Hola everyone

How can we end poverty and oppression in Peru?

Here is an article from earlier this year that may be controversial. If you choose to read it, you can learn alot about how people are dealing with poverty and oppression in Peru

PERU: Police occupation heralds new unrest

Luisa Ara

http://www.greenleft.org.au/back/2005/611/611p20.htm

In the early hours of the morning of January 1^{, in Andahuaylas, one of Peru’s poorest cities, approximately 150 ex-military rebels, members of the Peruvian Nationalist Movement (MNP) headed by Antauro Humala, stormed the city headquarters of the Peruvian National Police (PNP).}

Unarmed when they broke in, they took weapons from 17 police officers they took as hostages. Their demands were the resignation of the president, Alejandro Toledo, who they accused of corruption and his replacement with the vice-president, and the calling for a National Constitutional Assembly (NCA), which would involve ex-army officers, coca farmers, retired workers, construction unions, un-employed unions, farmer federations, and other workers unions).

This sparked support from other parts of the city and other neighbouring cities by students and peasant movements. This has further plunged Peru in crisis, with the interior minister forced to resign over his handling of the situation.

The Humala brothers appeared on the Peruvian political scene in October 2000. Lieutenant-Colonel Ollanta Humala and General Antauro Humala marched out of their headquarters with their followers, organised ex-military soldiers, to demand an end to the presidency of Albert Fujimori. When Fujimori fell a month after the uprising, they handed themselves into the authorities.

Since then, they have been considered heroes by the anti-Fujimori movement. They didn’t last two days in prison before being freed, reinstated in the military and Ollanta was sent to France and then Korea; last December he was discharged.

Antauro took over leadership of their “ethnocacarista” movement. Apparently this movement has 1000 members in the country, mainly ex-military soldiers.

Antauro edited the widely circulated newspaper Ollanta, which was distributed by the members of MNP in military uniform. Their ideology is somewhat confusing. The “ethno” in ethnocacerismo refers to Peru’s majority indigenous population. The cacerismo relates to Andres Avelino Caceres, who used to be a member of the military who, in the 1879 civil war, resisted the Chilean invasion of the south of Peru after Lima had given up. He organised an indigenous guerilla movement for the resistance, which is what the Humala brothers praise. But he is also known to have turned against the indigenous movement when it tried to organise against repressive Peruvian landowners. When he later became president of Peru, he continued to support the existence of the peasant-exploiting land owners.

However, the Humala brothers support the indigenous community attempts to fight the neoliberal policies of the government and propose the return of the “values of the Inca Empire”, before the Spanish invasion of South America. They support Venezuela’s left-wing President Hugo Chavez and admire the Cuban Revolution. The ethnocacerismos’ hardcore nationalism is much criticised by other sectors of the left. The Humalas see Chile as an enemy country, probably, because of the amount of Chilean capital in Peru and the history of civil wars between both countries.

A January 11 article by Raul Zibechi for <http://www.argenpress.info>, explains that after reaching 30% of electoral representation, the left in Peru was literally wiped off the socio-political map in the 1990s. Caught between the indefensible murderous actions of the Pol-Pot-like Maoist rebel group Shining Path and the human-rights violations of Fujimori regime, left activists have been mostly silent for the last decade. After Fujimori was overthrown, Alejandro Toledo was elected president, with great expectations becaise of his indigenous background. Toledo, however, leads a pro-imperialist government and his support has mostly dissapated. By early 2005, his approval rating was a dismal 1.6%. According to Cesar Zelada, writing at <http://www.rebelion.org>, on January 12, Peru “needs 8000 million nuevos soles (US$2450 million), approximately, to fix its social demands. Nevertheless, its pro-imperialist government privileges its compromise with the international Monetary Fund [to pay off] external debt, the privatisation of their electrical plants, and the forced eradication of the coca leaf.”

Despite the failure of left-wing groups to speak against these policies, indigenous people organised massive protests against these neoliberal policies. The MNP calls for assassinations of corrupt “government agents”. This is opposed by many on the left, including long-term peasant leader Hugo Blanco. Blanco explained where this sentiment comes from, however, in an Argenpress interview, in which he said there was “an inflaming rage against corruption within the Peruvian population”.

 [ send green star]

 [ accepted]

This rage has been expressed in numerous occasions during the last year: when the people of the city of Ilave kicked their mayor to death, when the people from Azangaro, sick of the corruption of judicial and police authorities who were paid by thieves, killed a thief by burning him alive, or when the cocaleros (coca-growing peasants) marched in thousands towards Lima, demanding Toledo stop his plans of eradication of the coca fields. Similar uprisings happened in most southern cities of Peru: Tambogrande, Cajamarca, Cuzco, Cerro de Pasco, Puno and Arequipa.

From September to October, university students occupied three major universities in Peru. In two, the action forced the resignation of the university chancellor and other officials. These occupations, in which one student died, were protesting the attacks on tertiary education that started under the Fujimori government, and calling for an NCA. This university counter-reform is based around three new laws, laws 739, 700 and 726, which not only permit armed forces access to campuses and give the government the power to condition the syllabus and curriculum, but also establish the right of the universities to charge fees, and limit student involvement in campus government.

On July 14, about 60% of Peru’s workers went on strike. The strike was widely supported by the Peruvian population. According to the Institute of Investigation of Economic Science (IDICE), 65.6% of the population approved of the strike, 89.7% believed that the reasons for the strike were legitimate and 92.2% recognised the right to organise against Toledo. On January 2, Antauro Humala was detained while he was meeting with mediators to discuss his demands. Even though he had already agreed to give himself up on January 3 ^{under certain conditions, the armed forces seized him, arguing that his demands were unreasonable. The rebels who were still at the headquarters at the moment of his capture agreed to abandon the police headquarters by noon of that day, but changed plans when they saw the armed forces had advanced too close to the headquarters. Antauro is being held in the anti-terrorist police department in Lima. The ethnocacerista movement has a base on the military sector, but its not yet a mass movement. They have started a military rebellion, separate from organisations and other movements of the struggle in Peru. But their popularity is rising, and it seems to have inspired other sectors of the movement to keep mobilising. According to rebelion.org’s Luis Arce Borja, even though the Humala brothers opposed the parliamentary system of Peru, they have asked their followers to collect 390,000 signatures for their registration to run in elections.}

According to Ricardo Napuri, a veteran Peruvian socialist, the MNP is a movement that is responding to the same concerns that that are igniting the whole of Latin America. If the ethnocaceristas decide to follow the electoral route, it will be interesting to see if they can represent a real alternative, in the same way that has emerged elsewhere.

From Green Left Weekly, January 19, 2005

http://www.greenleft.org.au/back/2005/611/611p20.htm

Good on you for reading this!   What do you think?

 [ send green star]

 [ accepted]

its so sad that the leaders of peru have fallen short of what was expected of them..i mean..the first guy..Caceres..fought for Peru..a great cause..but then later on went to diminish what he had done with supporting exploiting landowners...sometimes its worse off for the people working on the land than when they have no land..?

argh.why cant there be more people like Blanco? can't he take it a step further than being a peasant leader? i mean if its corruption and poverty that are the problem..then more people llike Blanco need to come forward i think..but its not as easy as it looks i guess.and 2450 million is a huge sum of money..

hey simon thanks for the post!

 [ send green star]

 [ accepted]

Thanks baby for this interesting thread...

Yes the discrimination is very big here..the racism also is very big..the people think they are betters than anothers..and also we have corrupt polices here..who just want money ..you know why??they has to do 10 ordenes...i mean present 10 "multas"...they are abvusives....of course..i think still exist polices who  are good people..but is sadness to see ehre..the mayority is corrupt..

i will contiue reading the second post..

 [ send green star]

you know..the same thing is going on in india..government officials and police..they get paid to look the other way.they've actually started a campaign against corruption..but i have a feeling its a little late cos its so imbedded in society..

 [ send green star]  [ accepted]

In the middle of an acute loss of prestige of the political system and democratic institutions and permanent social convulsion in Peru, "the etnocacerista" movement seriously destabilized the fragile government of Toledo, by means of bloody but focused rebellion armed that it would have tried to politically relaunch "the etnocaceristas" leaders, Antauro and Ollanta Humala (having like maximalista objective, the fall of the administration Toledo), with the purpose of reaching the power in a medium term, following the model of Chávez in Venezuela and Gutiérrez in Ecuador

In the meantime, the Humala advocates an ultranationalist, socialist and dogmatic speech with racist expressions, oriented to be elevated like spokesmen of ethnic groups and marginalized classes, with the participation of a wing of the Armed Forces;  finally, since Antauro Humala is in prison, one does not discard that his brother Ollanta commander, retakes the leadership of the movement in order to postulate in the general elections of the 2006.

Refugee and supported by compatible parties of left, assuming a profile more politician than military man although always under the group antisystem and of ethnic-social vindication;  without the possibility of a new riot disappears, while they are mobilized the "etnocaceristas" and continues the accelerated decomposition of the regime of Toledo.

 [ send green star]

Where did you get that last post from, Paola?

How do you think we end poverty and oppression in Peru?

 [ send green star]

 [ accepted]

Paola, that last post you did says:

"the etnocacerista" movement seriously destabilized the fragile government of Toledo"

 - That "government of Toledo" treats most people in Peru very badly, keeping them in poverty. Don't you want to destabilize it? I do. I want a better government than that one!

"would have tried to politically relaunch "the etnocaceristas" leaders, Antauro and Ollanta Humala (having like maximalista objective, the fall of the administration Toledo), with the purpose of reaching the power in a medium term, following the model of Chávez in Venezuela"

 - Do you dislike Chavez in Venezuela? If you do dislike Chavez, please say why?

 [ send green star]

 [ accepted]

Paola, that last post you did says:

"the etnocacerista" movement seriously destabilized the fragile government of Toledo"

 - That "government of Toledo" treats most people in Peru very badly, keeping them in poverty. Don't you want to destabilize it? I do. I want a better government than that one!

"would have tried to politically relaunch "the etnocaceristas" leaders, Antauro and Ollanta Humala (having like maximalista objective, the fall of the administration Toledo), with the purpose of reaching the power in a medium term, following the model of Chávez in Venezuela"

 - Do you dislike Chavez in Venezuela? If you do dislike Chavez, please say why?

 [ send green star]

 [ accepted]

I believe the demands of the Peruvian Nationalist Movement (MNP) members who took over that police headquarters were what my article said:

"the resignation of the president, Alejandro Toledo, who they accused of corruption and his replacement with the vice-president, and the calling for a National Constitutional Assembly (NCA), which would involve ex-army officers, coca farmers, retired workers, construction unions, un-employed unions, farmer federations, and other workers unions)."

I think that president is probably corrupt. Also, he definitely oppresses the cocaleros (coca-growing peasants).

I love those demands! That is more power for common people, less power for bourgeoisie (rich people).

Paola, what you posted suggests that socialism is bad. Do you agree? If yes, please say why?

It also suggests that it is bad to represent marginalized classes. Do you agree? If yes, please say why?

My article said "the Humala brothers support the indigenous community attempts to fight the neoliberal policies of the government". Do you support the same thing? Or do you prefer the neoliberal policies of the government? Or...?

That "an inflaming rage against corruption within the Peruvian population" that makes some people want assassinations of corrupt "government agents" is VERY understandable, even logical. People die from poverty in Peru - especially children. For some poor families, if the government people continue corruption (stealing money that should go to poor people for health care, etc.), then their child will die. So they might want to kill a corrupt government person, to save their child.

What does this mean Paola - "..and also we have corrupt polices here..who just want money ..you know why??they has to do 10 ordenes...i mean present 10 "multas""? Please tell us, what are the words "ordenes" and "multas" in English, Paola?

All countries which were and are dominated by imperialism are rich (e.g. Peru which is now dominated by the imperialism of the USA and some other nations). No imperial power goes into a poor country - that would be pointless. They go into rich countries - so they can get that wealth - the wealth of natural resources like oil and timber and metals, and the wealth from super-exploiting the labour of people there. Peru is rich! The reason that Peru seems to be "poor" is that so much of its wealth flows out to USA, etc.. My point is that if the people of Peru free themselves from imperial domination, then it will be easy for them to find that money (U.S.$2450 million) they need to meet social needs there.

 [ send green star]

 [ accepted]

Chavez..well...i m dislike yes Simon.cuz he was abusing of his power the las time...

I think i want change the government .i know Antauro Ahumala,,has another way ...he is a revolutionary.who believe in the change of the country...i think Toledo did anything for he seem (Antauro) like a crazy man..but also i think he is not crzy man...he has his ideales..

About the police i mencionated this cuz ..there  say...they was maltrate the people...and yes they are abusive..like you said/when we were talking) they just hear their boss...well..so they were tread bad this people..who did revolution for change the conutry..and dont be the same government..and the police use bombas lacrimogenas ans also hit the people...

People had fear all the police...

and about multas...i was giving a example of their job of the "police"her ein peru..they have to present 10 papers where say: this car dont have light...or this bus was in place where cant stop...and also police make this altohught you are not with red light or altohught you dont do a bad thing..just for have 10 papers to presnt ..and for this 10 papres...they recived a comision (money)

 [ send green star]

Thankyou for replying to some of my questions, Paola

"Chavez..well...i m dislike yes Simon.cuz he was abusing of his power the las time..." - Please tell me more? Where did you get your information about Chavez from? From the government news media? From corporate news media?

Government and corporate news media has said many things about me:

- that I and others at political demonstrations started violence against police (many times) [But I was there, and I saw that the police started the violence]

- that I and others who criticize our country sending soldiers to war are "bad", similar to traitors

- that I and others who write "let's share our wealth with the people of the third world", etc., on walls in Australia (while 30,000 children in the third world die from poverty everyday) are "bad" people

- that I and others who know that Nike pays its factory workers in Indonesia such low wages [to make shoes and clothes to sell in USA, Australia, etc.] that they cannot afford to get healthcare, cannot feed their children, and have to live in crowded factory dormitories, or in homes with no piped water and no toilets - that we who protest against Nike's exploitation of workers are "stupid" and "bad" (because we disturb people who are shopping, and we are "trying to stop wonderful economic globalisation", etc.)

- that I and other students who march on streets (and sometimes occupy university offices [do sit-ins]) to demonstrate to stop the Australian government from making students pay more for university are "bad"

Do you believe what the media says about ME? Do you think I am bad?

Also, where did you get your information ("Antauro Humala" post) above from?

By the way, I don't think Antauro Ahumala is perfect - but he sounds better than many Latin American politicians (who also use military and police violence) who keep society the same - so many people stay so poor.

If no-one else will reduce poverty and oppression as fast as Antauro Ahumala, how can you ask poor people to wait longer? If you are poor, it would be different. But your life is not poor, like so many people in Peru.

"..and the police use bombas lacrimogenas ans also hit the people..." Paola , what are "bombas lacrimogenas"?

 [ send green star]

 [ accepted]

By the way, I don't think Antauro Ahumala is perfect - but he sounds better than many Latin American politicians (who also use military and police violence) who keep society the same - so many people stay so poor....

yes bebe i think the same like you think

i will answer your questions soon ,when fix my computer..chiquito

 [ send green star]

Simon..and everyone...

Sorry about my comments about The president of Venezuela...i was reading more about him..and people is agree with his actions..he want to have a country with equitative thnigs for everyone...you can read in spanish a note about him ...in thi slink..

http://www.prensalatina.com.mx/article.asp?ID={2501AE59-0CBC-4F5A-ACAF-CF5D3F470867}&language=ES

 [ send green star]

Thankyou for posting that last link, Paola

You are very kind to say sorry, but I don't think it is necessary... you don't have to agree with me for me to love you... and I am not upset or offended if you do not agree with me...

I was keen to discuss all of those things I asked you questions about....

Some of the members of our group maybe also dislike Chavez, or disagree with a post for some reason. If any of you do feel that way, I want you to feel free to discuss it with us, we will keep it diplomatic and try to be friendly, eh? Debating can help us to further our collective knowledge

 friends, please feel welcome to say what you want

 [ send green star]

 [ accepted]

Simon & Paola -

I am not up to speed with the political current in Peru, but am cramming now to offer my input on this very important subject. This reminds me in a lot of ways of Mexico, especially during the early 1920's- late 30's.  One of my favorite artists - Diego Rivera -supported socialism and believed the answer for such problems was Industrialization.  He felt, this would equalize the races as well as the social classes

I can say this so far-

I think and have always thought ending poverty and oppression anywhere should start where it is most evident - the mistreatment and oppression of poor/native/indigenous, and undereducated peoples by wealthy, educated business/corporations/people and a influx of non native peoples into the affected country.

In a lot of countries with poverty and political strife, there is one common undercurrent.  A strong division between the wealthy and working class poor and the disengration of native culture, heritage, and tradition.

Finding a balance between technology and innovation, of advancing society and existing native society, and softening the influence of the growing population could help.  Equal distribution of wealth (or at least a narrowing of the gap), could also be the key to how to begin. But there are so many implications and possibilities that arise with such supppositions.  It is hard to know what will work without having a political model to look at.

There are so many similiar issues around the world. In Africa there are rich deposits of gold and diamonds, large multinational corporations have set up shop and employ native peoples to mine the rich deposits without care of their health or life, or the fact that they are taking what is not theirs and building empires off the backs of the poor and helpless without a second look back to help the people who make them rich. Africa still suffers from political corruption, tribal wars, oppression, poverty, starvation, and disease. How can this occur when there is so much potential for Africa as a whole to eradicate such problems.

Capitalism has long reaching effects on every society.  Many large corporations collect and monopolize the hard work of the poor to build their empires.  Even outsourcing work to poor countries affects that countries growth and balance and maintains conditions that contribute to poverty and oppression. 

In the whole scheme of things,  as long as there is a large disproportion of wealth within a population, unrest will be evident, oppression will continue. As long as there is a clash of native peoples trying to maintain their culture and keep their heritage with new residents from other countries who want to move forward and build a new society, there will be political strife.

Creating a solution to solve all the problems, almost seems Utopian in nature.

 [ send green star]

 [ accepted]

Could you please direct me to information that provides more of a background on Peru's struggles in these areas?

Also, what is the history of Coca farming -  when did it begin to take a strong foothold?

 [ send green star]

 [ accepted]

Thanks Cris..for your post..very interesting your opinion and the experence.

And about the coca..i will give you the links where you can see aobut estadistics (production and consumo)

http://www.devida.gob.pe/consumo.asp  here is De Vida link...is in spanish .but i know you know so so the spanish..anyway i will look more links in english for you my dear friend  (or when you ar ein chat )

 [ send green star]