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The Obama Admin's Decision to Allow Indefinite Detention of U.S. Citizens: Terrifying, With Long-Term Consequences


US Politics & Gov't  (tags: abuse, americans, candidates, congress, constitution, corruption, democrats, dishonesty, ethics, Govtfearmongering, lies, media, obama, politics, propaganda, republicans, SupremeCourt )

Kit
- 1011 days ago - alternet.org
The conference version of the bill gives the White House so much room to maneuver around the "mandatory" nature of the military detention provisions that Congress can argue they've given the administration the "flexibility" it needs to fight terrorism-->



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Comments

Ralph R Sutton (56)
Thursday December 15, 2011, 1:08 pm
And we thought the Patriot Act was an infringement on our Constitutional Rights. Will they use this to round up all the Occupy Wall Street protesters? You do realize that they could easily be labeled terrorist, don't you?
 

Kit B. (276)
Thursday December 15, 2011, 2:24 pm

If you own a gun you can be arrested under this law. So there goes the 1st, 2sd and 4th amendments. Does anyone care?
 

Val R. (243)
Thursday December 15, 2011, 2:36 pm
Yes Ralph - a perfect reason to round up the protestors - that's the reason that is was signed now. And if you have a garden or a gun you are also a terrorist - we are now officially under military law - we just don't yet have soldiers at every corner with their machine guns - seen that in Santiago, Chile.
 

Past Member (0)
Thursday December 15, 2011, 3:32 pm
im not sure i can support obama any longer. his attacks on the environment and pipeline..he should've just said no and not made it political point. this...crap. even my rep voted for this and it really surprised me. all this just feels so ominous and sinister.

i think they are all full of shit at this point.
 

Kit B. (276)
Thursday December 15, 2011, 3:44 pm

Well Victoria, I think that are [Congress] certainly full of campaign dollars and that is all that seems to focus them.
 

Robert B. (57)
Thursday December 15, 2011, 6:51 pm
What is congress thinking and how could the supreme court find this constitutional? This is the type of thing Stalin and Hitler did. Only dictatorships do this kind of crap. This makes our Democracy a sham.
 

Kit B. (276)
Thursday December 15, 2011, 6:55 pm

Our country is in dire jeopardy, laws like this are usually followed by even tighter controls. Suddenly United States citizens are "disappeared". Reminds me of any dictatorship from any chapter of history.
 

William K. (328)
Thursday December 15, 2011, 7:01 pm
Has this gone to Obama's desk yet?

If not, we need to get the veto effort going.
 

Terry King (109)
Thursday December 15, 2011, 7:05 pm
As has been said, this is an horribly slippery slope. I am shocked that the Obama administration is buying into this blatant violation of our rights!
 

Past Member (0)
Thursday December 15, 2011, 9:00 pm
Yes, it is terrifying.

You think, just maybe, it might be a step of the money people to come against
us activists?

I hope I'm wrong.
 

james larkin (18)
Thursday December 15, 2011, 10:11 pm
Free country? Democracy? Civil Rights? Human Rights? Land of the Free? ....or a Police State?
 

Past Member (0)
Thursday December 15, 2011, 10:32 pm
It does not surprise me that the current administration would continue taking away our rights. Once power is given, even temporarily, it is almost impossible to get them to return it. When our republic was formed, our ancestors were dealing with a similar problem. The question is, how much longer do we as a people take it before we say it is enough.
 

Shirley S. (174)
Thursday December 15, 2011, 10:37 pm
noted
 

Past Member (0)
Thursday December 15, 2011, 11:44 pm
Like most here, I was relived when the neocon regime was brought to an end in 2008.

Obama's election to the Presidency filled me with hope. I had great expectations that a new, saner, freer, more democratic America would raise again.

Those hopes and great exceptions have been dashed.

The regime just got makeover in 2008.

A new, more sinister dictator had sized the reigns of power.

What happened to the America I used to love, respect and admire?

You have become a warmongering Imperial Power with no respect for the individual liberties of your own citizens, let alone having any respect for international law and the rights of sovereign nations.

In the 21st century America more closely resembles 20th century Nazi Germany, than it does 20th century America.

I fear for you, I fear for the world.

 

ewoud k. (73)
Friday December 16, 2011, 2:16 am
Well, at least it'll be clear, and in accordance with the law: you CAN be held in prison for ages and even longer, and as from now you can't complaign about it.

A sad moment in American history, and quite difficult to explain to future (and actual, in fact) generations.

A bill like this is rather easy to instore -it's just been done-, but to end, or even alter, a libertykilling text like this, that's another story. And hoping that all future presidents of the US will be such good persons that there's no risk for abuse.... wake up!, you know better!

And they, that is the American government, still thinks that they can critisize other countries for having laws that are dubious, laws that don't guarantee fair justice for members of the opposition, say..... China, North-Korea, Syria, want more? They'll be laughed at!

2011: a year that changed the world. But maybe not in the way you thought until today.
 

Angelus Silesius (66)
Friday December 16, 2011, 5:52 am
Halliburton was building all sorts of refugee-style encampments and few asked any questions. The American public has also ignored the U.S. Army's "civilian inmate prison labor" program
 

John Gregoire (255)
Friday December 16, 2011, 6:07 am
Sad, I doubt this passes the smell test or would be found constitutional.
 

Past Member (0)
Friday December 16, 2011, 6:22 am
This bill has passed the senate 86-13, Obama has dropped his threat of veto. It looks as if this bill we be signed.
 

Past Member (0)
Friday December 16, 2011, 6:25 am
The bill is HR 1540. These senators voted Yea.......Grouped By Vote Position


YEAs ---86



Akaka (D-HI)
Alexander (R-TN)
Ayotte (R-NH)
Barrasso (R-WY)
Baucus (D-MT)
Begich (D-AK)
Bennet (D-CO)
Bingaman (D-NM)
Blumenthal (D-CT)
Blunt (R-MO)
Boozman (R-AR)
Boxer (D-CA)
Brown (D-OH)
Brown (R-MA)
Burr (R-NC)
Cantwell (D-WA)
Carper (D-DE)
Casey (D-PA)
Chambliss (R-GA)
Coats (R-IN)
Cochran (R-MS)
Collins (R-ME)
Conrad (D-ND)
Coons (D-DE)
Corker (R-TN)
Cornyn (R-TX)
Enzi (R-WY)
Feinstein (D-CA)
Gillibrand (D-NY)


Graham (R-SC)
Grassley (R-IA)
Hagan (D-NC)
Hatch (R-UT)
Heller (R-NV)
Hoeven (R-ND)
Hutchison (R-TX)
Inhofe (R-OK)
Inouye (D-HI)
Isakson (R-GA)
Johanns (R-NE)
Johnson (D-SD)
Johnson (R-WI)
Kerry (D-MA)
Kirk (R-IL)
Klobuchar (D-MN)
Kohl (D-WI)
Kyl (R-AZ)
Landrieu (D-LA)
Lautenberg (D-NJ)
Leahy (D-VT)
Levin (D-MI)
Lieberman (ID-CT)
Lugar (R-IN)
Manchin (D-WV)
McCain (R-AZ)
McCaskill (D-MO)
McConnell (R-KY)
Menendez (D-NJ)


Mikulski (D-MD)
Murkowski (R-AK)
Murray (D-WA)
Nelson (D-FL)
Nelson (D-NE)
Portman (R-OH)
Pryor (D-AR)
Reed (D-RI)
Reid (D-NV)
Roberts (R-KS)
Rockefeller (D-WV)
Rubio (R-FL)
Schumer (D-NY)
Sessions (R-AL)
Shaheen (D-NH)
Shelby (R-AL)
Snowe (R-ME)
Stabenow (D-MI)
Tester (D-MT)
Thune (R-SD)
Toomey (R-PA)
Udall (D-CO)
Udall (D-NM)
Vitter (R-LA)
Warner (D-VA)
Webb (D-VA)
Whitehouse (D-RI)
Wicker (R-MS)

 

lee e. (114)
Friday December 16, 2011, 6:46 am
Im very very reluctant to vote for any of these people again, which makes it difficult to vote at all - I had more expectations not only of my Senators - Shumer and Gillibrand, but the pres as well! I'm hoping for alternatives to be presented by the OWS "delegation" that is supposed to meet - hopefully not too late in March-July! Thank goodness Sanders and Kucinich remain reasonable in this insanity!!! I'ts a very dangerous step that we took - I have been very anti 2nd amendment, because of illegal guns and weapons that are sensationalized for the use of killing other humans only!!!! I've removed myself from the "Mayors against Illegal Guns" because I don't like the direction this country is headed and I just may need an illegal gun here in NYC!
 

Kit B. (276)
Friday December 16, 2011, 8:53 am

If you have not, then please do read the Patriot Act, and find that this is just a law that reinforces those powers already given over to the government. Keep people in fear and they surrender their rights. What I am most afraid of is the powers of the government, not terrorist, they have been and will be always around. Sure, we need to keep our defenses up for a coming threat, but not by taking away all of our civil rights. Call President Obama, and tell him what you think of this. I have called every day, and written (snail mail) as well as email. Please at least call. We must have a full veto of this addition to the Homeland INsecurity, and demand our rights. The responsibility is ours.
 

l L. (1)
Friday December 16, 2011, 9:33 am
WATCHING C-span a few days back. A republican stood and delivered his speech, that this bill has been being worked on since earlier this year. Does this mean that this pres was privy to it since then? Of course that republican and a mix of others sang the bills accolaids. While others offered supporting info from others, in warning, Obviouslly no one will change the pres mind. Why really is he doing this? Who is/are the known targets. They obviously already has sombodies on their radar. Exit the office of president now the office of a king.
 

Arielle S. (317)
Friday December 16, 2011, 11:47 am
This only proves that the real terrorists are right there in DC and all across our country. No big surprise to see the yahoos from my state voting for such a stupid bill - they both sold their souls a long time ago.
 

Terrie Williams (770)
Friday December 16, 2011, 11:51 am
First they will come for the dissenters....then they will come for the Muslims...then they will come for the gays/lesbians/transgendered....then they will come for those who are Hispanic/African American/Native American, etc.....then they will come for those who do not believe in their version of religious thinking.....then there will be no one left. Get the picture. History has begun to be repeated. Nazi Germany comes to mind first, then Fascist Italy and Spain.

How many will have to 'disappear' before the American People find their courage to fight? How many have already disappeared? How do we know they haven't already? We don't. Most of us here will probably be some of the first to go. We are exercising our 1st Amendment right to speak freely -- something that has already been taken away from us in the Patriot Acts I & II. All we have said, all we have written is more than like safely stowed away on disks for future use against us. Sigh. Does that stop me? HELL NO.

Does it stop you?
Will it?
I hope not.
Do not live in fear. If we fear they have won. I will not give them that victory.
 

Myron Scott (70)
Friday December 16, 2011, 12:36 pm
Obama did not push for this. Realistically, politically speaking, with a whopping 6 Senatorial Dem's, an equal number of GOP, and Sanders opposing this unconstitutional
amendment, expecting him to veto it and be caricatured as soft on defense for the next 11 months seems unfair. Hand him the hemlock and beg him drink? Still, I've already
done so since the Senate vote, signing petitions urging a veto from both Change.org and ACLU. Here's the Change link:

http://www.change.org/petitions/veto-act-allowing-indefinite-detention-of-us-citizens-by-us-military
 

Myron Scott (70)
Friday December 16, 2011, 1:00 pm
Obviously, I agree with you, William K.

I tend to think it is time to start a serious draft Sanders movement. Absent that or an Allard Lowenstein effort to find another serious and VIABLE third candidate (AL found Gene McCarthy, for the youngsters), I fear I will end up voting for Obama rather than see ANY contemporary Republican elected. I personally call that "voting my conscience," to quote a cliche, because I hold myself morally and ethically responsible for the effects of my omissions as well as my actions. Also, Kit is correct to remind us that
none of this would be happening without the original GOP/Neocon Patriot Act.
Her suggestion of calling is even better than signing petitions. So, I'll do it.

Finally, in my opinion, the Green Party, with its candidate with zero name recognition is not viable, nor would Nader be viable, and Paul is too frightening on too many other issues, the environment first and foremost, to get my vote. If we want change, do as Kit has done, as I have done, as William suggests, and then, looking toward next November, start with Sanders or a Lowenstein strategy; but if any of you think a symbolic anti-Obama is a conscientious act, get back to me after a couple years of Gingrich or Paul or Jeb Bush (he's doing polls now), Santorum, Palin or even Romney.
 

Myron Scott (70)
Friday December 16, 2011, 1:14 pm
Lee,as I understand it, the OWS thing isn't intended to field any candidates
until 2014. You really want to wait that long?
 

Craig Zimmerman (86)
Friday December 16, 2011, 4:39 pm
So now we are The Fascist States of America?
 

Kit B. (276)
Friday December 16, 2011, 5:11 pm

Thanks Myron, for the petition link, I have signed. Still I urge everyone to call President Obama and tell him to veto this action, if it passes the House.

http://www.change.org/petitions/veto-act-allowing-indefinite-detention-of-us-citizens-by-us-military/
 

Roseann D. (178)
Friday December 16, 2011, 5:26 pm
I don't know how either side thinks they can win in 2012 by supporting this crap. It seems it's just one agenda and it's all grand theater. They all play their roles... The bullying, corrupt GOP and the hapless, wimpy Dems. It appears the global elite really are the puppetmasters of our elected officials.

I think corporations invest a lot of money on their own agendas and they can't afford a new Prez to screw up their game plan and investments. That's what we're up against. Each Prez just passes the torch now. There is no correcting course.
 

Yvonne White (232)
Friday December 16, 2011, 6:44 pm
Today's Care2 quote seems to fit:
"I think it would be a good idea."- Mahatma Gandhi, when asked what he thought of Western civilization
 

greenplanet e. (157)
Friday December 16, 2011, 7:26 pm
"Sure, we live in a very dangerous world."

There's that fear-mongering again.

This law is more scary.
 

Sacha Jones (18)
Friday December 16, 2011, 7:57 pm
Obama has either lost the plot or is bowing to the military war machine or corporate pressure? Sad really, he seems like a really nice guy.

Become a politican, lie to yoursef and everyone else. Staying in power is the name of the game? Dollars and no sense.
 

Kit B. (276)
Friday December 16, 2011, 9:16 pm

Lots and lots of blood soaked dollars - and those dollars are gobbling up your freedoms. Call - Call and Call the president and DEMAND he veto this bill.
 

Sacha Jones (18)
Saturday December 17, 2011, 12:27 am
Demand he veto this bill? -- Why is Guantanamo Bay still open after he promised to close it years ago? I fear that to demand anything from the 'new' Obama would simply be pissing into the wind. 'We the people' made him President. About 'we the people' he no longer cares.
 

Carmen S. (611)
Saturday December 17, 2011, 7:50 am
thanks Kit
 

Judy G. (0)
Sunday December 18, 2011, 6:08 pm
Your absolutely right Terrie Williams and yeah, alot have disappeared because they had evidence, they heard that or they saw that ..................its already been like that. I dont live in fear either, I was going to die anyway we all are.
 

Steven L. Jones (3)
Monday December 19, 2011, 11:18 am
In Democracy all people are equal but some people are more equal than others.
 
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