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Most Muslims Don't Integrate.


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Stan
- 1046 days ago - breitbart.com



   

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Stan B (123)
Tuesday April 12, 2016, 1:49 am
The former head of Britain’s Equalities and Human Rights Commission (EHRC), Trevor Phillips, has admitted he “got almost everything wrong” on Muslim immigration in a damning new report on integration, segregation, and how the followers of Islam are creating “nations within nations” in the West.
 

. (0)
Tuesday April 12, 2016, 2:26 am
The former head of Britain’s Equalities and Human Rights Commission (EHRC), Trevor Phillips, has admitted he “got almost everything wrong” on Muslim immigration in a damning new report on integration, segregation, and how the followers of Islam are creating “nations within nations” in the West.

Phillips, a former elected member of the Labour Party who served as the Chairman of the EHRC from 2003-2012 will present “What British Muslims Really Think” on Channel 4 on Wednesday. An ICM poll released to the Times ahead of the broadcast reveals:

One in five Muslims in Britain never enter a non-Muslim house;
39 per cent of Muslims, male and female, say a woman should always obey her husband;
31 per cent of British Muslims support the right of a man to have more than one wife;
52 per cent of Muslims did not believe that homosexuality should be legal;
23 per cent of Muslims support the introduction of Sharia law rather than the laws laid down by parliament.
Writing in the Times on the issue, Phillips admits: “Liberal opinion in Britain has, for more than two decades, maintained that most Muslims are just like everyone else… Britain desperately wants to think of its Muslims as versions of the Great British Bake Off winner Nadiya Hussain, or the cheeky-chappie athlete Mo Farah. But thanks to the most detailed and comprehensive survey of British Muslim opinion yet conducted, we now know that just isn’t how it is.”

Phillips commissioned “the Runnymede report” into Britain and Islamophobia in 1997 which, according to both Phillips himself and academics across the country, popularised the phrase which has now become synonymous with any criticism – legitimate or not – of Islam or Muslims.

Durham University’s Anthropology Journal noted in 2007: “It has been a decade since the Commission on British Muslims and Islamophobia was established, a Commission that through its 1997 report, “Islamophobia: a challenge for us all” (“the Runnymede report”) not only raised an awareness of the growing reality of anti-Muslim and anti-Islamic hostility in Britain, but also marked the onset of what might be described as ‘the first decade of Islamophobia’. In doing so, the Runnymede report propelled the word ‘Islamophobia’ into the everyday common parlance and discourses of both the public and political spaces.”

Phillips says his new data shows “a chasm” opening between Muslims and non-Muslims on fundamental issues such as marriage, relations between men and women, schooling, freedom of expression and even the validity of violence in defence of religion. He notes – echoing an article on Breitbart London just two weeks ago which reveals a growing disparity between older and younger Muslims in Britain – that “the gaps between Muslim and non-Muslim youngsters are nearly as large as those between their elders”.

And while he is cautious to note that many Muslims in Britain are grateful to be here, and do identify with role models such as Hussain and Farah, there is a widening gap in society with many Muslims segregating themselves.

“It’s not as though we couldn’t have seen this coming. But we’ve repeatedly failed to spot the warning signs,” he admits.

“Twenty years ago… I published the report titled Islamophobia: A Challenge for Us All, we thought that the real risk of the arrival of new communities was discrimination against Muslims. Our 1996 survey of recent incidents showed that there was plenty of it around. But we got almost everything else wrong.”

His comments will come as a blow to those who continue to attack elements in British society who are concerned about Muslim immigration and integration, and in fact may even go some way to shoring up comments made by U.S. Presidential candidates Donald Trump and Sen. Ted Cruz (R-TX)97%
seeking to slow down or pause the rate of Muslim immigration into the West.

“We estimated that the Muslim population of the UK would be approaching 2 [million] by 2020. We underestimated by nearly a million. We predicted that the most lethal threat to Muslims would come from racial attacks and social exclusion. We completely failed to foresee the urban conflicts of 2001 that ravaged our northern cities. And of course we didn’t dream of 9/11 and the atrocities in Madrid, Paris, Istanbul, Brussels and London.”

“For a long time, I too thought that Europe’s Muslims would become like previous waves of migrants, gradually abandoning their ancestral ways, wearing their religious and cultural baggage lightly, and gradually blending into Britain’s diverse identity landscape. I should have known better.”

And Mr. Phillips even acknowledges that the mass sexual grooming and rape scandals that are plaguing heavily Muslim populated towns across Britain are because of Muslim – not ‘Asian’ – men. He writes: “The contempt for white girls among some Muslim men has been highlighted by the recent scandals in Rotherham, Oxford, Rochdale and other towns. But this merely reflects a deeply ingrained sexism that runs through Britain’s Muslim communities” – in a nod to those who have long protested this to be the case in the face of political, media, and even police cover ups.

Even left wing columnist Yasmin Alibhai-Brown told him: “[W]e [liberal Muslims] are a dying breed — in 10 years there will be very few of us left unless something really important is done.”

Phillips comments: “Some of my journalist friends imagine that, with time, the Muslims will grow out of it. They won’t.”

And indeed he lays the blame at the feet of the liberal, metropolitan elite, media classes: “Oddly, the biggest obstacles we now face in addressing the growth of this nation-within-a-nation are not created by British Muslims themselves. Many of our (distinctly un-diverse) elite political and media classes simply refuse to acknowledge the truth. Any undesirable behaviours are attributed to poverty and alienation. Backing for violent extremism must be the fault of the Americans. Oppression of women is a cultural trait that will fade with time, nothing to do with the true face of Islam.”

“Even when confronted with the growing pile of evidence to the contrary, and the angst of the liberal minority of British Muslims, clever, important people still cling to the patronising certainty that British Muslims will, over time, come to see that “our” ways are better.”

In terms of solutions, Mr. Phillips opines on “halting the growth of sharia courts and placing them under regulation” ensuring that school governance never falls into the hands of a single-minority group, “ensuring mosques that receive a steady flow of funds from foreign governments such as Saudi Arabia, however disguised, are forced to reduce their dependency on Wahhabi patronage” and an end to the “silence-for-votes understanding between local politicians and Muslim leaders — the sort of Pontius Pilate deal that had such catastrophic outcomes in Rotherham and Rochdale”.

Mr. Phillips’s comments echo those of the Czech president, and research from across Europe that revealed attitudes amongst Muslims on the continent have hardened. The younger the Muslim, the more likely they are to hold hard-line views, one recent study found.

This was written by a Muslim

 

. (0)
Tuesday April 12, 2016, 2:37 am
There is a large Muslim community in my area and they have turned it into a dangerous place for non-Muslims to be. They have attacked several people out walking their dogs and women who they believe are incorrectly dressed. Many people in this area are upset, they are not the peaceful Muslim portrayed so lyingly by our leaders here, across Europe and the US.

Growing non-Muslim Anger in Walthamstow about Jihadism and Islam
 

. (0)
Tuesday April 12, 2016, 2:44 am
Walthamstow used to be a lovely friendly area but, sadly, it has changed for the worse.

The British Muslims who want to live under the Islamic State

As Islamic extremists declare Britain's first Sharia law zone, the worrying social and moral implications
 

Shil O (0)
Tuesday April 12, 2016, 4:00 am
This is from an American viewpoint but is equally relevant throughout western civilization
mohammedanism summed up in a concise manner

Can a good Muslim be a good American? NO, and here is the answer why!
Maybe this is why our Muslims are so quiet and not speaking out about any atrocities.

Theologically - no. Because his allegiance is to Allah, The moon god of Arabia.

Religiously - no. Because no other religion is accepted by His Allah except Islam.
(Quran,2:256)(Koran)

Scripturally - no. Because his allegiance is to the five Pillars of Islam and the Quran.

Geographically - no. Because his allegiance is to Mecca , to which he turns in prayer five times a day.

Socially - no. Because his allegiance to Islam forbids him to make friends with Christians or Jews.

Politically - no. Because he must submit to the mullahs (spiritual leaders), who teach annihilation of Israel and destruction of America , the great Satan.

Domestically - no. Because he is instructed to marry four Women and beat and scourge his wife when she disobeys him. (Quran 4:34 )

Intellectually - no. Because he cannot accept the American Constitution since it is based on Biblical principles and he believes the Bible to be corrupt.

Philosophically - no. Because Islam, Muhammad, and the Quran do not allow freedom of religion and expression.

Democracy and Islam cannot co-exist. Every Muslim government is either
dictatorial or autocratic.

Spiritually - no. Because when we declare 'one nation under God,' The Christian's God is loving and kind, while Allah is NEVER referred to as Heavenly father, nor is he ever called love in the Quran's 99 excellent names.

Therefore, after much study and deliberation... Perhaps we should be very suspicious of ALL MUSLIMS in this country. They obviously cannot be both 'good' Muslims and 'good' Americans.

Call it what you wish it's still the truth. You had better believe it. The more
who understand this, the better it will be for our country and our future.

The religious war is bigger than we know or understand!
The Muslims have said they will destroy us from within.
SO FREEDOM IS NOT FREE.
.
 

Shil O (0)
Tuesday April 12, 2016, 4:04 am
Of course there are always "Dodgy Dave's" rehabilitation classes
 

Gene J (290)
Tuesday April 12, 2016, 6:01 am
This article highlights the difference between Muslim and non-Muslim immigrants. The same has always held true here in America. It takes 3 generations, at least, sometimes 4 to fully assimilate into our country.

Every immigrant population has followed the same general path, in the first, the home language is spoken at home, only the breadwinner begins learning English, the second generation is the first to attend school and begin to absorb our language and culture though often their language of origin is still spoken at home, the third generation is the first to finish high school and be essentially fully assimilated, they may or may not much, if any, of the native language, and the fourth generation is the first to attend college and be fully assimilated American's, no longer really identifying at all with their country of origin.

We've seen this play out in every immigrant group since our country was formed except for African-Americans who didn't immigrate, but were brought here as slaves, they are acculturated but alienated as well. Irish, German, Swedish, English, Indian, Hmong, Laotian all have followed the same path. So have, for the most part, Jewish immigrants though they do not all assimilate, many do, including intermarriage.

The exception is Muslims. They don't assimilate, ever. Mostly. Some small percentage will but most stay to themselves, their religion, their own schools and practices, they have no intention of assimilating - indeed one of their aims is to eventually have a population large enough to begin demanding exceptions be made for their religious practices - Holland, Sweden and other European countries are seeing this now, as their population grows, so do their demands.

Their ultimate aim is Sharia everywhere. The west is blind to this and I don't know why. I am not saying we discriminate against them but that we do not let them take over our country either, we remain a secular country allowing each other to practice whatever religion we choose but in our public life, schools, government we respect the Constitution and American cultural practices. If we don't, we will come to regret it. As we see happening now in Europe. This is a real danger to democracies everywhere, pretending it isn't will do no one any good. Political correctness is going to create nothing but more problems if we don't face what makes this group different from previous immigrants.
 

Past Member (0)
Tuesday April 12, 2016, 6:58 am
None near me & I hope it stay that way, there are no peaceful ones from what I see on TV & read about.
Noted
 

Past Member (0)
Tuesday April 12, 2016, 6:59 am
How could they possibly integrate? They hate the way we live & dress, & we sure don't want to live & dress like they do.
 

Stephen Brian (23)
Tuesday April 12, 2016, 8:11 am
This is the problem with wave-migration:

After WWII, the Migrant Workers program, meant to bring in temporary workers to help rebuild after the war, brought a whole lot of Muslims from Turkey and North Africa to Western Europe. Previous similar programs brought in other Europeans whose homelands were not so much poorer that they would not return home after completing their initial work, but this time, instead of temporary workers, they got permanent residents. They got so many new permanent residents so quickly that the communities arose with institutions of cultural perpetuation (schools, mosques, etc.) built before the community leaders, the longest-standing members of the that new dominant European Muslims community, could integrate. This is far from unprecedented. Looking at the U.S, and Canada, for example, we see a whole lot of different European ethnicity that maintained their respective heritages. However, those were already so similar to the dominant culture that we didn't see a problem with that.

The end-result is that instead of an immigrant community of, in this case, British Muslims, there is a transplanted community not even of, for example, Turkish Muslims, but of Turkish Muslims stuck around 1950 subject to foreign influences within the global Islamic community. What's worse is that even non-wave migration, normal migration trickling in slowly, can then join this preexisting transplanted community rather than integrate effectively into overall society.

That brings us to today, with another wave of Syrian migration. I am, as a rule, not a fan of ethnic quotas on migration or acceptance of refugees, but I do believe there is a mistake in the Convention on Refugees: Right now, by treaty, host-states are forbidden from regulating where the refugees may reside in any way that is not standard for all residents. (Obviously when nobody is allowed to just move into someone else's house or office or something, or squat on public property, or whatever, neither are refugees). It should be permissible to split them up to prevent wave-migration and help in integration. This would both help drive integration into overall society rather than existing transplanted communities and prevent the creation of new ones.
 

Gene J (290)
Tuesday April 12, 2016, 8:20 am
They could choose to integrate, Stardust, but most don't. We do have young people who do and have adopted our cultural norms, but most do not, we are really in the first and second generations and as I pointed out, no other immigrant population in those two generations is fully assimilated here by then either.

The major difference here is that, according to their religion, they are NOT to assimilate, indeed it is the opposite, propagate and grow until they are the majority and can convert the governmental system to Sharia. More or less, conquer us from within. The difference is we do NOT wish to be conquered in this way, yet it is happening in European countries that at first welcomed Muslim's with open arms. England, France, Holland, Sweden, and now developing in Germany, have huge problems with Muslim immigrants who do not go to school, who live on welfare and are taught to do so in order to bring about change their imams see as necessary.

We don't have a Council on Lutheran American Relations, or Catholic American Relations or any other religious group, why do we have a Council on American Islamic Relations? Why is this group special? That is because this group has other intentions than Lutherans, Catholics or Baptists. They do not intend to assimilate, they intend to convert as their numbers grow. The pattern is so clear it mystifies me as to why political leadership around the world does not recognize this for the ultimate danger it presents to any way of life that is not Islamic.
 

pam w (139)
Tuesday April 12, 2016, 8:25 am
HEAPS of stars on you, Gene....as always. We've all danced around the issue of religion far too long. Islam is NOT ''the religion of peace." It's a religion which demands submission...from its followers and from its neighbors. And that is a huge issue. Our children and grandchildren will have to deal with it.
 

Walter F (129)
Tuesday April 12, 2016, 8:46 am
Thanks Stan I agree but cannot see the point in repeating what I had said before many times about the "religion of peace" over and over. I.m no friend of it or for that matter any religion that is bigoted and exclusive and rejects the truth of others that lead to love,compassion and tolerance, Gene great comment and as usual straight to the point.
 

Maggie D (69)
Tuesday April 12, 2016, 10:57 am
Well said, Gene. The outcome of a migration of Muslims into America is obvious, we've seen the outcome in every country they have migrated to. This will in no way stop Obama from bringing as many as possible into the United States before he finally leaves the presidency. Before Obama we had Americans, now we have African-Americans, Mexican-Americans, Asian-Americans and God knows how many other divisive groups. The Muslim-Americans won't be required to assimilate at all, just as the Mexicans aren't required to assimilate. I remarked in another post, "Get out your Arabic dictionaries." Obama has been a disaster for America and his legacy will be further destruction of the United States.
 

Patricia Martinez (63)
Tuesday April 12, 2016, 11:04 am


I think the article, and comments by Gene and Shil have summed up the issue well. Islam is a whole different bag from virtually every other religious and ethnic group. "Good" or "pious" Muslims are by definition enemies of Democracy and Western (or any other) values. Many Muslim groups have gone on record saying as much. CAIR/Muslim Brotherhood, of course, are much more politically savvy and use the lexicon of Western values, but they actually mean almost polar opposite things, and this is an attempt to confuse and fool people, which unfortunately they too often do.

There are, of course, Muslims who, for one reason or another, have come to detest the massive violence and hatred that is intrinsic to Islam. Many of these people have become Islamic reformers, who want to eliminate all these hateful elements so that Islam is largely just another way of worshiping. These are good-hearted people, and they deserve a lot of credit, because they are good citizens of their respective countries, value their freedoms, and quite frankly, put their lives on the line from their "pious and good" Muslim wackos, who would like to end their lives for the state of Fitna they believe the reformers are engendering.

Some Muslims simply hate Islam and want nothing to do with it. They don't convert out, but they often go completely secular. I know some, and I think they are trustworthy and good people.

There are also Muslims who, for good reasons, have become ex-Muslims, and these people also have put their lives on the line, since Islam teaches that one who leaves Islam MUST BE KILLED. Ex-Muslims often speak out about the many horrific problems with Islam as they saw it from the inside. Sometimes they do it with their own names, and sometimes they do it - for fear of their lives - with pseudonyms. Either way, my hat goes off to them. They have a tremendous amount of intelligence, integrity and courage.

There are Muslims on the Care2 list that desperately try to derail the gist of the articles and discussions with dishonest and disingenuous arguments. I would not be at all surprised if some show up to do this on this discussion.

Someone told me an interesting story from Care2 that there was, however, I think her name was Kathy Pitchford, who had converted to Islam. She used to argue with the Islam apologists and against Israel, as the two almost always go hand-in-hand. But finally she couldn't stand the dishonesty of the pro-Islam group, because she saw the examples of the awful things that Muslims were doing on a daily basis (maybe in Egypt?), and she converted out of Islam. It was a real nightmare for her. I don't know where she is or if she is still on Care2, but I am humbled by her integrity and honesty.

I hope that more people who have the intelligence, integrity and honesty will come to see that the world of Islam is darkness and a death cult, even if it provides a spiritual and communal path, its overall pattern is misery for the world, for women, children, (its own) and for non-Muslims. Let us hope that Muslims can find a spiritual and Godly path on some other road that leads to peace for the world.

 

Stephen Brian (23)
Tuesday April 12, 2016, 11:20 am
Some can choose to integrate, but I've seen dynamics where members of a minority-community are "sheltered" and never even get to interact with the broader society. Again, with wave-migration creating an assimilated community large enough to "shelter" a substantial proportion of its members, this creates conditions among Muslims and other groups where there is a major anti-integration movement within the community. (The other examples I'm thinking of are some groups of Haredi Jews in the U.S., Canada, and Israel.)
 

Patricia Martinez (63)
Tuesday April 12, 2016, 1:01 pm


@Stephen Brian

Yes, there are groups that are insular and do not mix much with the outside world, Amish, Mennonites and Haredi come to mind. They also dress very modestly and different from Western norms and share other differences that set them apart from the greater assimilated Western cultures in which Sthey live.

But Stephen, the way you whitewash Muslim/Islamic dynamics by comparing them to Haredi (or Mennonites or Amish) is kind of like saying that C-4 (putty explosives) is just like Silly Putty.

No they're not.

So maybe the Haredi, Amish, Mennonites, etc., are insular and came over in wave-migrations, but let's point out some very EXTREMELY IMPORTANT differences from their Islamic counterparts.

1) Haredi, Amish, Mennonites do not create NO GO ZONES in multiple countries in which Fire, Police and Rescue cannot go in without being attacked and having their vehicles torched and destroyed.

2) Haredi, Amish, Mennonites do not have the highest per capita criminal rates in their respective countries and try to make converts to do Jihad in prisons.

3) Haredi, Amish, Mennonites, do not have it in their theology to do Jihad – military destruction of people who do not believe the way they do. They do not go around stabbing people, running them over with vehicles, blowing up airports, restaurants, churches, burning people alive, crucifying them, beheading non-believers.

4) Haredi, Amish, Mennonites to not take sex slaves, nor is allowed in their theologies. They do not kidnap members of other religions and force them to convert to Islam. They do not then rape them and force them to have little Islamic – or Haredi or Amish or Mennonite children.

5) Haredi, Amish, Mennonites to not Honor Kill their wives or daughters. They do not throw acid into their wives faces.

6) Haredi, Amish, Mennonites, do not throw their gay members off tall buildings or hang them from gallows or cranes.

7) Haredi, Amish, Mennonites do not take four wives, even when it is illegal to do so, and set up separate households for each wife at the government’s cost.

There are many more comparisons and contrasts. I think you can see we are talking about two entirely different animals. Yes they may both have fur, four legs and a tail, and that’s about where the similarities end.

 

Patricia Martinez (63)
Tuesday April 12, 2016, 1:09 pm


BY THE WAY, GENE, CARE2 HAS CUT OFF MY C2 MESSAGES, STARS, BUTTERFLY POINTS, AND COMMUNICATIONS WITH OTHER PEOPLE SO I CANNOT SEND OUT MESSAGES, CARDS, ETC.

PLEASE FORGIVE ME ANYONE WHO HAS NOT HEARD FROM ME. I AM UNABLE TO COMMUNICATE WITH YOU THROUGH CARE2.

 

Birgit W (160)
Tuesday April 12, 2016, 1:22 pm
We have to realize that we are all one, and each person has received a different upbringing and brainwashing. Hatred does not solve any problems, only love does. Thanks.
 

Carola May (20)
Tuesday April 12, 2016, 1:22 pm
This man is finally "getting it", but how long will it be until our mainstream media and establishment leaders, like politicians, "get it"? Fortunately, things seem to finally be turning around to something similar to sanity with even our Archbishop of Canterbury speaking out that people have genuine fears that must be addressed and are not being addressed by our leaders.

Let's remember that Churchill came along and was condemned by the media and establishment - politicians and churchmen alike - for being a "hatemonger" for speaking out about the danger of Hitler and Nazism. The establishment and media in the 1930s treated Hitler and the Nazis just like the establishment leaders and media are treating Islam and Islamic hate teachings, arrogance, supremacy, colonisation, and terrorism today - denying it, pretending it doesn't exist, hoping they can appease it and make it love us, and condemning anyone who points out the truth of Islamic hate and terrorism as "racists", "islamophobes" and "bigots". Just like they did to Churchill. But he was right and they were wrong - just like they are wrong now.

Let's hope a Churchill comes along soon to save western civilisation before it is too late, if it isn't already too late, especially for Sweden, Germany, France and Belgium.
 

. (0)
Tuesday April 12, 2016, 2:00 pm
Liberty GB Leader was arrested for reading the following excerpt about Islam from the book The River War by Winston Churchill:

"How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its votaries! Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in a man as hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy. The effects are apparent in many countries. Improvident habits, slovenly systems of agriculture, sluggish methods of commerce, and insecurity of property exist wherever the followers of the Prophet rule or live. A degraded sensualism deprives this life of its grace and refinement; the next of its dignity and sanctity. The fact that in Mohammedan law every woman must belong to some man as his absolute property – either as a child, a wife, or a concubine – must delay the final extinction of slavery until the faith of Islam has ceased to be a great power among men. Thousands become the brave and loyal soldiers of the faith: all know how to die but the influence of the religion paralyses the social development of those who follow it. No stronger retrograde force exists in the world. Far from being moribund, Mohammedanism is a militant and proselytizing faith."

Whether or not you agree with it, the right to free speech is being eroded by the lack of Muslim integration and their determination to ensure that we don't speak out with the truth. We are called racists and bigots if we quote from the Quran or talk about the life of Mohammed. But if it is the truth then why is it racist? Because it shows the religion as it truly as and as Churchill has written.
 

Gene J (290)
Tuesday April 12, 2016, 7:19 pm
Not to harm a horse, but there is one more point I neglected to mention. The vast majority of immigrants to this country, and I assume to others, is to become Americans. I include everyone who applies for admission to this country. My own ancestors, I am 4th generation Swedish on one side, 2nd on the other, followed the pattern I outlined earlier. But they came here not to be Swede's in exile, but to become Americans, that was their dream. The difference, it seems to me, and the reason we have a CAIR but only for Muslims, is that they do not come here to be Americans, first and foremost, they come to be Muslim Americans and the American part is always, will always be, second. That mindset from refugee's is understandable in that in those instances, their hope is to return to their homeland. I do not sense that CAIR thinks that is what our current influx of Muslims over the last two generations is about, though some do indeed seem to have acclimated, they remain Muslims first and I don't think many of them, Somalians are the group I am most familiar with, intend to go back. They are here to stay but not as just plain Americans, Muslim Americans. I remember the controversy when JFK was running, I was 11, but I remember it clearly - the fear was that he would take orders first from the Pope, then apply them to America, he assured the electorate that would never be the case. I do not feel so sanguine about Muslim Americans, I do feel their religion and its aspirations will always come first. I prefer living in a secular nation, I believe that is part of the American dream. I am not at all comfortable thinking Muslim Americans share that ongoing vision. Not here, nor in any country they are now moving into so rapidly as refugees. This is not nearly over. I hope we keep our wits about us and do not let our desire to see all treated fairly overcome reason if it becomes apparent that some, or most, of our newcomers do not share our ideals on cultural and religious freedom.
 

Nimue Michelle Pendragon Gaze (339)
Tuesday April 12, 2016, 9:04 pm
I agree with Gene, couldn't have said it better myself - you hit the nail on the head, Gene. I will send you a lot of green stars when I can. Thanks for the story.
 

Colleen L (3)
Tuesday April 12, 2016, 11:32 pm
I too agree with Gene's comment. Thanks Stan
 

Stan B (123)
Wednesday April 13, 2016, 1:58 am
Thanks for all the interesting comments.
I'm no fan of the late, crazy Moammar Gadhafi but his words below spoken ten years ago have proved to be strangely prophetic. He was much more cluey than our current leaders.

" Islam will take over Europe without violent force within a few decades, said Libyan Leader Moammar Gadhafi in a speech aired on the Arab satellite network Al Jazeera.

“We have 50 million Muslims in Europe,” Gadhafi said. “There are signs that Allah will grant Islam victory in Europe – without swords, without guns, without conquests. The 50 million Muslims of Europe will turn it into a Muslim continent within a few decades.”

If Turkey is added to the European Union, the Libyan leader said, Europe will have another 50 million Muslims.

Albania, a Muslim-majority country, and Bosnia, which is half Muslim, also appear to be on their way to EU membership.

“Europe is in a predicament, and so is America,” Gadhafi said. “They should agree to become Islamic in the course of time, or else declare war on the Muslims.”

Excerpts of Gadhafi’s speech, broadcast April 10, were translated by the Middle East Media Research Institute, or MEMRI. A video clip of the speech can by viewed online.

Gadhafi emphasized Muslims view Muhammad the prophet not only of the Arabs or Muslims but “of all people.”

“He superseded all previous religions,” Gadhafi said. “If Jesus were alive when Muhammad was sent, he would have followed him. All people must be Muslims.”

He said Christians believe Muhammad is not their prophet because their holy texts “are forged and call for hatred.”

“The so-called Old Testament and New Testament are neither Old Testament nor New Testament – because both testaments were superseded, and they are forged,” he said. “They were written by hand hundreds of years after Jesus.”

Gadhafi continued: “In the Bible there are things that are inappropriate for both Jesus and Moses. If we want to mend the state of humanity, and live in a global village, because of the globalization, we must search for the true Bible, because the Bible that exists today is a forgery. Today’s Bible does not mention Muhammad, whereas our Lord’s Bible mentions Muhammad repeatedly.”

One of the few things he got right.

 

Margie FOURIE (148)
Wednesday April 13, 2016, 2:26 am
This is the same whatever we believe in. It takes a very enlightened person to accommodate all religions.
 

basabi Banerjee (28)
Wednesday April 13, 2016, 9:30 am
We Indians are the worst sufferers of this feelings of the Muslims in our country. You are experiencing this for a few decades and our record goes back to the 14th century when they setlled down to rule over India. But even after the 700 years of co existence they are not our own . They are Muslims first and Indians later. There are exceptions of course to prove the law.
 

Margarita R (24)
Wednesday April 13, 2016, 12:32 pm
thanks for sharing
 

Derek Richardson (192)
Wednesday April 13, 2016, 2:27 pm
They come not to integrate, but to slowly but surely take over an area, and them spread outwards.
 

Lenore K (0)
Wednesday April 13, 2016, 3:00 pm
ty
 

Stephen Brian (23)
Wednesday April 13, 2016, 8:44 pm
Hi Patricia :)

I know there are vast differences between these Islamic communities and most other insular groups. They operate on a totally different model of society that puts them, in a very literal sense, at war with their neighbors, value intolerance for the same reasons our societies learned to value tolerance, and make a point of remaining medieval. I was just referring to the reasons why members of those communities do not abandon them for generally more appealing lives that are available to them as assimilated, or at least integrated, Westerners. The dynamics behind that non-integration are similar to those behind the non-assimilation of the Haredi and the Amish.

Hi Stan :)

They're not going to take over Europe. Europe will simply have another Holocaust in a bit under a decade, targeting Muslims, Jews, South Asians, Africans, and whomever else is unlucky enough to be perceived as, or to have been genuinely turned into, an advantaged minority or newcomer by the European radical Right-wing.
 

Patricia Martinez (63)
Thursday April 14, 2016, 2:25 pm


@Steven

I think you underestimate the programmed suicide of most Europeans -- thanks to their politicians, academia, media, and so on, and the Jihadist Islamic-messianic/Khalifa fervor at all costs -- especially as a ticket to Paradise for the Muslims. I would not give so much weight to the Right-wing by any means. True, there seems to be a slow awakening, but it's from the ground up, not the elite, well-placed in the system with all the power and advantages, who are clearly in bed with the Islamists.

Not that things won't get very messy, but I don't see any such outcome as the one your little crystal ball seems to be showing you. Europe is far more likely to go out with a poof than a bang.

 

Darren Woolsey (218)
Wednesday May 11, 2016, 3:21 pm
I live in Bradford, West Yorkshire.
Population currently 500,000 with a heavy contingent of Muslims
For the most part, THEY DO integrate well into society from what I experience.

However, it may be added here that the Western World has largely and almost certainly historically tried to IMPOSE its value systems on other countries, so this blanket judgment of Muslims doesn't really present a balanced picture.

One can broadly associate the Indian Caste System with the British Class System, both of which are dysfunctional, and held in place by an old superiority complex fed into by various strands of humanity that make up the British psyche.

Also, Bush and Blair's illegal invasion of Iraq was in effect trying to establish control and subtle acquisition of riches and resources available within the Middle East, as well as imposing a dysfunctional version of democracy, about as dysfunctional as the ones operating in both Britain and America at present.

Religion is used as an excuse to divide by controlling Corporate power bases. Egoism is the main real danger.
 

Past Member (0)
Wednesday May 11, 2016, 3:34 pm
OUTLAW MOSQUES AND REVOKE CITIZENSHIP OF IMAMS & DEPORT. THE REST WILL FOLLOW IMAMS BACK TO MIDDLE EAST.
 
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