Sunday September 27, 2009, 1:24 pm
The English are much too persnickity!! They need to be more tolerant of others....thnx, Eleanor!!

Monday September 28, 2009, 12:22 am
Pernickity is not the word I would use. This government removed the fundamental right to a fair trial for these men - it removed even the right to be charged if suspected of a crime and be presented with the evidence against them. To be placed under house arrest with all the attendant misery it brings is a serious punishment so where was the crime? Obviously there was no evidence of any threat to national security. I hope all the men who have been abused in this way will receive massive compensation.

Monday September 28, 2009, 12:32 am
There was a time, about 7 or 8 years ago,
when D.C. and London were telling us that
the Iraqi Kurds were the "good guys".....
except for this particular imam, perhaps?
This article leaves me shaking my head, Eleanor,
and the graphic above makes my blood run cold
for it's overwhelming Orwellian effect.....
"safe, just and tolerant" for who?
Thank you, my dear friend!
noted.

Monday September 28, 2009, 2:23 am
It is Orwellian, Tim! You got it so right. When there is no come-back for people, when the decision has been made to incarcerate them or put them under house arrest without even telling them or their solicitors what they have been accused of and what evidence there is to prove it - that to me is Orwellian. And now we are never to know the evidence that was supposedly so bad against this man and others - well that's so interesting. Was it made up by MI5 or MI6, was it evidence gained from torture, did someone's enemy lie out of spite knowing that an accusation of terrorism against a Muslim would be enough? There are so many possibilities when the truth cannot be shared in a court of law. The rule of law keeps us safe from the injustice of tyrants. Over the past years there has been no rule of law and it is a pity it took the Law Lords so long to prohibit the actions of this mob that governs us.

Monday September 28, 2009, 2:55 am
At first I thought I had clicked on a discussion about the (U.S.) Patriot Act. Whether it's the U.K. or the U.S. it is apparent that at least some governments have very limited reasoning capablilies. If you don't want someone in your country, don't let him or her in. If someone has become a resident, but not yet a citizen, of your country and behaves in a manner that poses a threat to your country, deport him or her.

Monday September 28, 2009, 5:26 am
His solicitor: "He also stated that control orders were “fundamentally oppressive and unfair”, and “flawed in their conception, execution and review.”

"However, it was not until June that the government was finally obliged to take notice of the mounting opposition to the system, when the Law Lords ruled unanimously that imposing control orders breaches Article 6 of the European Convention on Human Rights, which guarantees the right to a fair trial, because a suspect held under a control order is not given “sufficient information about the allegations against him to enable him to give effective instructions to the special advocate assigned to him.”

At one time British Justice was seen as the benchmark for all legal systems and was revered...even the great Mohandas Gandhi came to Britain to study law. however our legal system has been steadily been eroded ever since the days of Margaret Thatcher with more and more of an individual's freedoms being chipped away. Under the totally repressive and highly dishonest regime of first Tony bLIAR and then Dithering Brown the legal system has been shown to be no more than a pawn of the Government. This was always resisted in the past with our judiciary maintaining its fierce independence. But bLIAR brought in his cronies and made them into Law Lords...he himself had trained as a lawyer...and amid the mass of stories about hand printed wall paper, the press was diverted from the real story, as British citizens were stripped of many of their Human Rights, under both the International Declarations of Human Rights and the European Legislation.

This present fiasco typifies the chaos that this government has sunk into. I hope this man is given compensation and that it is deducted from the salaries of the very politicians who are so busy lining their pockets with our cash...as they know they will never hold public office again.

Monday September 28, 2009, 7:30 am
Well said again, David. The penny hadn't really dropped me with about how many cronies Blair made Law Lords! No wonder we have had some dreadful decisions!

Monday September 28, 2009, 8:45 am
Oh it's another "BLUNKETT BLUNDER"....???

Monday September 28, 2009, 12:19 pm
I'm from the UK, hate my Government , do not listen to anybody but themselves. I will be hoping for a new government at the next election next year.

Monday September 28, 2009, 2:07 pm
Well too bad the US doesn't follow suit and release all the Guantanamo prisoners.

Monday September 28, 2009, 2:11 pm
Cecily, didn't you mean (Un)patriotic Act. Did ya ever note how the Bush years were deceptive programs but tagged with warm & fuzzy titles like the Patriot Act, The Blue Skies Initiative, delegating self environmental regulation to the energy companies; like that really worked and No Child Left Behind that made school districts fudge and lie about test results before a child would truly be left behind from the program.

But in getting back to the topic, it's total irony that the two nations that scream for human rights have of late been the ones to take it away under the auspices of national security, invoking a government to operate under a cloud of secrecy.

Monday September 28, 2009, 2:56 pm
Things like this will get a lot worse after they bring in Identity Cards and the database that underlines it - be afraid, be very afraid!

Monday September 28, 2009, 3:19 pm
Thank you, but until and unless the United States deals with the sins of the Bush/Cheney Crime Wave, they have absolutely no right to even interrogate, much less imprison so-called terrorists from anywhere. Right now the United States is embroiled in domestic terrorism by the lunatic right wing fringe and I’m not half as worried about Islam or Muslims as I am about our own hillbilly mentality (which seems to be rampant everywhere, with or without the hills). We need to shovel our own porch clean before we do a dusting of others’ porches! Thank God we have the new Administration of PRESIDENT Obama at the helm; it may move slowly but at least it isn’t in reverse, e.g., 2000-2008! I don't mind terrorists being imprisoned, but for Heaven's sake, at least make damn sure they're terrorists and not just on the way to the grocery store!!!

Monday September 28, 2009, 7:44 pm
This kind of behavior by governments of the English-speaking must make the Al-Quaida boys hardly able to contain themselves watching all the freaking out.

Monday September 28, 2009, 11:31 pm
Thanks Eleanor and Bruce said it well too!

Tuesday September 29, 2009, 5:34 am
Thanks Eleanor. Not only the UK should be admonished for acts like these, but many othercountries that carry out the same kind of selective and subjective justice on their citizens.

Tuesday September 29, 2009, 5:57 am
If Labour are defeated at the next election in the UK - do you honestly think the Torries [the bankers friemds] are going to do any different??? They don't have a clue about the War with radical Islam and its aim to make everyone on this planet Muslim or dead... WAKE UP - don't believe the media lies and mis-information about Labour... The BBC and their Tory friends (most of the media) are trying to dislodge a failry elected government, as if they run the country - do they???

Tuesday September 29, 2009, 6:09 am
Well it looks as if the Tories are in charge of national security like the Republicans here. If the top brass disagrees well the party is the top brass even as our Congress votes new fighter planes whether anyone else wants them or nit.

Tuesday September 29, 2009, 9:05 am
If Labour are defeated at the next election, they will have only themselves to blame. Since they came to power we have had one foreign war after another - and who are the bankers' friends - who has just shored up the banks with billions of taxpayers' money while people are losing jobs and homes? Labour became New Labour and forgot the ordinary people. I hate the Tories, don't worry but it is Blair and Brown who have prepared the way for them. Our best hope is a Parliament with no overall majority for anyone though it's a faint hope.

Tuesday September 29, 2009, 3:39 pm
Well said sharon s why bother babbling on when I think we all agree this government just has to go I like your style to the point why waste your time typing about thieves and vagabonds we can find lies dishonesty and broken promises every day with this lot unless the going gets too tough and then of course Brown goes into hiding .

Wednesday September 30, 2009, 10:42 am
Penetrating terrorist organizations is a very hard task, they are vigilant to catch informers and will execute a group even if they suspect only one of them. I understand the necessity of those control orders to protect the good guys.

Better safe, than sorry.

Wednesday September 30, 2009, 2:47 pm
Sleeping Beauty, you knowing about this and you shoudl keep your mouth shut. My opinion.

Wednesday September 30, 2009, 3:02 pm
I forgot to say this last night - 'They don't have a clue about the War with radical Islam and its aim to make everyone on this planet Muslim or dead... WAKE UP - don't believe the media lies and mis-information about Labour... The BBC and their Tory friends (most of the media) are trying to dislodge a failry elected government, as if they run the country - do they???' I HAVE NEVER READ SO MUCH ABSOLUTE AND UTTER PISH IN MY LIFE OUTSIDE A BNP LEAFLET. paul r - go and bile yer heid in a tinnie! An' stop spreadin' yer fascist poison!
The BBC toe the government line. Full stop. The BBC are as fascist as Paw Broon. End of story. And when TRAITOR BROON GOES THE SAME WAY AS TRAITOR BLAIR - I WILL BE DANCIN' IN THE STREETS OF MOTHERWELL. Even if it means years of Tory rule. Better the enemy than the traitors to the cause of the people.

Wednesday September 30, 2009, 3:18 pm
And please note, paul r. - the British are mostly not fascists. A small minority are. And they will be fought in the streets as they were in the 30s if necessary. No way, no how will you get your racist and bigoted way.

Thursday October 1, 2009, 6:48 am
If Labour are defeated at the next election it will be partly themselves to blame and mostly media hype and lies that have done it. The BBC, supposedly impartial, have had it in for Labour ever since Greg Dyke was sacked from being govenor general of BBC a few years ago. If you do not think anything is wrong with media calling people the way they do, making personal comments about a politicians wife or their own medical condition, or BBC interviewers deliberatley trying to put their interviewee off, by adopting an attitude that the interviewee is lying - even when they aren't - this is bad, bad bad in a supposedly fair democracy. After all the media filter all messages from any government - so if the governement or politician upset the media they and or their family will be hounded and rediculed untill they are got rid of... Scandal sells papers and gets viewers - since the internet, the press are worried about falling sales, as people go for less biased news elsewhere... The media are even prepared to bring down a fairly elected government - just what the terrorists wanted...

Friday October 2, 2009, 4:44 am
Is it wrong for the press to report about all the wheeler dealer misplaced funds is it wrong for the press to report that the Lockerbie terroist s release was arranged by Blair months ago I dont think so paul r I think you are a good person kidding yourself The labour party have given the press enough rope to hang themselves I have voted labour all my life but I will not at the next election it frightens me what Blair has done to the party and old Brown has been left to scrape up the pieces

Friday October 2, 2009, 6:23 am
Those of us who don't like terrorists in our midst are not happy with the decision to let a suspect out because identity of agents have to be protected. That's a bad and dangerous decision, after so many terrorist attacks prevented on late stages.

Saturday October 3, 2009, 1:10 pm
Keeping people in prison or under control orders - people who have never had anything to do with terrorism of any sort - has been the Labour Govt's way of kow-towing to the right-wing media. When Tony Blair said that the rules of the game have changed, he ordered the rounding up of men who had been tried and found not guilty in open court, with a jury who had tossed out the ludicrous accusations made against them in the Ricin Plot. There was no Ricin Plot. So is this what you want? People found innocent to be rounded up and forced to return to countries where they would be tortured? These are innocent people who fled from torture. Does this make you happy, Sleeping Beauty? Identity of agents had nothing to do with it. The agents in this case lied and a jury tossed out their rubbish. Would you want to be fingered by lying agents? Do you want to live in a democracy or not? So you want to abolish courts? Blair acted like a dictator. He went against a jury. These people on the jury were horrified and no wonder. The UK ceased to be a democracy under Blair and it continues. Not one of these people had anything to do with terrorism. But they were easy targets. Peole who did commit a terrorist attack in the UK were British born and bred, not Algerians fleeing from torture. Who knows what motivated them but a good guess would be the invasion of Muslim countries and the slaughter of innocent people. And there is still doubt about whether the whole thing was a set-up. There are questions to be answered. The media, paul r, are not trying to bring down a fairly elected government. This is pure fantasy. The media is as right-wing as Brown. The media - the BBC anyway - take their orders now from him. Rupert Murdoch's media are as far right-wing as you can imagine and has always been. His approval of Labour spoke volumes about what Labour had become. When Labour goes as it deserves to go it is because they adopted the right-wing beliefs of Murdoch, because they were for the rich and for the bankers. People are not stupid. The trouble is there is no choice. We will be stuck with another Tory government because the Labour Party went to the right and stayed there because of Blair and Brown. They are a bunch of useless chancers. At least if we have a Tory govt, there will be some honesty again - it will be those who have always stood for the rich. The truth is Labour is hated for everything they have done - and if you can't swallow that - tough - don't go blaming the BBC and Rupert Murdoch or any other right-wing effing media baron like Dirty Desmond. People choose to vote against bxxxxxds like Brown - just as shame there is no decent alternative.

Saturday October 3, 2009, 1:57 pm
Eleanor B why all the bad language you appear to be a very intelligent woman and make a lot of sense it really is not necessary to swear like a chav which you are not I agree with your comments concerning the government but I really do not need to read your obscenities it is totally unnecessary Paul r and sleeping Beauty deserve a reasonable reply. You are only giving your opinion Yes on some subject s I can agree with you but sometimes you do get a bit carried away we are all just talking and giving opinions leave out the swearing PLEASE

Saturday October 3, 2009, 2:11 pm
I am sorry if I have offended you, mare T., with my reference to Murdoch, Desmond, Brown and Blair as being bxxxxxds - but it is the way I feel. To me it is not an obscenity to refer to people as being such. They are obscenities in my view. To me it is fair comment considering what they have done to people in this world. Would scumbags be a better term? Okay, these scumbags I will say instead. It's the same difference. They are evil, vile people in my eyes - total scumbags.

Saturday October 3, 2009, 3:29 pm
In total agreement with you Eleanor B thank you SCUMBAGS describes them all perfectly