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Can We Finally Disarm the NRA?


US Politics & Gov't  (tags: gun control, Newtown Massacre, gun violence, children, news, government, ethics, media, lies, politics, americans )

Cal
- 638 days ago - slate.com
Only if voters are willing to square off against a gun lobby that has almost never been challenged.



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Comments

Suheyla C. (229)
Tuesday December 18, 2012, 6:57 pm
Thanks Cal
 

Past Member (0)
Tuesday December 18, 2012, 7:17 pm
Not no mention war guns.
 

Kit B. (276)
Tuesday December 18, 2012, 7:20 pm

The old expression, "rats leaving a sinking ship" comes to mind, with even Bill O'Reilly wanting to find a compromise on gun related issues. How awful that it takes the murder of unarmed women and children to finally bring this back into the national dialogue.
 

John B. (215)
Tuesday December 18, 2012, 9:22 pm
Thanks Cal for the link to the article by Emily Bazelon. I hope the time has come for a meaningful sit-down-conversation and about firearms regulation and that the NRA is confined to the sidelines. Read and noted.
 

Stephen Brian (23)
Tuesday December 18, 2012, 9:25 pm
Here's the problem: Both gun-control and gun-proliferation are intended as strategies to address exactly the same issues. When pro-gun people talk about how they believe that the classic "First one to draw a gun is the criminal. The second is everbody else", they're not lying. They really believe it and they have cogent, reasonable, and fairly convincing arguments in favour of their beliefs. Events like a school-shooting aren't actually "a powerful anecdote demonstrating the urgency of your cause", as the article puts it. They just demonstrate the importance of the issue, and are interpreted by each side as supporting its own narrative.

The crazy part is that, arguably, both sides are correct. In rural areas, police response-times are apparently so long that in an emergency, they are generally useless. In urban ones, the danger of confusing the responding police is a major issue. Among those heavily into U.S. gun-culture, there is enough safety-training a general use-training to make weapons useful and safe to possess. Outside of it, and especially among gun-control advocates who I understand have mostly never touched a gun, they are accidents waiting to happen. Both armed gangs and militias, and genuine tyranny are real threats, and not stuff that "can't happen here". The lists of arguments and circumstances under which both are correct goes on, and those circumstances tend to be true for different demographic groups which split almost exactly along political lines. If there could have been two sets of laws, everybody would be happy and maybe even safer, but the same laws must apply to everyone.
 

pam w. (191)
Tuesday December 18, 2012, 11:57 pm
I'd LOVE to!
 

Rose NoFWDSPLZ (273)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 3:44 am
I can only hope ! Thanks Cal
 

John S. (303)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 3:56 am
Will be interesting to see what happens, but many of the problems seems to be centered on those that live in the areas where the shootings occur.
 

Angelica C. (84)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 4:13 am
After Sandy Hook we are all ready for this fight. We will win. We will defeat the NRA.
 

Giana Peranio-Paz (383)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 4:14 am
Let's home they come to a logical solution.
 

john hall (29)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 4:23 am
2012 was the best year ever for gun sale's and it's a shame that people who are against american's owning gun's and wanting them banned doesn't have enough damn common sense to see criminal's will be the only one's with them . If this country can't stop the flow of illigal's and illigal drugs flowing into this country how the hell are you going to stop the flow of gun's .
 

Diane O. (149)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 6:15 am
Thank you, John Hall. Where have you been? Merry Christmas!! As usual, you are a man of few words but they are always words that are right on the target no pun intended. So good to see you posting!
 

paul m. (93)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 7:33 am

! in 4 Americans own a gun ,,,,,,????
 

Arielle S. (317)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 7:49 am
Even now after this horrible tragedy, gun buyers are rushing out to load up on assault weapons and clips - just in case we actually get a bill banning them. WT? I do not understand the insane compulsion to own these weapons - what is it that makes them so attractive? Are we so insecure that we think having a piece of metal that murders, maims, KILLS will keep us safe? Our children ought to be able to go to school safely - we ought to be able to go to the mall or the movies without worrying about being shot. All guns do is foster paranoia and fear. I have not heard one single good reason for having them.
 

Bonnie M. (22)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 7:53 am
The issue is more than just gun control. As pointed out, this latest mass shooting is a screaming cry that
there is something wrong in today's society. Who is responsible? Look at the entertainment industry-graphic violence, vigilante justice, games about war and violence, add to this the internet... society has a recipe to stimulate an already disturbed mind. Media hype takes it too many notches above over stimulation and cry for blood. Should society be pointing fingers at what becomes a media frenzy and zero in on gun control and obscure what maybe at the heart of the problem? How many people walk among us feeling out of place,angry ,disadvantaged, suspicious ,traumatized and even feeling vindictive?
 

Kevin Dohse (1)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 8:27 am
Tens of thousands of people own these weapons and one owner goes berserk and the non gun owning community wants to advocate for gun laws or ban weapons. The gun laws are to protect the citizens in case of civil way that they can overthrow the government. The way thing are going that is getting closer. It has been proven that video games, movies and such are not disturbing the minds of those committing these crimes. It seems to me that if you want to make a difference and save lives in this country, let's look at the automobile, tens of thousands of lives are lost to people driving drunk, texting, talking on the cell phone, being tired or whatever. The difference is everyone owns one or two cars and not guns, and are so accustomed to people killing people with cars that they are numbed to it and don't think about it. I personally have never known anyone shot in a terrible incident such as just happened, i can quickly think of five family members who have been killed or injured in car accidents including myself who was hit head on by a drunk driver. If you want to raise a fuss, work on something that takes multiples of more lives that gun violence. Taking weapons away from citizens will only make criminals more bold and be the only ones with weapons except the police and if you have been listening to coverage of what the police are doing to citizens including journalist's after showing their press card maybe we need to arm citizens for their protection not take their arms away.
 

Robert B. (57)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 8:40 am
John Hall, surely you can't be that dense. There is a difference between banning all guns and sensible gun control. Why do people like you always see it as simply "banning all guns"? According to FBI information we have a mass killing (4 or more victims) on average of every 2 weeks. The gun lobby has fought gun since the Kennedy assassination. No one needs rapid fire weapons for personal defense or hunting. You know damn well that's true. So does the gun lobby and the NRA. The old worn out bit about "only criminals will have guns" is pure horse shit. That is NO excuse for fighting gun control. The responsibility for the latest murder of these innocent children lies squarely at the feet of the NRA , the powerful Gun Lobby and the bought off politicians.
 

Gloria picchetti (290)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 8:46 am
Much the same as winning the election I feel lucky about getting more strict gun laws. Let's make 2013 the year against guns.
 

Jamie Clemons (279)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 10:01 am
It took the police 10 min to respond in this upscale rich neighborhood. It only took the shooter 3 min. If the teachers had been armed and trained even a few of them the outcome may have been different. The shooter was denied purchasing a gun, so what did he do kill a lawful gun owner and use the illegally obtained guns to go to the school where he would meet unarmed people and do his dirty work. First of all we need to put the blame where it belongs not on inanimate objects that do not act by themselves and put the blame on the shooter who is probably mentally insane. Gun control did not work it did not stop him even though he was legally denied purchasing a gun. These shootings happen all the time in Chicago and it has one of the strictest gun laws in the US. The criminals will continue to ignore the laws and once we have disarmed everyone we will all be sitting ducks waiting for them to pick us off.
 

Kenneth L. (314)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 10:59 am
Robert B. is right on. Green star to you.
John H. and Jamie C. are typical. They use generalities and the fear of 'disarming everyone' so 'everyone will be sitting ducks'. Guns will never be gone from the U.S. Any idiot can see that. But assault weapons, you're a nutbar if you want one and stricter gun control is what's actually on the table.
The old use of fear by gun proponents and use of generalities to cloud and obfuscate should always be observed for what it is.
 

Mary Donnelly (47)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 12:31 pm
Thanks Cal.

Community attitudes need to change before laws do.
 

James E. (16)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 12:44 pm
Guns don't kill people, people do. Guns just make it easier. It is past time for serious gun control.
 

Past Member (0)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 1:20 pm
TY 70 school shootings since 1994. Looks like we finally have the right and NRA over a barrel. Let's hope we can make the ban law.

remember the B(R)ady bill?
 

Cynthia Davis (340)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 1:35 pm
Criminals always being able to get guns is not the issue here. These types of shooting are not done by criminals there done by mentally ill people using legally attained assault weapons with 30 round clips with hollowed out bullets that worsen the damage. We don't need these types of weaponry for anything. You don't need them for hunting or to protect yourself, you don't even need these kind of weapons to rob a bank.
Not one of those 20 children's life was worth any ones ridiculous support of the 2nd amendment to the point that any mentally ill person can buy, steal or use any kind of assault weapon to kill children with. ENOUGH IS ENOUGH WE NEED GUN CONTROL AND A BETTER MENTAL HEALTH SYSTEM.
 

jan b. (3)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 2:44 pm
Only people who want guns have rights.....the rest have to live with it. They use the ancient 2nd Amendment which was written when the army had only "muskets" and not written for our kind of population. We are supposedly civilized in the USA....but the fact we cannot send our children to school, go to the MALL, church or anywhere today because someone who has been taught to love guns will be there at our mercy.
 

Diane O. (149)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 2:53 pm
janice, let's set up something here and I hope you'll repond with your answer: You are at home late at night and you, your husband, and your three young, beautiful children are asleep in their rooms. You hear glass shattering downstairs in your home and you wake up and realize that someone has broken into your home. What is your first thought? Do you sit there in your bed like a sitting duck, do you pick up the phone and call 911....all the while you are listening to this intruder climb the steps up to your bedroom and your children's bedroom....what do you do? Do you decide to try and reason with this deranged person who, by the way, is pointing a gun at you? Or, have you gotten out of bed and reached for your gun ready to use it when this intruder has gone into your children's bedrooms? This is a serious question. Do you allow this person to take from you what matters the most to you in the world or do you point this gun at that person and say, "Touch my children and I'm going to kill you?"

This is a tough question. What would you do?
 

Diane O. (149)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 2:55 pm
To say it is a "love of guns" is not accurate. There are Americans who enjoy the sport of hunting and they have guns for that purpose. There are Americans who buy a gun, like me, to have in a safe place in the home, for protection only. When it comes down to me or the criminally insane, I'm going to be the survivor.
 

Allan Yorkowitz (453)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 3:00 pm
Disarming the NRA? Their wings will certainly be clipped. In fact I read that they are more than willing to be a part of legislative reform.
 

Diane O. (149)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 3:10 pm
Allan, I haven't read that. If you have a link for me to read I'll be happy to read it. What I do know is that the money received by the democrats and republicans from the NRA is something else to research.
 

Dianna M. (13)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 3:21 pm
"If guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have them." Well that's certainly original, I've never heard that one before. I'm sure that will be a big comfort to the families who lost loved ones in Sandy Hook, Aurora, Portland, Tucson, and the next mass shooting, and the next, and the next.
 

Karen R. (87)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 3:24 pm
I vote for peace - not guns!
 

Diane O. (149)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 3:52 pm
Karen, while you are advocating peace, there will be the mentally deranged, the drug infused criminals who will break into your lovely home in the middle of the night to accomplish one thing....kill you, multilate your children and take whatever you have in our home that will give them enough money for their next drug fix. So much for peace, huh? You have to live in the "real" world, Karen. There's no big group hug that will take away those individuals who have drug problems and needs and the mentally deranged who want to rape, mutilate and kill you. How would you address that?
 

Lois Jordan (55)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 4:57 pm
No amount of fearmongering is going to change my mind on this issue. Sen. Feinstein is introducing an Assault Weapons Ban, and we must pester our Congress critters to sign on...no watering it down. Get rid of multiple clips and gun shows. Fund the enforcement of all gun laws currently on the books--esp. background checks and no giving guns to those mentally ill. Yes, we need to address mental health issues as well....in a separate bill that funds health care with Medicare For All.
 

Past Member (0)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 6:07 pm
Although I don't own a gun (I have other weapons for defense) I am thankful for those responsible people who have guns. There is a good reason for the second amendment. Remember the war between the states?
 

Angelica C. (84)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 7:38 pm
Janice has nailed it on the head. That is exactly the problem. Right wing NRA supporters want what they want and the hell with the rest of the country. they love guns and want absolutely NO laws regulating them. Who cares about the victims of such policies? Only the other half of the country (the rest of us).
 

Nancy L. (139)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 9:37 pm
http://www.care2.com/news/member/714476182/3503202#addcomment
 

john hall (29)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 9:53 pm
Robert B. You are the typical obama supporter lets blame the NRA , let;s blame bad gun control , let's blame everything on other people or organization's . You need to blame the murder's of people by weapon's squarley on the shoulder's of the killer's and know one else. If you had been paying attention Holder and clinton and several other politician's with the help of the corrupt UN want all weapon's taken away from american's and if obama ever come's out and tell's the truth he want's them banned .
 

Nancy L. (139)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 9:55 pm

A LITTLE GUN HISTORY

I Thought you might appreciate this . .In 1929, the Soviet Union established gun control. From 1929 to 1953, about 20 million dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
------------------------------
In 1911, Turkey established gun control. From 1915 to 1917, 1.5 million
Armenians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded
up and exterminated.
------------------------------
Germany established gun control in 1938 and from 1939 to 1945, a total of
13 million Jews and others who were unable to defend themselves were
rounded up and exterminated.
------------------------------
China established gun control in 1935. From 1948 to 1952, 20 million
political dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and
exterminated.
------------------------------
Guatemala established gun control in 1964. From 1964 to 1981, 100,000
Mayan Indians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
------------------------------
Uganda established gun control in 1970. From 1971 to 1979, 300,000
Christians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

------------------------------
Cambodia established gun control in 1956. From 1975 to 1977, one million
"educated" people, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and
exterminated.
------------------ -----------
Defenseless people rounded up and exterminated in the 20th Century because of gun control = 56 million.
------------------------------
It has the now been 12 months since gun owners in Australia were forced, by new law, to surrender 640,381 personal firearms to be destroyed by their own
government, a program costing Australia taxpayers more than $500 million dollars. The first year results are now in:

List of 7 items: Australia-wide, homicides are up 3.2 percent
Australia-wide, assaults are up 8.6 percent Australia-wide, armed
robberies are up 44 percent (yes, 44 percent)!

In the state of Victoria alone, homicides with firearms are now up 300
percent. Note, that while the law-abiding citizens turned them in, the
criminals did not, and now only the criminals still have their guns!

While figures over the previous 25 years showed a steady decrease in armed robbery with firearms, this has changed drastically upward in the past 12 months, since criminals now are guaranteed that their prey is unarmed.

There has also been a dramatic increase in break-ins, home invasion robberies (with the people still at home) and assaults of the ELDERLY. Australian politicians are at a loss to explain how public safety has so drastically decreased, after such monumental effort, and expense was expended in successfully ridding Australian society of guns.

The Australian experience and the other historical facts above prove it.

Guns in the hands of honest citizens save lives and property and, yes,
gun-control laws adversely affect only the law-abiding citizens.

Take note my fellow brethren, before it is too late!

The next time someone talks in favor of gun control, please remind them of this history lesson.

With guns, people are 'citizens'.

Without them, they are 'subjects'.

During WWII the Japanese decided not to invade America
because they knew most Americans were ARMED!
 

Past Member (0)
Wednesday December 19, 2012, 10:17 pm
I am absolutely all for American citizens owning there own guns, and other weapons. I mean, look how we first won our independence from England... with guns. What if the same thing was every to happen again? The Chinese invade, North Korea, etc. I'm not saying that's going to happen either, btw. I mean, my grandfather owns hunting rifles, a few shotguns, and a few semi-automatic assault rifles. He has never shot anything but targets, and a few deer and wolves here and there. I think a man like that should be able to own weapons. We do need stronger gun laws though, but people should be able to still own the same type of guns, it should just be a longer, more indepth process with more blockades for attaining these weapons. Like say, if a person has a felony, they can't own a gun. If a person has a mental problem, they shouldn't be able to own a gun. If a family has a member with a mental disability, they shouldn't be able to own a gun. If a person is on any depression or anxiety medication, they shouldn't be able to own a gun. It's simple things like this that could cut down on gun violence. Plus, maybe we need to start putting police liasons in middle schools and elementary schools just for precautions. I think the Sandy Hook massacre would have been a lot different had an armed officer been stationed at that school
 

Eliza J. (7)
Thursday December 20, 2012, 2:27 am
I am posting the petitions from the White House Petition web site for those who haven't signed yet:
This one has 194,731 signatures and I believe was the petition cited in the NY Times yesterday as having received 130,000 signatures up to last Tuesday!! Keep them coming:

https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/immediately-address-issue-gun-control-through-introduction-legislation-congress/2tgcXzQC

A more recent one for an immediate ban by Presidential order on military type assault weapons and ammunition until Congress makes them illegal:
https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/immediately-sign-executive-order-banning-sale-assault-weapons-and-high-capacity-magazines-until/jSYMYh8g

Westboro as a hate group (225,470 signatures):
https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/legally-recognize-westboro-baptist-church-hate-group/DYf3pH2d

It is really important to keep the momentum going. The NRA is biding its time until passions subside and the slaughter of these children and their teachers is but a sad memory. Then they will push back and punish those lawmakers who stood up against them as they always do after these tragedies, and will then continue to spew their hateful culture and politics.

Please please spread the petitions via whatever means.

Thank you.
 

Diane O. (149)
Thursday December 20, 2012, 3:03 am
Sent you a giant green star, Nan! thanks for posting that line of history as it relates to banning guns.
 

Jaime A. (32)
Thursday December 20, 2012, 6:51 am
Noted, thanks.
 

John Gregoire (255)
Thursday December 20, 2012, 7:00 am
We need to atatck the culture of violence, permissive parenting and vehicles such as violent video games, movies and TV to break the two generation old cycle that preaches that killing, stealing and abusive, self-indulgent behavior is ok. We don't need more shrinks and we could easily limit weapons to one shot types but the former is the real problem. Attack the cause and not the tool.
 

Arielle S. (317)
Thursday December 20, 2012, 7:13 am
From the President's speech yesterday - it also might be noted that both Lyndon Johnson and Ronald Reagan were gun control advocates but could not get much passed, thanks to the NRA. If you read this last paragraph, can you still think we don't need gun control?

"The good news is there’s already a growing consensus for us to build from. A majority of Americans support banning the sale of military-style assault weapons. A majority of Americans support banning the sale of high-capacity ammunition clips. A majority of Americans support laws requiring background checks before all gun purchases, so that criminals can’t take advantage of legal loopholes to buy a gun from somebody who won’t take the responsibility of doing a background check at all.


Since Friday morning, a police officer was gunned down in Memphis, leaving four children without their mother. Two officers were killed outside a grocery store in Topeka. A woman was shot and killed inside a Las Vegas casino. Three people were shot inside an Alabama hospital. A four-year-old was caught in a drive-by in Missouri, and taken off life support just yesterday. Each one of these Americans was a victim of the everyday gun violence that takes the lives of more than 10,000 Americans every year -- violence that we cannot accept as routine."
.
 

Kenneth L. (314)
Thursday December 20, 2012, 7:46 am
@Nan L,, you mean A LOT OF GUN FEAR-MONGERING. There would be one hell of a lot of other variables and factors regarding every bit of data you listed, other than the conclusion you want everyone to take that 'gun control or reduction in guns means millions of deaths and crimes'.
Nice try, a kindergarten attempt at trying to use the idea that correlation means causation. Because it DOESN'T..
 

Reggie Thomas (5)
Thursday December 20, 2012, 7:51 am
The only way your gonna dis arm the NRA,if you have Millions dollar in your pocket to do to battle with.(o_O)
 

Angelica C. (84)
Thursday December 20, 2012, 8:31 am
Fine, then. We'll all chip in and donate millions across this country to make sure there is never another Sandy Hook. Enough is enough.
 

Cynthia Davis (340)
Thursday December 20, 2012, 2:15 pm
Diane O. & Nan L......... It's call GUN CONTROL, not GUN REMOVAL. You are arguing about taking control away from the mentally ill to attain an assault weapon with 30 round clips that have hollowed out bullets to worsen the impact on children in a class room. Shame on you for even thinking this isn't something that need to be addressed. Those Sandy Hook children's deaths are not worth anyone's ridiculous ideas of what the 2nd amendment means, or your childish scenario of what you do when someone's breaking into your house. You don't need these kind of assault weapons to protect yourself. Get real the NRA has you brain washed.
 

Angelica C. (84)
Friday December 21, 2012, 9:20 pm
Someone here said that hunting is a sport. I have tried and tried to understand how killing any living thing is a "sport." Where is the "sport" in walking into the woods and slaughtering unarmed creatures? And why do we want to teach children that "sport?" I am thinking of Paul Ryan, who recently bought his 7 year old daughter her first rifle and who has already made her first "kill."

Teaching our children respect for life would be far, far better.
 

Diane O. (149)
Saturday December 22, 2012, 4:37 am
Angelica, hunting is a sport. If hunters didn't clear out the number of deer in the woods they would all starve due to lack of food. I know there are those who do not believe in killing animals. I don't hunt for that reason. I love all animals, like you, but the fact is some of them must be thinned out or they will starve to death. I especially love birds and it pains me that they are shot but this has been going on since the beginning of time to kill animals for food. My grandsons belong to a shooting club where they learn how to shoot. I don't know the value of this but this is one of their activities.

Yes, Cynthia, it is gun control. I understand that and I'm all for it. Assault weapons are one thing and a hand gun is something else. I honestly like the idea of having an armed guard in each of our schools. If we go this route we can put our veterans to work, or at least those who would want this type of job, and it will hopefully deter other mentally ill people from targeting innocent children to gain their 15 minutes of fame.

My comments were not childish. We are here to discuss all sides of the situation. I believe all of us want the same thing but our approach to getting there is different.
 

Diane O. (149)
Saturday December 22, 2012, 4:44 am
John G, I agree with your comments!!
 

Angelica C. (84)
Sunday December 23, 2012, 11:43 pm
I know that this is one of the claims made by hunters, Diane. I spent an afternoon in Ky talking to a forest ranger at Mammoth Cave State Park a few years ago. I asked him about this issue. He said that winters take care of overpopulation. That is built into nature in places that clearly have 4 seasons to the year. In the south, however, things are different and you have overpopulation and massive infestation of ticks in the summers where deer are allowed to live in peace. I don't know what the answer is in the south, but I do know that we never taught our son that killing is a sport. It is a vile thing to teach a child, I believe. I would never go out to the woods to kill some wild creature. To me, it shows a lack of respect for life itself.

That I say this is in no way a commentary on your grandsons. Please believe me when I say that. This is me, expressing what I believe is right for me and my son. I know that many people believe that this is helping to maintain the herd or the flock. But another point made by animal behaviorists who have studied herds that were thinned by hunters, is that hunters want to shoot the healthiest animals Natural selection allows animal predators to kill the weak, the sick and the aged in a herd because they are easier for the predators to run down. They do not weaken the herd by shooting the finest specimens. Hunters do. This ultimately hurts the herd and the flock.
 

Diane O. (149)
Monday December 24, 2012, 4:28 am
Angelica, we also have people who enjoy skeet shooting and use firing rifles as a sport. My grandsons are enrolled in a Gun Club which does not encourage hunting on any level. When our brave young men and women join the military they are taught to shoot guns to save their lives if necessary.

As I said, I'm not a hunter. I have a fierce love of animals but I also understand that with our ever growing population infilrating into the natural habitats of deer, bears and other wild animals they are forced to come into the open for food and other reasons.

Thank you, Anelica for your post. I enjoyed reading your thoughts on this topic. This is why we are all here to share our thoughts, beliefs and experiences.

Merry Christmas to you!
 

rene davis (74)
Wednesday December 26, 2012, 11:43 pm
thanks.
 

Ruth R. (219)
Thursday January 10, 2013, 4:16 pm
What I Was Trying To Explain.
HOW TO UP-- ROOT THE MISUSE AND USE OF WEAPONS IN THE FIRST PLACE. AND THE BALANCE OF POWER IN SOCIETY.
5:02 the latest correction and maybe the last to my thought at this time on gun control may be a distraction. There are other issues: how to uproot the causes of the misuse and the use of weapons in the first place???
Do we remember the fight for freedom and the steps to downfall that took place before the natzi's tried to take over in world war two?
correction. Are we pawns in a behind the scenes system that would like people to think that they do not have to defend them selves and their loved ones -- from people who could and would if they could get these weapons -- and defend themselves and others from -- A partly good and partly excellent government system-- if the government turns against the civilians?
Do we remember the fight for freedom and the steps to downfall that took place before the natzi's tried to take over in world war two?
If I was about to get shot any where -- by some person who either planned it, or did not -- I sure would be grateful if some other person {without getting injured and without getting killed} stopped that gun from from going off. Guns are not the only kind of weapons that I would need to be defended from.
THIS DEBATE NEEDS TO BE ENDED. IT IS DISTRACTION FROM THE ROOT CAUSE OF WHY THE MISUSE OF WEAPONS.
The real useful conversation is about how to keep people happy, whole, healthy and sane -- so that people will not misuse weapons of all kinds. Then the actions need to taken -- that help people stay healthy, whole, sane and happy, and at peace. THE GUN ISSUES IS A NON-ISSUE. PEOPLE WILL ALWAYS AND HAVE ALWAYS MADE WEAPONS OF ALL KINDS.
This conversation needs to change it's course -- because it is a distraction from the real subject: The cause of the misuse of guns and weapons.
If you would like to have a peaceful conversation: Many countries have no gun rights --and less deaths and injuries to guns 1A. they have many other kinds of weapons and ways to fight. , 1. They are at the mercy of other who get a hold of "better" weapons -- if trained and self-controled civilians do not have those better weapons. 2. They are at the mercy of those who are taking over the good in the government system. 3. They are at the mercy of the corrupt people in the government system or behind the government system --for example -- raw milk and organic produce being taken by government officials and dumped and trashed.

When the governments and/or the eu and/or the un have FEAR-- HAS AWE AND RESPECT FOR THE PEOPLE, THEN THE PEOPLE HAVE FREEDOM.
WHEN THE PEOPLE FEAR THE GOVERNMENT -- THEN THERE IS TYRANNY.

Where are the petitions from the people who would like -- freedom of choice of the kind of weapons they have -- and keep the government regulations out of this matter and/or to a minimum???
Are we being used like pawns in a system making us to think that we do not need weapons --- when that government -- by nature -- may or may not be taking all the power from the people that it possibly can ???
If you go and ban those weapons -- there will be another kind of weapon -- by those who you took it away from.
If you keep petitioning and writing about gun control, you miss the true matter -- that of addressing:
1. What is the true purpose of weapons -- needs a list and to be peaceful conversations.
2. How to help people use weapons for the only the correct reasons.
3. how to stop the misuse of weapons.
4. The self-control and respect and honor of self defense -- peaceful or not --
without or with weapons.
5. Since when did government intervention mean that the government will not be used against the civilians -- to take away a means of their own self -defense -- gun or other weapon?
 
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