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Ireland: Clare Daly Abortion Bill Defeated By 101 Votes to 27


World  (tags: 'CIVILLIBERTIES!', 'HUMANRIGHTS!', abortion, death, freedoms, government, Ireland, media, politics, religion, society, humanrights )

Kit
- 946 days ago - thejournal.ie
It would have provided an interim legislative arrangement as required by the Council of Europe, for termination of pregnancy where as a matter of probability a real and substantial risk to the life of the pregnant woman exists.



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Kit B. (276)
Friday November 30, 2012, 6:29 am
(Photo Credit: The Journal ie )


AN ABORTION BILL put forward by Deputy Clare Daly has been voted down by 101 votes to 27 in the Dáil this evening.

Today saw the second evening of debate on the Medical Treatment (Termination of Pregnancy in Case of Risk to Life of Pregnant Woman) Bill. Yesterday, a number of TDs used the debate as an opportunity to hit out at the leak of the Expert Group report on abortion at the weekend.

The bill was for legislating for the X Case, and the full details of the bill can be accessed by clicking here.

It would have provided an interim legislative arrangement as required by the Council of Europe, for termination of pregnancy where as a matter of probability a real and substantial risk to the life of the pregnant woman exists.

It also would have made provision for the prevention of any curtailment, hindrance or preclusion of such treatment that may arise as a result of the pregnancy of the woman.

Scurrilous

This evening, United Left Alliance Deputy Daly said it was “scurrilous” that the Dáil was back voting on such a bill, and said she was disappointed by the reaction of the Government on the issue. She said that she took offence at claims from Fine Gael and Labour that those for the bill were being divisive, and said that Irish people have moved on on the issue of abortion.

Deputy Daly also said that descriptions of “walk in, walk out” abortions were “an insult to women and doctors”. She received a round of applause after she concluded her closing speech before the TDs voted on the issue.

Sinn Féin deputy leader Mary Lou McDonald said:

"We take this position because we recognise the urgency of legislating to give legal protection and clarity to pregnant women and their doctors. We take this position because the inertia and negligence of successive governments on this issue – a basic issue of protecting pregnant women’s lives – must be ended."

Minister of State for Primary care in the Department of Health Alex White said that Irish abortion laws “are unduly restrictive on women” and the constitution should be revisited on this issue. Fine Gael Deputy Jerry Buttimer said that he was born of a crisis pregnancy, but thankfully survived. He said that what they need to do is legislate to end the uncertainty, and to give a sense of confidence to the medical profession and women of Ireland.

“Let us park our political differences,” he said. “This is far too important.”

Labour Deputy Aodhán Ó Riordán said that his party have “stood alone the platform” on the abortion issue, and so have received vulgar letters, abusive phonecalls and had their family members targeted by people who opposed their views. He also accused candidates from other parties of playing dirty tricks and scaremongering on the issue.

“We have no difficulty with this when we know that we are right,” he said.

TDs who opposed the bill included Independent Deputy Mattie McGrath, who said that he felt that the pro-choice side had used the recent Savita Halappanavar case as leverage for them before the full facts of the case are known. He said he was worried the Government has “bought into this deception”.

Also opposing it was Fine Gael Deputy Regina Doherty, who said that she wanted to allow for time and space for the government to come to a consensus on the issue. Deputy Richard Boyd Barrett, by comparison, supported the bill and said that some discussions around the issue of abortion had been “obnoxious and medieval”, particularly around the issue of suicide and pregnancy.

Independent Deputy John Halligan spoke of the number of abortion pills that have been seized by customs, and said it is “tragic and appalling that women are reduced to this”.

Health Minister Dr James Reilly appealed to the members of the Dáil to participate in the Dáil debates that have been planned over the next couple of weeks following the recent release of the Expert Group report into the A, B, C case. He said that it is his earnest hope that “this time we can reach party consensus” on the issue of legislating for the X Case.

Deputy Mick Wallace said that “for too long women who had abortions or advocated for reproductive rights have been stigmatised, shamed and silenced” in Ireland. He supported the bill.
****
Read: Daly abortion bill: How each TD voted>

By The Journal ie
 

Kit B. (276)
Friday November 30, 2012, 6:30 am

This is Ireland's answer to the Savita Halappanavar affair, in which a woman in Ireland was allowed to die rather than abort her miscarried fetus. One might think some action would be taken. Even if the whole abortion issue in Catholic Ireland needs a full airing in the legislature, at least they can allow abortions where the mother's life is in danger. That's nothing that needs debate: is it better to let a mother and her fetus die rather than just the non-sentient fetus?
 

pam w. (139)
Friday November 30, 2012, 8:55 am
Apparently so, Kit.
 

Sue H. (6)
Friday November 30, 2012, 8:55 am
Really, not acceptable and terribly sad. The Women of Ireland Need A Voice.
 

Arielle S. (316)
Friday November 30, 2012, 9:03 am
I will never ever understand how people who treat other people the way so many do can be so concerned about the unborn - If we all treated each other with respect, compassion and kindness, I might understand the conflict - as it is, it makes no sense to me.
 

Bob P. (407)
Friday November 30, 2012, 10:24 am
thanks Kit
 

Gene Jacobson (266)
Friday November 30, 2012, 11:55 am
Ridiculous that there could even be a "debate" on this issue. That fetus was dead, not viable, and the mother's life was at risk, how any medical professional could stand there and do nothing is beyond reasoning. That politicians are beyond reasoning, well, that at least is understandable, horribly wrong, but not atypical in any sense. Somehow this issue must be addressed such that the mother's life is paramount. What else is humane? Even to politicians.
 

jan b. (5)
Friday November 30, 2012, 2:32 pm
Men have murdered sperm for centuries. If it were not for spontaneous abortions (miscarriages) humans would be extinct from over-population. It is a small miracle women do not have short memories about our rights that have always, shamefully, been alienable.
Throwing themselves downstairs...almost any implement you can imagine had been and was used to start an abortion — darning needles, crochet hooks, cut-glass salt shakers, soda bottles, sometimes intact, sometimes with the top broken off. Women have tried to use soap and bleach, catheters, natural remedies. Women have historically resorted to any means necessary. Women will do this again, if we are backed back into that terrible corner. This is the responsibility our society has forced on women for hundreds of years.
 

Dandelion G. (384)
Friday November 30, 2012, 3:33 pm
It always amazes me how a societies can go on killing each other over religion but won't save a woman's life simply due to the fact she is pregnant, even if the fetus is clearly dead. This is extremely troubling and I hope the women of Ireland rise up on this one or I wouldn't let a man get near me if I was in child bearing age; who needs a potential death sentence.
 

Dana W. (9)
Friday November 30, 2012, 3:37 pm
As in America and other countries, politicians are putting religion above the health and well-being of people. I wonder if the woman's family can sue? It won't bring her back, but hopefully this sad case will encourage more people to become involved and encourage political change.

Isn't government supposed to represent the will of the people?
 

Robert O. (12)
Friday November 30, 2012, 4:40 pm
Very discouraging. I guess Ireland likes being stuck in the dark ages.
 

Thomas P. (468)
Friday November 30, 2012, 4:49 pm
Noted. What a said day for women (and men, as they are impacted as well) and for women's rights not only in Ireland but around the world, and what a sad day for life. To say that one is for life and use that as a justification for voting against a bill like this is not only disingenuous, it's simply ludicrous.
 

Janet R. (37)
Friday November 30, 2012, 5:06 pm
How many Irish women have to die before they will get into the 21st century? No offense to Catholics but it sure sounds like a ball and chain. Blind faith is not the best course. I do not understand how the so-called medical professionals could let that poor woman die. I guess they have taken the hypocritical oath there. They should have their licenses permanently revoked.
 

Tamara Noforwardsplz (185)
Friday November 30, 2012, 9:09 pm
I am sickened by this whole abortion issue. It is too bad that those who opposed this bill can't see how detrimental this is to the world as a whole. When women are allowed to die to avoid aborting a dead fetus, we have definitely turned a horrific corner that I fear we may not be able to find our way back from. All of the issues that are vital to the continued life of humans, animals and this planet seem to have been swept under the proverbial rug and I feel like we are standing at the top of a very icy hill with no way of stopping our slide to the bottom.
 

Past Member (0)
Saturday December 1, 2012, 2:20 am
Thanks.
 

Past Member (0)
Saturday December 1, 2012, 2:45 am
More women will suffer
 

Rose Becke (292)
Saturday December 1, 2012, 3:03 am
so true David
 

Yvonne F. (175)
Saturday December 1, 2012, 5:19 am
Hard to believe that this is actually happening in modern countries!!! Thanks Kit for sharing
 

paul m. (93)
Saturday December 1, 2012, 5:50 am

So stupid....
 

Theodore Shayne (56)
Saturday December 1, 2012, 10:19 am
Duh, thanks a lot Catholicism. May the church fall into a molten cauldron real soon.
 

Lois Jordan (60)
Saturday December 1, 2012, 4:08 pm
Thanks for the update, Kit. Just unbelievable, ridiculous, & completely backwards. I sense a very strong backlash coming. Ditto Janet R.'s comment regarding the "healthcare professionals."
 

marie c. (166)
Saturday December 1, 2012, 4:34 pm
How can this be happening in 2012 There is no excuse for ignorance those days should be well behind us. Plain common sense has gone out of the window
Thanks for posting Kit
 

Mary Robert (2)
Saturday December 1, 2012, 5:07 pm
These are people who fundamentally believe that sex is evil and pregnancy is a punishment for having sex. This doctrine applies most heavily to women because Eve not only fell to temptation, but persuaded Adam to follow suit. They think Adam would not have disobeyed God if left to his own devices because men are stronger than women.They think that any unbaptised soul can never ascend to heaven, even if that soul had no way to get baptised. They believe the heavenly future of any soul is more important than the earthly state of any other soul, because the earthly soul can still seek redemption before it dies.

This doctrine is almost never discussed so bluntly today, because frankly it sounds crazy and they know it. But it is the foundation for the inability to think clearly on this subject.

There seem to be a huge number of people who can not trust their God to weigh the circumstances of individual cases and make a logical and compassionate decision in each case. Unfortunately, many of them run giant churches.
 

Past Member (0)
Saturday December 1, 2012, 10:57 pm
This is terrible news for women. And indeed for some fetuses in whom health defects have been discovered in the womb. It will not stop abortion. Merely drive it to the back-street butchers.
 

Gloria H. (88)
Saturday December 1, 2012, 11:15 pm
All who voted on it were men? I hesitate to even call them "men". Let's hope none of their daughters ever need to face such a medical situation.
 

valda p. (13)
Sunday December 2, 2012, 5:37 am
There has to be -laws to protect both baby and mother ,the baby from being aborted for some triviality and the mother in cases of rape or life threating circumstance,what did it achieve a mother carrying a dead baby? why did she have to die as well?these men of religon who make decisons concerning women should not be in a position to do so-religon should not make the laws -religion is a personal decision - Ireland is a catholic country-who makes the laws the church?or the state? in all cultures and religions -men strive to control women.
 

Terrie Williams (782)
Monday December 3, 2012, 6:10 am
Well....Ireland's off my itenerary....permanantly. Un *&^%%$ believable.
 
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