc. When protests started becoming more frequent, so did the 'force' of those in charge. They had to finally begin being less obvious, perfected it till people began to believe it "doesn't happen here". The protests in the 70's, etc, brought the violence back into the open but when the public showed disapproval - it went back to the belief that (only in some places) police brutality got out of hand. NOW, with the OWS protests happening all over the country and an internet connection in every home, we know that it never really was under control at all.
The powers that want to control the people for their own purposes are still attempting to make it legal for military, police and governing authorities to do as they like. With the controls & restrictions on the internet, and our rights, they will change it all. Even our 'Justice System' will not be there for us as they will ALL become puppets of the proclaimed Leaders.
This may be our best chance of correcting what went WRONG with our Government and the Corporations that own it.

Past Member (0)
Tuesday November 29, 2011, 8:00 pm
"Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it." ~ Mark Twain

I'm afraid that these imbeciles really mean it ...

l L (1)
Tuesday November 29, 2011, 8:05 pm
i read and agree with your thoughts. In way of rights going away. I wrote a post somewhere on here saying i received a video from brasscheck tv., about a rachel maddow taping video of a speech taped about our president and what he said.
it had to do with-- prolonged detention-- and our president saying it should be set up under a group of people to make those decisions as to who would be deemed under prolonged detention and reevaluated after after 10 years if they would remain locked up. I ask us what is this all about? Why is this president talking like this?
Should I be frightened or what? He even spoke of getting laws on the books to make people into criminals they are needed to be, so they would be incompliance to some law. Again rachel can present this better than me.

l L (1)
Tuesday November 29, 2011, 8:09 pm
He mentioned about it being in that regime. Thx kit for the article. These are the beginnings of our days of woe. i am hoping it will all go away.

Quanta Kiran (67)
Tuesday November 29, 2011, 9:04 pm

. (0)
Wednesday November 30, 2011, 12:12 am
This is what happens when the blindfolds are taken off, those being exploited will protest. Every political system will do all that it can to benefit the group of people that have the most money. It happens in every country, and it has been happening in ours since its inception.

JustaHuman Here (53)
Wednesday November 30, 2011, 4:13 am
Why wonder? It is the country the way people have created it, either actively or by ignorance or not caring. People who do not mind get just are getting controlled. It is that simple. Especially older protesters must ask themselves "What did we do all these years?

KS Goh (0)
Wednesday November 30, 2011, 4:42 am
Thanks for the article.

patricia lasek (317)
Wednesday November 30, 2011, 5:29 am
They are using these methods because they are afraid that they will lose their Fat Cat jobs.

Wednesday November 30, 2011, 6:12 am
Greed,greed,greed. What part of the word greed don't we understand? Excellent article below.

September 7, 2011 5:00 AM

Left behind in America: Who's to blame for the wealth divide?
Brian Montopoli
Campaign 2012

"We have this growing elite that makes the economy of the United States look more like a banana republic than an economic democracy," says Democratic Rep. Jan Schakowsky of

Arielle S (313)
Wednesday November 30, 2011, 7:23 am
There is no doubt in my mind that the real terrorists are right here running our country - but then, perhaps the fault is ours? As long as we have Smart Phones, 52" tv's and Sunday football, do most people even take note? I fear not.....

David C (131)
Wednesday November 30, 2011, 7:38 am
because we have given power to smaller (richer) groups of people and corporations and have spent the last 10+ years being told to always live in fear and the last 3 decades being told greed is good, wealth is the measure of success and we can all be wealthy and successful if we don't care about the greater good of society and are willing to be machiavellian.....we have become "the me now generation" and not the good for the country and world generation....

CV M (0)
Wednesday November 30, 2011, 8:12 am
I agree Yvonne and Sue D...ditto

CV M (0)
Wednesday November 30, 2011, 8:13 am
Thanks Kit B also

Kit B (276)
Wednesday November 30, 2011, 9:29 am

We based our quaternary economy - the 4th evolution of the economic engine on nothing more substantial then credit. To feed that credit engine psychological advertising and manipulations were directed to make people feel "less then" if they didn't have more and better of each new item brought to market. As most of the populace quickly became distracted from what was really happening in Washington DC, the locomotive to destruction ran full open. As long as the majority had credit, new cars, homes, and paying job and the ability to buy the latest and greatest gadgets, they allowed DC to power forward. Then the inevitable occurs, a screeching halt to the play with credit, the contrived escalations of fuel prices, Bank disasters, Wall Street caving in under it's self created blunders. Who pays? We do. The result being that "comfort zone" being ripped away, people losing jobs, in turn losing cars and homes. A government collecting taxes at a far lower rate then is needed to keep a balance flow of income (tax breaks) and the people pondering why should the highest earners pay less then the middle and lower earners. Options are available, the government has in the past and can now begin programs to get the people back to work, that idea stalls because it most directly needs an increase the tax flow.

How could this happen in America? Think back over the years, the comfort zone bubble burst, fear of terrorist plots kept people from really looking at the organization and building of what can only be called a police state. True, we allowed this happen, that doesn't mean we shrug off the responsibility to correct those mistakes. We do not have to allow this to continue - the choice is ours.

Past Member (0)
Wednesday November 30, 2011, 9:49 am
Why is the armed might of the state, (necessary in waging war against foreign enemies) being applied to domestic policing of local communities and peaceful protests?

Because the USA is the same kind of government as Libya, Syria and Bahrain.
Guided by Greed
Handled with Hypocracy
Bought by Bigots

Kit B (276)
Wednesday November 30, 2011, 10:24 am

Yep, John there is more then a little truth in that. There is only one way to change all of this. WE THE PEOPLE must stand together and force the changes that must happen. We must take to the streets and since an election is pending begin a revolution of who we elect. Stop supporting the wealthy and expecting them to be fair and honest representatives.

H Nick H (1826)
Wednesday November 30, 2011, 10:26 am
Day by day we are becoming more of a facists state (think Hitler). Of course, this is done in the name of Jesus, so I guess it's much better. But we are turning that way, UNLESS people become more aware and fight back.

I keep thinking of Kent state, but this is getting much worse. And it's linked with the republican governors, Koch brothers, Karl Rove, Fox, and talk radio, like Rush. They all seek to have our country go in the wrong direction for their own power and greed.

. (0)
Wednesday November 30, 2011, 11:24 am
Noted with thanks. . .since 9/11 the countries haven't been the same. . .was it just a wake up call? ? ? Was it a hint that we needed to increase our protection or is it hindering our sense of freedom? ? ? We don't have a say in this as we did in the past. . .what is past is past. . .yet we are having to be limited in these ways for our own good? ? ? Are we not old enough to choose for ourselves any longer? ? ? Has our freedom been taken away for the sake of another countries attack on us? ? ?

Past Member (0)
Wednesday November 30, 2011, 11:59 am
It happened because we fell asleep after drinking "Everything is OK, keep shopping" kool-aid! Or better yet debt is the morphine for the masses... I could go on and on but I think I will stop there.... You all get what I mean...

M B (62)
Wednesday November 30, 2011, 1:17 pm
I've been in America as a tourist, but I wouldn't like to live there.

Roger Skinner (14)
Wednesday November 30, 2011, 2:30 pm
Having grown up in the era of the Vietnam War protests, this is deja vu. It seems the people in power have learned nothing from history. Attacking peaceful, non-violent protestors is counter-productive. If anything, it gives the protestors more clout. Attacking our kids, Grandmothers or pregnant women is NOT showing us the moral high ground.

l L (1)
Wednesday November 30, 2011, 5:58 pm
friends we live in america a melting pot of cultures unlike some places in the world. we have good spots but we have a world history of man's inhumanity to man. Each culture response to their own histories. I am just learning past decades of histories that brings us to the here and now. We all want a piece of our collective pie. We all disagree to how it should be divided up cause we are see things differently.
This not the 60's and the patriot act is inforce and our government is in the transition f of something.
Different entities battle to run things and some people don't see some people worthy of anything they cost toomuch.

The last 10 years happened like this. george Bush and his neo-cons took over. They brought us montasanto and genetic foods, a collasped economy with president g Bush and his family member presiding over wallstreet when it crashed. We were lied into war by Bush and the neo-cons who are trying to get back in power with the R party collection. When the Bush and r party with neo-con operatives ruled Bush changed what was to be accepted as models and busines plans to play in the stock market game. Bush and the neo -cons gave thru out the world- gave them leaders of each country a business model of how to run their countries for the global economy. what a mess that was mad.e we all are sufferingfrom that calamity the same neo cons that gave us lying vietnam gave us lying iraq. i think we should not beat ourselves up-- too much. I didn't know it was this way until the last 2 years of learning the why of it. Realize we have been rocked from wars, broken families, drugs dumped on us originally afte only being born fighting biases, trying to recover from this that and the other. fighting harmones, being confuse about being alive and what that means. We just didn't know. many still don't know why we are here on this planet in the first place in conflict constantly with each other over the basic needs.

LeMoyn Salmonsen (88)
Wednesday November 30, 2011, 6:01 pm
This is no longer our America, it now belongs lock stock and barrel to the multinational Plutocratic Fascists. Welcome to WW III. And where do you stand? When the 400k veterans are all back home wanting to provide for and keep safe their families, where do you think they will stand?

l L (1)
Wednesday November 30, 2011, 6:10 pm
my post of 11/29 in re: to prolonged detention was addressed today by the Dylan R show. I appreciated that. I need to understand what is going on. My spelling is horrible, I hate it. i appreciate them taking time today 11/30/2011 to tackle the topic and I hope they tackle it again and present it further.
hey guys please understand; i don't know everything. Neither do I have answers for solutions to each and everything. So if I come off like that, please forgive me. the more i learn in trying to understand issues I realize how inept I am. I am happpy to share time and space on this site with all of you. Even tho we may see things from a different vantage point; i am at a lost to the roads that cause our paths to cross. Thank you for allowing me to share my grains of sands in time. Take care have a great day.

l L (1)
Wednesday November 30, 2011, 6:14 pm
I see your point hawkeye and we have had conversations about this before you know where I stand.

Kit B (276)
Wednesday November 30, 2011, 6:32 pm

Many of those in the OWS protests across the country are veterans. They know only to well what they stand for and they sure didn't fight for America to come home to this. All other needs aside for the moment - we need JOBS and there is a plan on the table for jobs. This endless bickering about a deficit must stop and get on to business of re-building this country, that will provide jobs. We also need NO more tax cuts or tax shelters for those corporations hiring out of this country. It should be noted that many of these veterans have been the victims of police attacks.

Stephen Brian (23)
Thursday December 1, 2011, 3:09 pm
The primary difference today between the police and the military is that the police hold the protection of the public above the elimination of the problem which they are ordered to handle. This is reversed for the military. How many protesters have been severely harmed (with permanent injuries or death)? How many times have the police failed to clear an Occupy group or been driven off by one? I think the priorities of the state-forces involved still imply that this is a being handled through policing and not "the armed might of the state".

Past Member (0)
Thursday December 1, 2011, 8:58 pm
We are no longer the land of the free and the home of the brave.

We lost that freedom. We didn't intend to. My generation was against the establishment.
Then we became the establishment. Not all of us. Not me! But many of us became that
which we had despised.

Our children are trying to gain back what we surrendered.

Some of us never surrendered. Some of us are still against the establishment
and for the people. Example: that 80 year old lady who was pepper sprayed.

They no longer call us hippys. They call us activists.

We are Rainbow Warriors.
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