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Ugandan Attacked By Muslims Feels "At Home" in Israel


World  (tags: humanrights, Muslim intolerance, violence )

Stan
- 2078 days ago - unitedwithisrael.org
A preacher from Uganda who recently began promoting support for Israel, is currently being treated in an Israeli hospital after an acid attack.



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Comments

Stan B (123)
Tuesday January 10, 2012, 4:27 pm
Umar Mulinde, 38, arrived in Israel on Jan. 5 for emergency medical treatment at Tel Aviv’s Sheba Medical Center following an acid attack that severely burned his face and torso and damaged his right eye.

The attackers shouted “Allah Akbar” (God is great) after pouring acid on Mulinde in Kampala, Uganda. Mulinde converted to Christianity after spending much of his life as a Muslim.

 

Fred H (31)
Tuesday January 10, 2012, 4:42 pm
So now, we can add Uganda to the long list of countries where Christians are being attacked by Muslims. Thanks for posting this.
 

pam w (139)
Tuesday January 10, 2012, 4:57 pm
Ah...I see. He DARED to leave the stone-age fold.
 

patrica and edw jones (190)
Tuesday January 10, 2012, 5:29 pm
I sae the horrific injuries to this good man. Christians everywhere, together with Jews are being victimised. But we will prevail. Thanks Stan.
 

Ira Herson (13)
Tuesday January 10, 2012, 6:31 pm
Thanks Stan. I join you and others wishing this brave man good health and hopes that he has a complete recovery.

The Irony is not wasted that people could shout "god is great" while attacking a man that that only wanted peace.

It shows the difference between the basic philosophies of the Jewish and Christian versus the Islamic. I am sure that most Muslims would not support the actions of these people but they do not stand up and loudly denounce them either.
 

Barbara K (60)
Tuesday January 10, 2012, 7:42 pm
How horrible, I hope that he heals fast and does well. I wonder how long we will stand by and allow these terrorist activities to go on?
 

Jay S (116)
Tuesday January 10, 2012, 10:48 pm
Where is the outrage from our leaders over the Islamist hate, violence and persecution of non-muslims? If this was being done to Muslims by Jews or Christians you know they would be screaming and condemning it all.

We have no idea how common and every day these savage hate crimes are. How many never get reported?

It seems acid is now a new way for Islamists to spread their terror. Beheadings weren't enough. So much for the 'religion of peace and tolerance'. Allah would be pleased.

Stan, Allahu Akbar really is 'Allah is greatest' so as not to confuse it with the god of Judaism/Christianity. This was a shout to show that Allah, the moon god of ancient Arabia and the chief among many gods and goddesses, was not just great, but he was the 'greatest' among the gods. Allah means 'the god', the main god. It/he is not the god of Abraham.

For the most comprehensive site on everything you want to know of Islam, past and present, go to: www.wikiislam.net

Thanks. And bless Israel for taking in so many refugees from Islam where many western countries take the Islamists, in accord with their agreements with the evil Saudi Arabia, but turn their victims away.
 

Alexa R (319)
Tuesday January 10, 2012, 11:18 pm
Rob and Jay, great site the wilkiislam.net.

Wish it had stats that show us exactly how many of all violent crimes are committed in the name of Islam/under shouts of Allahu Akbar!



 

Tommy S (11)
Wednesday January 11, 2012, 1:37 am
@ R&J
Quote....This was a shout to show that Allah, the moon god of ancient Arabia and the chief among many gods and goddesses, was not just great, but he was the 'greatest' among the gods. ...Unquote

and the definition of a lunatic is--- "A reckless or psychopathic individual. Derived from 'Lunar' which in turn is derived from the Latin word for 'Moon'."
MMMmmm
 

Stan B (123)
Wednesday January 11, 2012, 1:43 am
It speaks volumes thst the weapon of choice of these maniacs is ACID!!
Great comments from everyone. Thank you.
 

Past Member (0)
Wednesday January 11, 2012, 1:50 am
Seems like every faith feels "more at home" in Israel!
 

Jennifer Ward (40)
Wednesday January 11, 2012, 4:25 am
And we need to avoid offending these vile people? The world has gone completely insane!
 

Teresa W (782)
Wednesday January 11, 2012, 7:16 am
thank you
 

Gillian M (218)
Wednesday January 11, 2012, 9:17 am
It is a crime that so few people care. If this had been the other way around then we would have had all of the pro-Muslims screaming in protest and blaming Israel.

It is wonderful that Israel will take in someone who has been assaulted with acid and treat them with medicine and care.
 

Elizabeth Goldstone (46)
Wednesday January 11, 2012, 10:16 am
thank you for share this news dear Stan.............realy you can see israel help and not only for this person,childrens and sicky people comefron gaza and we help save and cure
i am sorry the people not come and read this note and before atack aganst us think well
 

Beatrice B (24)
Wednesday January 11, 2012, 12:03 pm
Acid is a coward's weapon. The victim cannot fight back.
 

. (0)
Wednesday January 11, 2012, 12:08 pm
thanks for the post Stan and thanks for the fwd Alex. Christians seem to be the prime choice of victimization these days. My God..acid,..how low can one go.
 

Carol D (346)
Wednesday January 11, 2012, 12:22 pm
They just keep proving more and more every day what a worthless bunch of cowards they are that are unwilling to let anyone else with a different faith practice their Religion!! The worst part about it is in this country they know our laws and use them against us and so many people are blind to this fact!! The day will come when the world will turn on Islam and it can't be fast enough for me! This proves again that Israel is not the hated people that the Muslims try and portray them to be!!
 

Lynn Geth (185)
Wednesday January 11, 2012, 4:12 pm
Throwing acid in someone's face is the lowest form of cowardice. The person being attacked cannot fight back, doesn't see it coming and is totally defenseless. To throw acid in someone's face because he/she has turned from Islam to Christianity shows what a low life nation Islam is in general, and the attacker in particular.
Israel is a state comprised of kind and caring people who take anyone who needs help, and helps them. They don't ask questions, they just offer help. I rest my case.
Thank you Stan, for bringing this to our attention and thank you Alexandra, for forwarding it to me.
 

Anna Borsey (66)
Wednesday January 11, 2012, 5:00 pm
" The attackers shouted “Allah Akbar” (God is great) after pouring acid on Mulinde in Kampala, Uganda. Mulinde converted to Christianity after spending much of his life as a Muslim.

After determining that he needed more advanced treatment for his injuries than the hospital in Uganda could provide, Mulinde contacted JerusalemOnlineU.com Executive Director Andrea Gottlieb of Philadelphia for financial and logistical help.

Mulinde had learned about Israel through JerusalemOnlineU.com, an online portal for Jewish distance learning. He then taught the courses in his church and to neighboring ministers, and organized a 5,000-person teach-in about Israel at a local stadium. "

Yes. Well, I think the above quoted passages from the article about this vile hate crime speak for themselves. Where now are all the pro-Muslim fanatics here on Care2? I should like to read what certain, un- named, individuals, all active Care2 members, have to say about this. I expect they would just dismiss this horrific attack as justifiable Muslim anger.

Actually, Islam teaches that an apostate may be killed by public beheading for abandoning Islam. Although this is not in the Holy Qu'uran, this is what I found:

"The Qur'an itself does not prescribe any earthly punishment for apostasy; Islamic scholarship differs on its punishment, ranging from execution – on an interpretation of certain hadiths – to no punishment at all as long as they "do not work against the Muslim society or nation." According to Islamic law apostasy is identified by a list of actions such as conversion to another religion, denying the existence of God, rejecting the prophets, mocking God or the prophets, idol worship, rejecting the sharia, or permitting behavior that is forbidden by the sharia, such as adultery."

Presumably these murderous thugs in Uganda would justify their actions by saying that this poor priest had
"worked against the Muslim society or nation" by giving talks about Israel and Judaism and was also guilty as he had converted to another religion.
 

Hilary S (65)
Wednesday January 11, 2012, 5:39 pm
and we are still to believe that islam is the religion of peace? religions do not exist in books, but in the actions of their practitioners.
 

(0)
Wednesday January 11, 2012, 5:45 pm
See now, I could say exactly what you posted on Barbara's post. I am not saying that this article isn't true and if it is, I hope for Pastor Umar Mulinde's speedy recovery. May they find these criminals quickly and try them to the extent of the law. My point is though, supporting evidence is pretty scant. The only mentions of this are religious blogs about Christian persecution, the JTA, United with Israel, a German pro Israel blog called Israel Today and the very, very pro-occupation JSS. Nothing from JPost, Ynet, not a word from Israel's pet news organizations. JPost and YNet certainly posts any good deeds that Israel does,thus why is this not showing in any of the usual place, just sites which feature Christian persecution and pro-occupation, apologist sites?

I thoroughly searched Israel's best promotion sites, YNet and JPost to no avail. I am not stating that this didn't happen. What I am saying is that the standards you apply to your posts are significantly lower than the standards you apply to those who oppose you. Isn't that a little hypocritical.






 

(0)
Wednesday January 11, 2012, 6:51 pm
I also want to mention that Christianity is practiced by an overwhelming 85% of the Ugandan population with 12% Muslim and the remaining 3% other or none. This is far from persecution. If this in fact did occur, which I have no reason to disbelieve, aside from the credibility of the poster and the lack of supporting material, it would definitely be a hate crime, but not persecution. Most websites that this was found in were ones which centred specifically on Christian persecution.
 

Stan B (123)
Wednesday January 11, 2012, 11:58 pm
I checked out this story on 10 different sites before I posted it and I have no intention of wasting any time trying to convince you, Margaret, because, like many others would agree, you lost any shred of credibilty a long time ago.
I wonder if Pastor Mulinde was debating whether this was a hate crime or persecution when they poured the acid over his face.
Thanks to all who got this sad story to the front page.
 

patrica and edw jones (190)
Thursday January 12, 2012, 12:10 am
Perhaps there is a tinge of green in MM's comments Stan, because this post got so quickly to the front page. Not everyone is so fortunate you know.
And to add something further, MM has constantly criticized the fact that I do not post anything. The reason for that being that you, Stan, Rob and Jay, Anna, Alexandra, Beatrice, Gillian, Tommy et al- do it so much better and with greater INSIGHT than I could. However, I do so enjoy commenting and being contradictory when it is called for.
 

patrica and edw jones (190)
Thursday January 12, 2012, 12:21 am
Stan - I note that the Ugandan Pastor was treated at Tel Aviv Sheva medical centre for emergency treatment. Mulinde himself contacted JerusalemOnLine to get himself the attention he needed for his horrific injuries. Help was immediately forthcoming...............Oh those Israelis!!!!!!!!!!
 

Stan B (123)
Thursday January 12, 2012, 12:34 am
Pat and Ed. Yes, this story speaks volumes about the compassion that abounds in Israel despite facing implacable enemies on a daily basis.
It's too soon to send you another green star but thanks again for the invaluable contribution you make on Care 2. It certainly helps to show Israel in its true light.
 

Jacqueline Lockyer-Barrett (80)
Thursday January 12, 2012, 1:12 am
How awful.
 

Past Member (0)
Thursday January 12, 2012, 3:38 am
Who knows if this is true or not? It appears on no reputable news source, not even those which attempt to show the Zionist Entity in the most favourable light. If it is true, I hope and wish for his speedy recovery in body and mind. I will just note that although this man's eye was allegedly burned, there is no bandage over it in the photo.

Of course, this thread has been hijacked by the usual Muslim haters who extrapolate from one alleged event that all Muslims are evil. I say that these people posting such slurs on this thread are should take a look at themselves and ask where their hatred comes from.
 

Carmen S (617)
Thursday January 12, 2012, 3:54 am
noted, thanks Stan
 

(0)
Thursday January 12, 2012, 5:55 am
Stan:

I said that I don't know whether or not this story is true, only that your story wasn't anymore credible than the story Barbara posted. Google search revealed that the sources for your article are from Christian persecution sites and pro-occupation sites. There is not one news outlet featuring this story. Essentially the same holds true for Barbara's story, except with her story, the original story is penned by someone who does report news. Further, both stories essentially regurgitate the original story and posted on blogs whether they be Chrisitian in your case and Palestinian in hers. Since you were the one that complained at length, I would think that items you post would face a more rigorous screening process. If I was the one that posted this article and received flack over it, I would deserve it, because I do question sources. You complained about Barbara's article, but you didn't hold your article to a higher standard. That is hypocritical. In addition, not one Israeli nor Ugandan newspaper mentioned your story. Your story is only a month old, but Barbara's story is much older, thus it would be more difficult to find corraborating information for her story.

Of course, I wouldn't expect you to actually respond to my post with actual proof of how credible your article is, as it would require an effort to actually do so.

Patricia, a grown woman concerned about front page and green stars. I agree that others have more insight than you Patricia, so would a three toed sloth. Your are not really contradictory, as you never contradict the item posted with anything other than parroting what others post. You don't provide any information, nor do you provide anything to support these arguments.

John did you notice the homage paid to Wikislam by Alexandra. If anyone referred to a site called wikiJew, they would be automatically castigated and given 40 lashes with a wet noodle.
 

Gillian M (218)
Thursday January 12, 2012, 6:12 am
It's funny how MM always uses anti-Semitic sources to quote and then refuses to use anyone elses source as reputable. Perhaps the reason that only unreliable lying Christians put these items up is to deliberately make all Muslims look like xenophobic aggressive bastards.

It's also funny that when one of use posts a story about the atrocities and abuses that some Muslims do from a credible source that MM et all either refuses to come onto the item and criticize them or abuses Israel in an effort to turn the attention away from this abysmal behaviour or even, on an item when we are mourning the horrific massacre of a family with young children and a baby and STARTS PRAISING THE ITINERANT ABRABS who performed this atrocity. Note that she even refuses to accept that the acid throwing is genuine. The pictures must be fakes and his suffering unreal. And this is because, in the population, there are only 12% Muslims. There are small numbers of Muslims in Europe yet they still attack other people including Jews. Oh dear, the police and news media are lying, Muslims wouldn't do that!

There is something seriously wrong with a person who behaves this way and any decent normal person must assume that anything she says is a delibarate anti-Semitic slur and to be ignored. One should also feel sorry for someone with such poison in her life that she has to behave this way but somehow I prefer to spend my time feeling sympathy with the victims of these atrocities rather than someone who should know better and refuses to.

 

Past Member (0)
Thursday January 12, 2012, 6:40 am
"John did you notice the homage paid to Wikislam by Alexandra."

I did and, shame on me, I forgot to mention that it is, of course, a hate site.
 

Miriam E (18)
Thursday January 12, 2012, 7:35 am
From the hospital's site:
http://eng.sheba.co.il/Sheba_News/310.htm
 

(0)
Thursday January 12, 2012, 7:42 am
Where have I used antisemitic sources Gillian? Israeli historians, Israeli leaders are now antisemitic? Is this what you are trying to say Gillian. Credible academics, they are antisemitic?

Anyone can actually see where I post from as I am, unlike you, not a plagiarizer. I, also, unlike you, make sure that I know what I am talking about and don't just post items without verifying their veracity. If I post an article, I am going to prepared to defend it with facts, not ad hominem attacks.http://www.care2.com/news/member/456093751/3067227

Gillian, as said many, many times, I just DON'T comment on your stories. They aren't credible source. When the story you post is challenged, you resort to a new level of childish behaviour, calling everyone names. Perfect example,
 

(0)
Thursday January 12, 2012, 7:50 am
Thank you Miriam for thinking to look on the hospital site.
 

Past Member (0)
Thursday January 12, 2012, 8:50 am
This man was demoted by the article. He is a bishop, is a member of Gospel Life Church International which holds events actively seeking "conversions".

http://answersforthefaith.com/2011/12/30/uganda-islamic-radicals-attack-bishop-with-acid-on-christmas-eve/

"Bishop Umar Mulinde, 37, was attacked outside his Gospel Life Church International building following a revival which brought hundreds of new converts to Christ."

We now have some context. The way this thread was presented was "Mad evil Muslims attack pastor" and just because he converted. It seems some Muslims were peeved with his activities rather than his conversion.
 

Alexa R (319)
Thursday January 12, 2012, 9:14 am
John D. If you actually read this artilce, you would see that it clearly states the reason for the acid attack (as does the above intro too):

The reason is very clear from this article why these "Muslims were peeved" with this pastor's activities (I quote from the acticle):

"Mulinde had learned about Israel through JerusalemOnlineU.com, an online portal for Jewish distance learning. He then taught the courses in his church and to neighboring ministers, and organized a 5,000-person teach-in about Israel at a local stadium.

Mulinde contacted JerusalemOnlineU.com Executive Director Andrea Gottlieb of Philadelphia for financial and logistical help ..."

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I quote from the above intro: "A preacher from Uganda who recently began promoting support for Israel, is currently being treated in an Israeli hospital after an acid attack."

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
John D wrote: "We now have some context. The way this thread was presented was "Mad evil Muslims attack pastor" and just because he converted. It seems some Muslims were peeved with his activities rather than his conversion. "

Who said it was because of the pastor's conversion that he was attacked, John D? Are you speaking from being very knowledgeable about Islam rather than from what the article said?
 

Past Member (0)
Thursday January 12, 2012, 10:33 am
But Alexandra, I have read other articles, which you clearly haven't, as well as something about this man and the activities of this man and his church.
 

Barbara DeFratis (21)
Thursday January 12, 2012, 11:10 am
John Duqesa, Yes, of course he and his church actively supported Israel. After all, Christians and Jews more often than not disagree on whether or not Jesus is the Messiah, but we worship the same God--The Christian's God the Father is the Jewish God of Abraham, Isaac and Jakob.BUT MORE IMPORTANTLY, everyone in each and every country should be free to practice any religion or to ignore them all, which ever they chose to do.
 

Gillian M (218)
Thursday January 12, 2012, 12:45 pm
Barbara, well said. Christians and Jews worship the same G-d and, in general, respect the right of each other to do so.

Muslims worship Allah, who is a moon god, and NOT the same G-d as the Jews & Christians. I won't mention their prophet because there is no relationship between a syphilitic, hedonistic, untrustable or trustworthy paedophile who only wants to destroy everyone who disagrees and Jesus who only wanted peace and mutual respect.
 

(0)
Thursday January 12, 2012, 12:59 pm
Gillian - we already went to the paedophilia thing. Other religions and cultures and countries, including the UK, US and most of Europe also married children of comparable age as what you are claiming. Again you demonstrate your complete intolerance borne out of ignorance and fear. In your book it is okay to support religious freedom, as long as it doesn't apply to Muslim population. To trash anyone's religious beliefs is just more evidence of your nutbar ideology. You want and crave division, rather than unity. I truly believe that discord and the subsequent chaos that follows is your particular drug.

You are the person who shows disrespect to anyone who dares challenge your sad and pathetic preconceived notions. What would you know about Jesus? I certainly know that you don't follow his teachings.
 

(0)
Thursday January 12, 2012, 1:01 pm
Also Gillian, you publicly agree with Barbara D., but then go ahead and disregard the main part of her post, "BUT MORE IMPORTANTLY, everyone in each and every country should be free to practice any religion or to ignore them all, which ever they chose to do."
 

Past Member (0)
Thursday January 12, 2012, 1:24 pm
Gillian, do Arab Christians who also worship Allah by name worship a moon god? Do Malaysian Christians? Or Indonesian Christians?
 

Alexander Werner (53)
Thursday January 12, 2012, 1:28 pm
Gillian, Mohammed wasn't really a pedophile, rather he was "any age goes" - from six to fifty something.

Getting rid of minorities was in his books though.


 

Stan B (123)
Thursday January 12, 2012, 1:29 pm
Miriam E. Many thanks for the link to the Sheba Medical Centre. The injuries this poor man received are shown in the before and after photos and I would advise anyone doubting the veracity of this story to take a look.
The positive side is that Pastor Mulinde is now receiving the best treatment available from a world class facility.
 

M B (62)
Thursday January 12, 2012, 4:24 pm
Some of the comments are completely out of order. It seems that some ppl find the words "Allah......" (spoken by the attacker), worse than the acid itself! I hope that the victim recovers quickly; no matter his believes - no matter my believes. It's so low to use an entire religion based on an acid attack. There are enough weirdos in this world.
 

Henriette M (154)
Thursday January 12, 2012, 7:19 pm
Instead of pointing out each others faults on this thread why not all light a candle & pray for this man. This would be much more productive & healing!
Candle site
 

Matthew Cloner (116)
Thursday January 12, 2012, 8:17 pm
Thanks for posting and sharing, Stan. Sadly, attacks like this are not rare by any means. Over 140,000 Christians are martyred every year all around the world. Some are attacked and left severely injured, like this man. I have actually seen a video of Christians being burned alive in Africa by their Muslim neighbors. I read about this very story on another website and have no problem believing it to be true.
 

Ellen m (215)
Thursday January 12, 2012, 8:52 pm
Since I don't have the time to stay on this thread all night and watch this tit for tat, let me just say that I wish him a speedy recovery, and thank god he wasn't gay to boot, or he may not be here to tell his story.
 

Jay S (116)
Friday January 13, 2012, 12:07 am
So John D. our resident muslim apologist and denier of all evil in islam, despite all the evidence to the contrary, now says it is OK this man was attacked by his loving muslim neighbors because he may have been preaching his new religion. Only muslims are allowed to do that, of course.

What a disgusting person you are John. Vile, using your own usual description of others. Would you then say that it would be OK for people to throw acid in the face of any muslim who pushes their religious ideology on to others? Didn't think so.

We have so many of your muslim nuts all over Europe demanding we change our laws, culture, customs, even our national flags, to fit with their narrow, intolerant beliefs. They demand respect for their barbarism but give none in return. Perhaps we should all just carry a little bottle of acid with so we can throw it in their faces every time one of them 'offends' us.

No site that shows the evil of islam is acceptable to the likes of you. www.wikiislam.net gives sources for all of its material and has a good section on 'testimonies' of those people who have managed to escape from islam and keep their heads, so far. Do you condemn killing apostates? You never say. You defend killing apostates, gays, the stoning of rape victims, sex with little children. Tell everyone here how your god of hate doesn't even want us to be able to think for ourselves or have freedom of conscience.

John d has never shown the least bit of campassion for any of the many victims of islam. He always attacks their motives and the truthfulness of the story. Always. You are living proof of all that is evil and dangerous about islam. Keep talking and giving your hate-filled comments. No one could ever show islam for what is any better than a looney muslim can.

PS: why should any of us look at your 'hate sites'. Anything written on an islamic site will be pure BS - Taqqiyya, something you're particulary skilled at - lying to promote islam and cover up its ugly dark teachings of hate and violence. Have you no conscience or shame at all? Your parents who you say fought against Fascism would be horrified that you would have joined its evil cousin, islam. (There's a reason Hitler loved Islam and that 100,000 Balkan muslims volunteered to fight for the Nazis - they share the same 'ideals' of hate and hunger for power).
 

patrica and edw jones (190)
Friday January 13, 2012, 12:38 am
Actually I like the three toed sloth MM - kind furry creatures. Also I have commented many times- contradicting you in the past MM - but you probably don't remember - being so busy with your own comments and what YOU want to say as usual. Still it is absolutely nothing to me whether you like my comments or not......if I can be a thorn in your side ad infinitum - that will do.
 

Past Member (0)
Friday January 13, 2012, 1:01 am
Rob and Jay.

Definition of misrepresentation: An assertion or manifestation by words or conduct that is not in accord with the facts.

That is you two to a T. Others might say that your offence is that of lying.

In fact, I think I'll call you liars."John D. ... says it is OK this man was attacked by his loving muslim neighbors". In fact, I wished the man a speedy recovery "in body and mind" upthread.

If you wish to refute the charge of being liars, then C&P where I said it was ok that he was attacked. Ooops, you can't, because I never said it. So you're liars.

And another lie. "Keep talking and giving your hate-filled comments. No one could ever show islam for what is any better than a looney muslim can. ". I am an atheist and have never been a Muslim.

Now produce or keep quiet. Or remain liars.
 

Alexa R (319)
Friday January 13, 2012, 1:56 am
John D. Where has R&B supposedly claimed that you are a muslim and not an atheist?
 

Past Member (0)
Friday January 13, 2012, 3:27 am
Do try to keep up Alexandra.

"Tell everyone here how your god of hate..."

"No one could ever show islam for what is any better than a looney muslim can".

"Your parents ... would be horrified that you would have joined its evil cousin, islam".
 

Alexa R (319)
Friday January 13, 2012, 3:46 am
John D. R&J B had called you a muslim apologist. As a muslim apologist, you've certainly joined with "your cousin, islam" as R&J had put it. That does not negate that you are an atheist anymore than this christian pastor suddenly to be jewish for having joined forces with Israel!

Just like this christian pastor is a 'cousin' of israel, you are an atheist 'cousin' of islam. Not all christians are 'cousins' of israel, neither are all atheists 'cousins' of islam. Therefore R&J B. had pointed out that [even though you're an atheist] you've joined forces with islam, became an muslim apologist.

This article had pointed out that even though this pastor was a christian, he had joined forces with israel -the result, an acid attack.

No amount of "peev-ness" justifies an acid attack,don't you agree?
 

(0)
Friday January 13, 2012, 4:07 am
Bob - The phenomena of child marriage was something that was not just practised in the Muslim faith, but was found in many other cultures.


The minimum age of marriage for girls was 12. [Treggiari, Susan. Roman Marriage: Iusti Coniuges from the Time of Cicero to the Time of Ulpian. p. 39.]

There is a lot of criticism on marriage age in Islam. Some allege that Muslim marriage law allows marriage of minors. However, Quran indicates at least on one place that there is definite age which can be termed as age of marriage:
“Make trial of orphans until they reach the age of marriage; if then ye find sound judgment in them, release their property to them; but consume it not wastefully, nor in haste against their growing up.”

(Quran 4: 6 Abdullah Yusufali)

In the 12th century Gratian, the influential founder of Canon law in medieval Europe, accepted age of puberty for marriage to be between 12 and 14 but acknowledged consent to be meaningful if the children were older than 7. Some authorities said consent could take place earlier. Such a marriage would be permanent as long as neither party sought annulment before reaching puberty (12 for girls and 14 for boys) or if they had already consummated the marriage. Even if the husband had technically raped his wife before she reached puberty, the marriage was regarded as consummated. It was this policy which was carried over into English common law, and although consent was necessary, force and influence or persuasion seemed to have been permissible elements. Similarly Gratian's ideas about age became part of European civil law.

Judges honored marriages based on mutual consent at age younger than seven, in spite of what Gratian had said, and there are recorded marriages of two and three year olds. The seventeenth-century lawyer Henry Swinburne distinguished between the marriages of those under seven and those between seven and puberty. He wrote that those under seven who had said their vows had to ratify it afterwards by giving kisses and embraces, by lying together, by exchanging gifts or tokens, or by calling each other husband or wife. A contemporary, Philip Stubbes, wrote that in sixteenth-century East Anglia, infants still in swaddling clothes were married. The most influential legal text of the seventeenth century in England, that of Sir Edward Coke, made it clear that the marriage of girls under twelve was normal, and the age at which a girl who was a wife was eligible for a dower from her husband's estate was nine even though her husband be only four years old. [Marriageable age, Wikipedia]

The American colonies followed the English tradition, and the law was more of a guide. For example, Mary Hathaway (Virginia, 1689) was only 9 when she was married to William Williams. Sir Edward Coke (England, 17th century) made it clear that "the marriage of girls under 12 was normal, and the age at which a girl who was a wife was eligible for a dower from her husband's estate was 9 even though her husband be only four years old. [Encyclopedia of Children and Childhood in History and Society,

In the Islamic tradition following Muhammad, betrothal could take place earlier than PUBERTY, perhaps as early as seven, but the marriage was not supposed to be consummated until the girl menstruated and was of age. [Encyclopedia of Children and Childhood in History and Society]
 

(0)
Friday January 13, 2012, 4:20 am


Rob/Jay:

Where did John support the throwing of acid in anyone's face? This is the whole problem, you take this deplorable act, apply your condemnation to each and every of the 1.2 billion people who are of the Muslm faith and call it good. Then you make insane statements about his lack of compassion, etc. because he is pointing out the folly of your posts.

I think that you seem to only support tolerance for things that directly affect you, and to hell with anyone else. Of course John criticizes the source of many of the stories posted, because many of them are bs.

Patricia - Show me where you have actually contradicted something I have posted and you have actually provided proof for your contradiction?
 

Past Member (0)
Friday January 13, 2012, 4:55 am
Alexandra. You are stretching the meaning of what they wrote to try to defend your friends.
 

Past Member (0)
Friday January 13, 2012, 5:18 am
Alexandra. You seem to have problems with reading all of a sudden. You say "you are an atheist 'cousin' of islam". That is not what R&J said. They said "Your parents ... would be horrified that you would have joined its evil cousin, islam".

They also said "Tell everyone here how your god of hate..." and "No one could ever show islam for what is any better than a looney muslim can". This is clearly stating that they think I'm a Muslim.
 

Alexa R (319)
Friday January 13, 2012, 5:58 am
John D. We'll simply have to agree to disagree about what R&J meant.

Where R&J said "looney muslim", he referred to the one throwing the acid -- and that you must keep on defending this looney muslim as that will eventually clearly show your support for hate crimes.

As for the "god of hate", even though hitler at times claimed to be an atheist, his vile deeds showed him to 'love', the "god of hate". The same "god of hate" that this looney muslim who threw the acid 'loved'.

Therefore, if you continue to support this looney muslim who threw the acid, you in effect also 'love' the "god of hate".

As regards the cousin: if hitler through his support of islam was a cousin to islam, so are you when you support islam.
 

Past Member (0)
Friday January 13, 2012, 6:40 am
Why do you lie Alexandra.? The meaning of the words is clear. You are paraphrasing in an attempt to mitigate them and twist their meaning, not quoting, as would be normal. And why not? If you quoted, the whole board would see the plain meaning.

And you are also lying when you say that I support this action or hate crimes in general. You'll remain a liar until you C&P where I said I did so.
 

Alexander Werner (53)
Friday January 13, 2012, 8:50 am
Margaret, 12 is somewhat older than 6, don't you think? Juliet was 14 at the time, and considering the life expectancy at the time that was the reality. And my point is not in stating that marrying 6-years old was way off from the usual customs and tells something about the groom, though it does.

These were ancient practices, abolished by Judeo-Christian cultures long time ago.

My point is that marrying children or throwing acid at a face of non-believer is nowadays quite a disgusting act and this act is made much more disgusting by the Islamic street "not being enraged". The mentality of "Our bad guy is still better than their good guy" is too strong among too many Muslims.

 

Past Member (0)
Friday January 13, 2012, 9:26 am
Actually Bob A, Margaret's post mentioned ages far younger than 12:--

"Mary Hathaway (Virginia, 1689) was only 9 when she was married to William Williams. Sir Edward Coke (England, 17th century) made it clear that "the marriage of girls under 12 was normal, and the age at which a girl who was a wife was eligible for a dower from her husband's estate was 9"
 

Gillian M (218)
Friday January 13, 2012, 10:18 am
A muslim man allowing sex with a baby according to Allah

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2Xz_BrfOhM
 

Gillian M (218)
Friday January 13, 2012, 10:21 am
From the blog of a white woman who married a Muslim

CHILD BRIDES are TRUE ISLAM. "There is no age limit to be intimate with one's wife even if she is a minor."

I would also add that it is legal to marry a girl for a certain period of time from 1 day to however long that you want to. There is no limit to the number of "men" that this poor girl can be married to for 1 day. This is legalising prostitution.
 

Past Member (0)
Friday January 13, 2012, 11:52 am
"A muslim man"

"From the blog of a white woman"

So, really impeccable sources. A "white woman's" blog and a Youtube video.

And, by the way Gillian, "white women" can be Muslims, didn't you know? There are plenty of them in Bosnia, Bulgaria, Russia, Jordan, Syria, indeed, all over the world. So did you actually mean a "non-Muslim" woman?

This casual, overt racism says so much about you and your obsessions.
 

Alexa R (319)
Friday January 13, 2012, 12:21 pm
John D : "The meaning of the words [of Gillian] is clear. You are paraphrasing in an attempt to mitigate them and twist their meaning, not quoting, as would be normal. And why not? If you quoted, the whole board would see the plain meaning. "

Gillian is not a racist, neither is her statement. Did you watch the Youtube video she referenced?
 

Past Member (0)
Friday January 13, 2012, 1:29 pm
Alexandra. Why do you lie? Do you think no one will notice? This is what Gillian posted:--

"A muslim man allowing sex with a baby according to Allah"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2Xz_BrfOhM

And then:--


Gillian Miller (179)
Friday January 13, 2012, 10:21 am

"From the blog of a white woman"

I quoted exactly:--

"A muslim man"

"From the blog of a white woman"

Where is the paraphrase Alexandra? Where did I not quote, Alexandra?

You people are just too easy to nail down as liars and propagandists.

As for the racism, that is clear to all, simply by her choice of words.


 

(0)
Saturday January 14, 2012, 9:08 pm
Alexandra:
"What a disguting person you are John. Vile, using your own usual description of others"

"We have so many of your muslim nuts all over Europe "

"No site that shows the evil of islam is acceptable to the likes of you."

"John d has never shown the least bit of campassion for any of the many victims of islam. "

" Keep talking and giving your hate-filled comments"

"lying to promote islam and cover up its ugly dark teachings of hate and violence. Have you no conscience or shame at all? Your parents who you say fought against Fascism would be horrified that you would have joined its evil cousin, islam. (There's a reason Hitler loved Islam and that 100,000 Balkan muslims volunteered to fight for the Nazis - they share the same 'ideals' of hate and hunger for power).

At some point chickie, playing coy and essentially playing Barbie doesn't count anymore. You have the gall to even infer in repeated posts that in someway John is supporting the throwing of acid in someone's face. Nowhere in his comments has he done so or show any sympathy with the perpetrators of this crime. What he has been clear about is the labelling of a whole population by the acts of a few and the original presentation of the article. You bring up this to John with no comment whatsoever of the completely inappropriate comments by Rob/Jay. In some countries, including mine, this would be considered hate speech.

Their profile seems to indicate that America was just not intellectual enough for them and thus moved overseas. Any intellect would never make such hateful, baseless statements. Any thinking person would actually measure their words. It seems the only tolerance Rob/Jay have is tolerance that affects them. Having tolerance for anything else seems to be a foreign concept.

For you to not even say a word about this and then attempt to state that their post was not a hate filled rant, is inexcuseable. Where has John said anything which called people names, referred specifically to traits of a poster, or used personalized attacks. In fact his response to Rob/Jay is quite measured after such a vicious attack and aside from stating that they are lying (which they are in the accusations they have made against John), he has not made one personal reference to them?

You truly Alexandra, are the defition of what an apologist is. It isn't a pretty name to be called, nor nothing to be proud of.


Stan - "Margaret, because, like many others would agree, you lost any shred of credibilty a long time ago." Find one story I have posted that has been refuted. For that matter, find one post where you have actually been able to provide any proof and dispute what I have posted. Talk is nothing but talk. Show me where Stan.

Bob: "Margaret, 12 is somewhat older than 6, don't you think? Juliet was 14 at the time, and considering the life expectancy at the time that was the reality."

First of all Bob, I have no idea what thread you are on, but where is Juliet coming from???

Secondly, did you actually read what I posted?

"The American colonies followed the English tradition, and the law was more of a guide. For example, Mary Hathaway (Virginia, 1689) was only 9 when she was married to William Williams. Sir Edward Coke (England, 17th century) made it clear that "the marriage of girls under 12 was normal, and the age at which a girl who was a wife was eligible for a dower from her husband's estate was 9 even though her husband be only four years old. [Encyclopedia of Children and Childhood in History and Society]"

Do you see four in this Bob? This was from the 17th century, a millenium before a time you state that " "any age goes" - from six to fifty something."

Gillian - No one pays attention to the crap you post, because it is always crap. Again plagiarism is a criminal.

 
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