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FBI and DOJ Vow to Continue Using Junk Science Rejected By White House Report

Science & Tech  (tags: FBI, DOJ, forensics, research, "junk science", scientific validity and reliability )

- 723 days ago -
Report concludes that common, pattern-matching forensic disciplines -- bite mark analysis, fingerprint and firearm comparison, shoe tread analysis, and complex DNA mixture analysis -- need additional support to be deemed valid and reliable.


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Darren Woolsey (218)
Friday September 23, 2016, 2:53 pm
Shared over social media to spread awareness.

"In a statement reported by the Wall Street Journal, Attorney General Loretta Lynch said that the agency remains “confident that, when used properly, forensic science evidence helps juries identify the guilty and clear the innocent, and the department believes that the current legal standards regarding the admissibility of forensic evidence are based on sound science and sound legal reasoning.” As such, she said, while “we appreciate their contribution to the field of scientific inquiry, the department will not be adopting the recommendations related to the admissibility of forensic science evidence.”

The DOJ did not respond to The Intercept’s request for additional information, but based on her statement, it appears Lynch is saying there’s simply nothing to see here and that the criminal justice system is working just fine."

In reality, it's obvious it's not.

JL A (281)
Friday September 23, 2016, 3:37 pm
Especially bite marks IMO...some people are resistant to change, especially if it requires relearning or additional steps to effectively do their jobs. Thanks Judy

Judy C (91)
Friday September 23, 2016, 7:09 pm
It really is not, Darren. What Lynch is saying in other words, is why bother with science?

And JL, bite marks may be the worst. It would certainly open a huge can of worms to pay attention to this report, and Lynch obviously is not willing to expend the effort it would require to take action on this information. Justice will continue to suffer in this country.

Animae C (506)
Friday September 23, 2016, 9:55 pm
First there must be an admittance to fault, which obviously isn't going to happen!

Glennis W (395)
Saturday September 24, 2016, 7:59 pm
This is terrible especially the bite marks as they can cause infectious diseases to be passed on Thank you for caring and sharing Judy.

Glennis W (395)
Saturday September 24, 2016, 7:59 pm
Deplorable and frightening Thank you for caring and sharing Judy.

Darren Woolsey (218)
Sunday September 25, 2016, 12:07 am
Reshared to spread awareness, Judy.

This business of having independent bodies with their research, and Government clones saying one should make up one's own mind, is balderdash. If an independent scientific body conducts research, Governments and their extensions, SHOULD LISTEN and ACT responsibly.

Peggy B (43)
Sunday September 25, 2016, 2:02 pm
Well said Darren

Suzanne L (99)
Sunday September 25, 2016, 10:19 pm
A 'throw out the baby with the bathwater' approach is not helpful. Forensic studies and data need to be done and people must be well-trained, but I think calling everything used to date "junk science" is overkill.

Darren Woolsey (218)
Sunday September 25, 2016, 11:33 pm
Reshared to spread awareness, Judy

Joanne p (13)
Monday September 26, 2016, 8:13 am

. (0)
Monday September 26, 2016, 11:03 am
Like I believe White House reports............................................................

Judy C (91)
Monday September 26, 2016, 11:57 am
Scientific method is entirely objective. Criteria of validity and reliability are independent of opinion.

Roger G (148)
Monday September 26, 2016, 12:55 pm
well then why not go back to trial by fire or trial by drowning ? LOL
Science can NOT be forsaken because of some PC bozos believe science is junk !
noted, thanks

Janet B (0)
Monday September 26, 2016, 1:55 pm

Lois Jordan (63)
Monday September 26, 2016, 5:11 pm
Noted. Thanks, Judy.
To me, it was very shocking that A.G. Loretta Lynch took the stand she did. To be opposed to "scientific validity" just makes no sense to me.

Darren Woolsey (218)
Tuesday September 27, 2016, 12:35 am
We've entered an age of opportunism, where any body of authority can be challenged, and/or rejected, if another body's image and market share income is adversely affected.

You want this changing, you have to radically change the political climate and government organization, and it ain't gonna happen under Donald Trump OR Hillary Clinton.

Janet B (0)
Tuesday September 27, 2016, 1:37 pm

pam w (139)
Tuesday September 27, 2016, 7:34 pm
WHATTTT? How can bite marks be considered useless or inacurate? Fingerprint comparison is "junk science?" This makes no sense.

Ben O (140)
Wednesday September 28, 2016, 7:17 am
"Those who cannot change their minds cannot change anything"
(Mark Twain)

Beth M (138)
Wednesday September 28, 2016, 2:46 pm
Not surprised. Republicans do not believe in climate change either.

Darren Woolsey (218)
Thursday September 29, 2016, 4:38 am
Reshared news article over social media to spread awareness.


Lenore K (0)
Thursday September 29, 2016, 12:17 pm
the New Testament says not to make oaths

Janet B (0)
Thursday September 29, 2016, 12:51 pm

Darren Woolsey (218)
Thursday September 29, 2016, 2:32 pm
So, no Ten Commandments then. . .?

Janet B (0)
Saturday October 1, 2016, 2:15 pm

Winn Adams (179)
Sunday October 2, 2016, 2:48 pm

Janet B (0)
Sunday October 2, 2016, 3:00 pm

Greg K (1)
Sunday October 2, 2016, 3:53 pm
Police and prosecutors only need enough science to lock up the handy person who can be made to look guilty. Science that excludes the handy suspect is never welcome. Black men are favored suspects and there are always plenty of them that can be made suitable for framing. The most celebrated example of this attitude was the recently dead Scalia who I never liked but grew to hate when he said that the mere fact that a person can be proved innocent should not prevent the execution of the person as long as they had a trial. You can look up the exact quote but that sentiment is the reason I was glad to see 'FAT TONY SCALIA' had dropped dead. Most of the trouble with police, prosecutors, investigators, and judges is lack of respect for JUSTICE. The Justice Department is a cruel joke for anyone who would be foolish enough to go there for JUSTICE. Perhaps the name is just the ultimate ironic snark.

Lenore K (0)
Monday October 3, 2016, 3:52 pm
not suppose to make oaths accordingtoth bible

Darren Woolsey (218)
Tuesday October 4, 2016, 1:29 am
I think you might find that includes Patriotism.

Stephen Brian (23)
Wednesday October 12, 2016, 12:31 pm
I don't see the problem if these things are used properly: Imagine if a fingerprint has a 20% chance of error, and a bite-mark has a 30% chance of error, and a thread-match has a 50% chance of error. If you have all 3, then you're looking at a 3% chance (0.2 X 0.3 X 0.5 = 0.03) that they are all incorrect. With a reasonable suspect-pool of 100, that means there is about a 1-in-3 chance that you're looking at the right one. With a reasonable suspect-pool of 5, on the other hand, you can be pretty sure that's the one.

Used on their own, on the other hand, as the only investigative tool, any one of these would probably not lead to consistent reliably correct results.
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