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Girl, 12, Divorces 80-Year-Old Husband


World  (tags: saudi arabia, marriage, divorce, tradition, off-beat, odd, interesting, bizarre, unusual, women, world, society, culture, safety, society, women, world, rights, religion, culture, ethics, freedoms, abuse, child, children, 'CIVILLIBERTIES!', 'HUMANRIGHTS!', ch )

Randy L
- 3313 days ago - msnbc.msn.com
The case of a 12-year-old Saudi Arabian girl who successfully won a divorce from her 80-year-old husband could prompt the Arab kingdom to introduce a minimum marriage age, the Telegraph of London reports.



   

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Comments

Linda M (0)
Friday April 23, 2010, 7:20 am
noted with disgust. 80 years old? that poor child. how can any society allow a child to marry anyone?

everyone, please sign and share:

http://www.thepetitionsite.com/5/tell-obama-to-put-solar-panels-back-on-the-white-house

thanks so much
 

Dr Kathi A (215)
Friday April 23, 2010, 8:49 am
DEPRAVITY.... Completely WRONG.... A CHILD should NOT be FORCED into a "marriage" to make it legal for these child molesters to have sex with them. It is still RAPE of an innocent CHILD. The ramifications of this act on their body & spirit & mind may never be realized. It places them in world they should NOT be in. I am a grown adult & I would NOT wish to marry an 80 yr old man, neither would I want to marry a child that is under age. This little girl should never have been "married" to this pervert. She was younger at time of marriage, if she is getting divorce at age 12. How sickening to say this is the "right" of anyone to harm a child in such a manner.
 

LoneWolf Heart (11)
Friday April 23, 2010, 9:38 am
Perverts like this should be taken out of play.
 

Randy L Benson (65)
Friday April 23, 2010, 5:24 pm
(This is a somewhat edited version of what I wrote in reply to a friend at Facebook, when I posted the story there (as well as numerous other places):)

child marriages are still normal in many parts of the world. they are usually arranged for social reasons (to marry within the class).

(and it still happens here. . .people tend to marry within their socioeconomic class. it's rare to hear of marrying someone 'from the other side of the tracks'.)

usedta be standard policy among European monarchies.

It's very common in Oriental societies for children to become engaged when they're children--or infants--and marry at 'the appropriate age'.

sometimes the kid is offered for marriage because the folks owe a debt they can't pay or it's the only way the kid might be able to have a better life.

sometimes it's a form of protection, especially for an orphan.

on the other hand, something like this smacks of Warren Jeffs and his group.

because, like anything else, it can be abused.

(she then asked who Warren Jeffs was. . .)

Warren Jeffs was the 'Prophet' (Messiah, God, etc) of a radical splinter group of 'Mormons' who teached a rather extreme version. He arbitrarily married off members to each other regardless of age. Many of them were polygamous, some believed to be incestuous. He broke up marriages and created others at will, binding them to him instead of each oher.

They are completely disavowed by the Mormon Church (Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints). Jeffs has a lot more than a little in common with Jim Jones and David Koresh.

They're very active in southern Colorado. . .and I believe Arizona. Even members of law enforcement in their areas belong to and defend the church.

No one talks to outsiders. Any outsiders.

They're as clannish as you can get, and they're kept from contact with the outside world as much as possible.

Females basically have two functions: sex & baby factories. There is virtually no outside information coming into their homes.

The only way the outside world learned much about them was from a few members escaping and revealing their stories to the media. Even their parents, siblings and children tried to stop them. Aggressively so.

Last I remember, Jeffs was convicted and imprisoned for complicity in sex crimes by marrying off children to older men. He's still revered by his followers.

Many of the children were taken by Child Welfare. I don't know what their status is now, since the seizure may have been unconstitutional.

He had built a 'compound' here in Texas for his followers, preparing to get everyone away from outside influences.

If you know anything about warfare, you can take one look at it and say 'that's not a compound; it's a g_____n fortress.'

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warren_Jeffs

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fundamentalist_Church_of_Jesus_Christ_of_Latter_Day_Saints (includes picture of the Texas 'compound')

Let's just keep in mind folks, that things like that do happen here. They're hidden, though. So we have to watch for things like that at the same time we rail against stuff at other places. The only difference is that it's institutionalized in some cultures.
 

Randy L Benson (65)
Friday April 23, 2010, 5:27 pm
to clarify. . .marrying within one's socioeconomic standard or class is normal here. . .
 

Rebecca Zimmerman (4)
Friday April 23, 2010, 7:28 pm
Just remember what you were like when you were 11, like this girl was when she got married against her will. I know that I thought I was an adult when I was 11, but I still was playing tag with my friends, gossiping after school, having snowball fights in the winter, and making up silly stories. How in the world could marriage fit into the lifestyle of any normal 11-year-old? Regardless of the age of the spouse, this is a ridiculous expectation of a child (even a child who may not have the liberties I did at 11, as I am guessing the young girl in this story may not have as care-free a life as an American 11-year-old). Just imagine the psychological trauma you would experience having to fulfill all of the wifely-expectations at an age where you may not have even started menstruating. That is reason enough to institute a minimum marriage age. But in this case, she was wed to someone 60 years older than her! Imagine if he did impregnate her- not impossible for a man of any age. Odds are against him living much longer (just based on statistics). He could have left her a widow and a single mother at the ripe old age of 13. How is this fair to her? How could it be fair to any young girl?
 

Erin R (181)
Friday April 23, 2010, 9:14 pm
How disgusting! :-(
 

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Friday April 23, 2010, 9:25 pm
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Vivien Green (153)
Saturday April 24, 2010, 5:53 am
This is sick
 

Magdalena M (0)
Saturday April 24, 2010, 6:16 am
Noted. That he is 80 and need a babysitter, wow, it happens. But her own parents sold her like an item, not a daughter, not a child. This is unforgivable. I do not care what country it is, what culture. Parents are parents.
This is where animals are higher than us, they care about offspring, no human trafficking, no selling children.
 

E A (28)
Saturday April 24, 2010, 6:49 am
Thanks for stipulating Kozure that although not common,this happens in other parts of the world other than the stereotypical Saudi Arabia. Even in our own backyard of the good ol U.S.A !
A disgusting practice,we agree,is found more in impovershed and uneducated societies and less common in a more forward thinking,modern Saudi society.
The fact that she was recognized and granted a divorce is encouraging and that ,yes, even Saudi is recognizing the need to change.

 

Randy L Benson (65)
Saturday April 24, 2010, 7:07 am
You're right, E.A., they are slowly changing. Which is better than no change at all. We can't force them to our standards and our timetable; that's sure to produce resistance and increase anti-Americanism in the Muslim world.

Traditional Islam granted rights of marriage and divorce in the Koran that were more beneficial to women than anything in the Bible. However, in the further evolution of the cultural matrix those rights were changed by those in power: sometimes overtly and sometimes aggressively.

Not all Muslim countries are the same; there are subtle differences, though all claim to be Muslim. The sharia (law) and the hadiths they follow (along with the Koran) may also differ from culture to culture.

So there's no need for anyone to generalize this into a belief that this would necessarily be the same in all Muslim cultures.

It's highly significant that Saudi Arabia, which has produced the most extreme versions of Islam, is beginning to grow out of that matrix.

This is the first step, and a big one.
 

Randy L Benson (65)
Saturday April 24, 2010, 7:15 am
(I apologize to everyone for the message on climate change inserted into the middle of our comments. Apparently a fake profile was created to insert it; I tried to track it down and can't find it.

(I appreciate the zeal, but in my opinion it's like putting an 'green living' message in the middle of comments about the assassination of a world leader.

(Care2 definitely needs to add controls for moderation of comments by the original story's poster, as well as editing tools for anyone commenting.
 

Randy L Benson (65)
Saturday April 24, 2010, 11:22 am
. . .just received & signed this petition from CARE pertaining to child marriage. . .

http://my.care.org/site/Ecard?ecard_id=1501&petition=thank_you
 

Randy L Benson (65)
Saturday April 24, 2010, 11:26 am
CORRECTION: this is the proper link:

http://my.care.org/site/Ecard?ecard_id=1501

(as I said, we need editing controls on these comments)
 

Camilla Vaga (68)
Sunday April 25, 2010, 3:18 am
That is so disqusting. A 80 year old marring a 12 year old girl. What a pervert. I am happy that this little girl go free from that pervert. These young girls needs to be protected.
 

Terry B (649)
Sunday April 25, 2010, 5:06 am
Kozure, you are correct about the so-called Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, the mormon polygamist sect. Their headquarters where Jeffs had his congregation is the town of Colorado City, Arizona (formerly called Short Creek), which is right on the state line and spills over it to from the satellite town of Hildate. Utah.

Whether the "real" mormon "church" actually denies polygamy os open to question as there are said to be some 30,000 of them living in Utah, which is as close to a church-state as you can get in the West. Perhaps they had their fingers crossed when they agreed to abolish the practice as a condition for the Utah Territory to become a state. After all, founder Joey Smith and top henchman Brigand Young had dozens of wives.

These clown were recently featured in National Geographic with an old fool and his overpopuation of progeny displayed on the cover.

As for Arabia--- ain't Mohammedeanism wonderful? The old creep himself had a nine-year old girl as a wife.
 

Randy L Benson (65)
Sunday April 25, 2010, 5:46 am
It's a mess, Terry, any way ya look at it. But they're starting to change. One could hope that we'll be able to recognize and change things in this society that could hurt outhers.

As i recollect, there was no polygamy permitted in the original form of the CJCLDS, under Joseph Smith. After the pogroms and such by Protestants in the Midwest and his lynching, Brigham Young assumed the mantle of leader.

It's been said--by Sammy Clemens (Twain) in 'Roughing It', I believe (my copy's 20 miles away)--that Brigham Young was the one who introduced polygamy to the church. Clemens basically defended the first form of the church.

There is a possibility that polygamy was permitted due to the unknown environment they were headed into. . .a surplus of 'parallel' children via several wives would keep them from being wiped out by misfortune. But from what I remember of Clemens' description of Young, he resembled Jeffs and company more than he did Joe Smith.
 

Terry B (649)
Sunday April 25, 2010, 2:03 pm
Kozure, that is a bity inaccurate. While I agree that Brigand Young was far more dictatorial (like Jeffs) that the somewhat timid Smith, little Joey was big into lotsa girls around the house, one of the things that got him bumped off in Illinois before Young took charge for the trek west into what was then still Mexico. I paste a bit of source material below:

Faithful LDS member and historian Todd Compton has found solid documentation for Smith marriages to 33 women while he was alive. True, many more were sealed to him after his death, but Smith had at least 33 wives while he was alive.

Compton Writes:
"In the group of Smith's well-documented wives, eleven (33 percent) were 14 to 20 years old when they married him. Nine wives (27 percent) were twenty-one to thirty years old. Eight wives (24 percent) were in Smith's own peer group, ages thirty-one to forty. In the group aged forty-one to fifty, there is a substantial drop off: two wives, or 6 percent, and three (9 percent) in the group aged fifty-one to sixty."

Of course Mohammed himself takes the cake with a nine-year old!
 

Randy L Benson (65)
Sunday April 25, 2010, 2:35 pm
Thanks, Terry. I admit that I don't know that much of Young's life, and I hadn't heard of Compton or his work. My library, old and crumbling as it is, is 20 miles away, and I'm forced to go by memory, which can be unreliable.

I don't recall Clemons/Twain saying anything about Young's relationships; maybe it was better hid than Smith's. It's about the only material I can think of that I'd had on hand regarding the Church, besides copies of the Book of Mormon and related 'scripture', anyway.
 

Terry B (649)
Monday April 26, 2010, 6:17 am
Kozure, you can find more than you ever want to know about the LDS sect by Goggling "Utah Lighthouse Ministry" -- Mrs. Tanner is an outspoken crtic of the sect even though she is Brigand Young's great-graddaughter, A fascinating lady.
 

Randy L Benson (65)
Monday April 26, 2010, 10:57 am
Great. . . thanks. . .
 

Randy L Benson (65)
Friday April 30, 2010, 7:23 pm
on re-reading this, i just realized that i'd made yet another mistake. . .i meant to say that i didn't know anything about SMITH'S relationships. . .Young's were more well known; to me, anyway.

sorry for any confusion.
 
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