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Aylesbury Child Sex Abuse Trial: Six Men Found Guilty


World  (tags: Child Abuse, U.K, .Muslims )

Stan
- 1430 days ago - bbc.com
Six men involved in a child sex ring in Buckinghamshire have been found guilty of abusing two schoolgirls on a "massive scale". The Old Bailey heard the abuse in Aylesbury went on for years and involved rape and child prostitution.



   

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Comments

Stan B (123)
Sunday July 26, 2015, 2:49 am
If anyone can figure out what these " creatures " have in common there's a free trip to Kabul.
 

Stan B (123)
Sunday July 26, 2015, 2:58 am
1,400 British non-Muslim children were gang-raped and brutalized by Muslims in one city alone, and “several staff described their nervousness about identifying the ethnic origins of perpetrators for fear of being thought as racist; others remembered clear direction from their managers not to do so.”

And here we see police bosses telling officers not to pursue investigations of these rape gangs. The Muslim rape gangs went unreported, unprosecuted, and in general unstopped because of far-Left organizations like Hope Not Hate, Faith Matters, and Tell Mama, which waged relentless war against anyone and everyone who spoke out about these issue. They demonized as “Islamophobic,” “hateful” and “bigoted” anyone who said that there were Muslim rape gangs at all, and that they had to be stopped. They led the campaign to ban Pamela Geller and me from entering the country, when one of the events we had discussed going to was a rally against the rape gangs. Search for “grooming” (these gangs are usually called “grooming gangs” in the British media) at Hope Not Hate’s site, and you will see that the vast majority of the articles mentioning this practice are attacking those who are calling attention to it and protesting against it.

Who is responsible for the religion-based mass gang-rape of British girls? The British Left — in particular the “anti-hate” crusaders Nick Lowles of Hope Not Hate, Fiyaz Mughal of Faith Matters and Tell Mama, and their friends, supporters, and allies.

The lives of countless thousands of girls in Britain are ruined today because of these men. If Britain were even close to being a sane society today, these people would be being subjected to scorching criticism, and there would be a thorough public reevaluation of how much the Left’s alliance with Islamic supremacism and smear campaign against foes of jihad terror has harmed the nation and its people. But Britain is not a sane society today, and these sinister individuals — Lowles, Mughal, and the rest of them — will continue to wield their considerable power and influence in British society.

Concerns about a girl repeatedly abused by a gang of men in Buckinghamshire were raised by a charity several years before the perpetrators were arrested, it has emerged.

Barnardo’s told the BBC it had worked with the ring’s two victims in 2008 and referred the case of one to the local authority and other relevant agencies.

The charity’s Michelle Lee-Izu said “insufficient action” was taken.

Six men were found guilty on Friday of abuse on a “massive scale”.

The Old Bailey heard the abuse in Aylesbury went on for years and involved rape and child prostitution.
Alcohol and DVDs

The court heard evidence from both victims, who came from troubled backgrounds and were befriended by the men who gave them alcohol, DVDs, food and occasionally drugs.

While aged just 12 or 13, one of the vulnerable girls, known in the trial as A, was passed between 60 mainly Asian men for sex after being conditioned into thinking it was normal behaviour, jurors were told.

Ms Lee-Izu, a lead director for child sexual exploitation, told BBC Radio 4’s Today programme: “In 2008, we worked with both these young people and our work with these young women was very specific to them as individuals.

“We had concerns about the safety of one young woman and we made a referral to the local authority and the relevant agencies.

“At that time the agencies didn’t respond in a way that we wanted, that we expected them to, although some actions were taken by the local authority so we escalated those actions further.

“But insufficient action was taken as far as we were concerned.”
Girls ‘let down’

Eleven defendants faced trial, accused of 47 sexual offences between 2006 and 2012 following an investigation launched in 2013.

Four were cleared of any wrongdoing, while the jury could not reach a verdict on one of the men.

The six who have been convicted will be sentenced in September.

Speaking on BBC Radio 4’s Today programme on Saturday, David Johnston, director for children’s services at Buckinghamshire County Council since 2014, said a review of the concerns raised by Barnardo’s would be carried out to discover what happened and what action was taken.

He said: “Workers at the time missed a number of opportunities to perhaps protect them [the girls] or to provide other services for them. Having said that, we know a great deal more about child sexual exploitation and grooming now than we did back then.

“Over the time I have been in the post, we have reviewed a lot of practices.”

He added: “Today, evidence of unhappiness shown by behaviour – such as school homework standards falling and running away – instead of being monitored as in the past, it is now investigated for motivation.

“More specialists are now working with local authorities and the police to build up knowledge of child exploitation to protect young people and those working with them.”

On Friday, Mr Johnston apologised on behalf of Buckinghamshire County Council for “letting [the girls} down during this period in their lives”….
 

Ben Oscarsito (128)
Sunday July 26, 2015, 3:10 am
I'm not allowed to say what I think of those very sick bastards!!!
 

Stan B (123)
Sunday July 26, 2015, 3:24 am
Feel free, Ben. Civilised people need to know what!'s lurking out there.
 

Giana Peranio Paz (398)
Sunday July 26, 2015, 3:25 am
Just terrible! Those disgusting excuses for human beings. These things are going on all over the world, where there are men willing to pay this sick phenomenon will exist. Thanks Stan.
 

Walter F (128)
Sunday July 26, 2015, 5:12 am
One small consolation Stan these unspeakable apologies for human beings will grace one of her majesty's prisons and be deported on release..Thanks to our former stupid politicians we opened our doors to allow the disease of islam to infest our country,We're living in interesting times.I give credit to our present government for stopping the boats and ending the islamic invasion
 

Beatrice B (112)
Sunday July 26, 2015, 5:32 am
Now now. Be cxareful or you will be labeled racist!
 

Past Member (0)
Sunday July 26, 2015, 6:46 am
I'm with Ben, these creeps should be severely punished.
 

Past Member (0)
Sunday July 26, 2015, 7:47 am
Muslims are not the only pedophiles who walk the Earth. They come from every background.
That being said they all deserve to be put away.
 

Darren Woolsey (218)
Sunday July 26, 2015, 8:03 am
Agree with Nancy.

Depending on which way the Qur'an is read/interpreted, Muslim fundamentalists seem to think they have an "Allah-given right" to treat children and women as chattel.

There remains a major problem in India, where children and women are subordinated to men

This issue also feeds into the worldwide problem of inequality of the sexes and exploitation of children, in terms of Slave Labor.

Connect the major dots, and you have a lot of shi$t contained within.
 

Sam H (410)
Sunday July 26, 2015, 10:21 am
Such despicable crimes, especially when committed by trusted religious leaders like THIS ONE!
 

Gillian M (11)
Sunday July 26, 2015, 10:30 am
Darren, there is only one way to interpret the Quran, it gives Muslims licence to regard kafirs or non-Muslims as second class citizens and available for rape if that is what they choose to do.

The Quran clearly shows that Mohammed was a rapist, a murderer, an untrustworthy lying bandit, a slaver, a pedophile, a necrophiliac who commited incest too.

 

Gillian M (11)
Sunday July 26, 2015, 10:32 am
It is against Islam to rape Muslim women, but Muhammad actually encouraged the rape of others captured in battle. This hadith provides the context for the Qur’anic verse (4:24):

The Apostle of Allah (may peace be upon him) sent a military expedition to Awtas on the occasion of the battle of Hunain. They met their enemy and fought with them. They defeated them and took them captives.

Some of the Companions of the Apostle of Allah (may peace be upon him) were reluctant to have intercourse with the female captives in the presence of their husbands who were unbelievers. So Allah, the Exalted, sent down the Qur’anic verse: (Sura 4:24) "And all married women (are forbidden) unto you save those (captives) whom your right hands possess." (Abu Dawud 2150, also Muslim 3433)

Actually, as the hadith indicates, it wasn't Muhammad, but "Allah the Exalted" who told the men to rape the women in front of their husbands - which is all the more reason not to think of Islam as being the same as other religions.

Note also that the husbands of these unfortunate victims were obviously alive after battle. This is important because it flatly contradicts those apologists who like to argue that the women Muhammad enslaved were widowed and thus unable to fend for themselves. (Even if the apologists were right, what sort of a moral code is it that forces a widow to choose between being raped and starving?)

There are several other episodes in which Muhammad is offered the clear opportunity to disavow raping women - yet he instead offers advice on how to proceed. In one case, his men were reluctant to devalue their new slaves for later resale by getting them pregnant. Muhammad was asked about coitus interruptus in particular:

"O Allah's Apostle! We get female captives as our share of booty, and we are interested in their prices, what is your opinion about coitus interruptus?" The Prophet said, "Do you really do that? It is better for you not to do it. No soul that which Allah has destined to exist, but will surely come into existence.” (Bukhari 34:432)

As indicated, the prophet of Islam did not mind his men raping the women, provided they ejaculated within the bodies of their victims.

As one might imagine, Muhammad's obvious approval of raping women captured in battle and his own personal participation as recorded in many places is of intense inconvenience to the Muslim apologists of our time. For this reason, some of them attempt to explain away these many episodes and Qur'anic references to sex with captives by pretending that these are cases in which women have fled bad marriages and sought refuge with the Muslims. Some apologists even refer to them as "wives," even though the Qur'an makes a clear distinction between "those whom thy right hand possesses" and true wives (see Sura 33:50).

Beyond the desperation of the 21st century apologist however, there is absolutely nothing in the historical text that supports this rosy revision of Muslim history. The women of the Banu Mustaliq were sold into slavery following their rape:

"We went out with Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) on the expedition to the Bi'l-Mustaliq and took captive some excellent Arab women; and we desired them, for we were suffering from the absence of our wives, (but at the same time) we also desired ransom for them. So we decided to have sexual intercourse with them but by observing 'azl (Withdrawing the male sexual organ before emission of semen to avoid-conception). But we said: We are doing an act whereas Allah's Messenger is amongst us; why not ask him? So we asked Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him), and he said: It does not matter" (Sahih Muslim 3371)

In fact, female slaves were traded like any other simple commodity by Muhammad and his band of devoted followers:

"Then the apostle sent Sa-d b. Zayd al-Ansari, brother of Abdu'l-Ashal with some of the captive women of Banu Qurayza to Najd and he sold them for horses and weapons." (Ibn Ishaq/Hisham/Hisham 693)

Is it Islamic to sell one's wife for horses? Clearly these were not wives!

More importantly, by definition a "captured" woman is not one who is fleeing her husband. She is fleeing her captor (ie. the Muslim slave raider). This hadith describes a typical raid, in which the women and children are captured as they are attempting to flee the attacking Muslims:

“…and then we attacked from all sides and reached their watering-place where a battle was fought. Some of the enemies were killed and some were taken prisoners. I saw a group of persons that consisted of women and children [escaping in the distance]. I was afraid lest they should reach the mountain before me, so I shot an arrow between them and the mountain. When they saw the arrow, they stopped. So I brought them, driving them along” (Sahin Muslim 4345)

The Muslim narrator (who happens to be Muhammad's adopted son) sees the women trying to escape (following the massacre of their men) and cuts off their route by shooting an arrow into their path. These aren't women trying to seek refuge with the Muslims. They are trying to avoid capture by the Muslims.

The same hadith goes on to recount that Muhammad personally demanded one of the captured women for his own use:

I drove them along until I brought them to Abu Bakr who bestowed that girl upon me as a prize. So we arrived in Medina. I had not yet disrobed her when the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) met me in the street and said: “Give me that girl.” (Sahih Muslim 4345)

The prophet of Islam and his companions used war to collect women for personal sexual use and for trading. Unless she was arbitrarily declared as someone's wife, the woman became a sex slave. In no case was her fate tied to anything that she had personally done, nor was she given a choice about her future.

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/muhammad/myths-mu-rape.htm
 

Gillian M (11)
Sunday July 26, 2015, 10:33 am
Critics of Islam and Sharia frequently claim that the Qur’an allows Muslim men to rape their female captives and slave girls (i.e. those "whom their right hands possess"). Westernized Muslims, however, are appalled at the thought of their religion allowing rape, so they insist that Islam prohibits this practice. Unfortunately, Islam isn't defined by Westernized Muslims; it's defined by Allah and Muhammad in the Qur'an and the Hadith. So instead of inventing a religion based on the feelings of Westernized Muslims and calling it "Islam," let's turn to the Qur'an and the Hadith to see what Allah and Muhammad have to say about this issue.

As Muhammad's armies raided town after town, they captured many women, who would often be sold or traded. Yet, since the Muslim men were a long way from their wives, they needed wisdom from Allah to guide them in their treatment of their female captives. Allah revealed:

Qur’an 23:1-6—The Believers must (eventually) win through—those who humble themselves in their prayers; who avoid vain talk; who are active in deeds of charity; who abstain from sex, except with those joined to them in the marriage bond, or (the captives) whom their right hands possess—for (in their case) they are free from blame.

Qur’an 70:22-30—Not so those devoted to Prayer—those who remain steadfast to their prayer; and those in whose wealth is a recognized right for the (needy) who asks and him who is prevented (for some reason from asking); and those who hold to the truth of the Day Of Judgement; and those who fear the displeasure of their Lord—for their Lord’s displeasure is the opposite of Peace and Tranquility—and those who guard their chastity, except with their wives and the (captives) whom their right hands possess—for (then) they are not to be blamed.


Notice that Allah commands Muslims to abstain from sex, except with their wives and with "those whom their right hands possess." Allah gave the same sexual rights to Muhammad:

Qur’an 33:50—O Prophet! surely We have made lawful to you your wives whom you have given their dowries, and those whom your right hand possesses out of those whom Allah has given to you as prisoners of war ...


The Muslim practice of having sex with captured women is reported often in the Hadith, where we learn that Muhammad's only objection to sex with captives was his condemnation of birth control.

Sahih Muslim 3371—We went out with Allah’s Messenger on the expedition to the Bi’l-Mustaliq and took captive some excellent Arab women; and we desired them, for we were suffering from the absence of our wives, (but at the same time) we also desired ransom for them. So we decided to have sexual intercourse with them but by observing azl (withdrawing the male sexual organ before emission of semen to avoid conception). But we said: We are doing an act whereas Allah’s Messenger is amongst us; why not ask him? So we asked Allah’s Messenger, and he said: It does not matter if you do not do it, for every soul that is to be born up to the Day of Resurrection will be born.

Sahih al-Bukhari 4138—We went out with Allah’s Apostle for the invasion of Bun Al-Mustaliq and we received captives from among the Arab captives and we desired women and celibacy became hard on us and we loved to do coitus interruptus [same as "azl" above]. So when we intended to do coitus interruptus, we said: "How can we do coitus interruptus before asking Allah’s Apostle who is present among us? We asked (him) about it and he said: "It is better for you not to do so, for if any soul till the Day of Resurrection is predestined to exist, it will exist."

Sahih Muslim 3384—Jabir bin Abdullah reported that a person asked Allah’s Apostle saying: I have a slave-girl and I practice azl with her, whereupon Allah’s Messenger said: This cannot prevent that which Allah has decreed. The person then came (after some time) and said: Messenger of Allah, the slave-girl about whom I talked to you has conceived, whereupon Allah’s Messenger said: I am the servant of Allah and His Messenger.


Clearly, Muslims were taking full advantage of Muhammad's teachings about female captives and slave girls. Nevertheless, Muslims eventually captured women along with their husbands, so they wondered if Allah would allow them to have sex with these married captives (since adultery is otherwise forbidden in Islam).

Allah gives his answer in the Qur'an:

Qur’an 4:24—Also (prohibited are) women already married, except those whom your right hands possess ...


Here's the historical background for this verse:

Sunan Abu Dawud 2150—The Apostle of Allah sent a military expedition to Awtas on the occasion of the battle of Hunain. They met their enemy and fought with them. They defeated them and took them captives. Some of the Companions of the Apostle of Allah were reluctant to have intercourse with the female captives in the presence of their husbands who were unbelievers. So Allah, the Exalted, sent down the Qur’anic verse: “And all married women (are forbidden) unto you save those (captives) whom your right hands possess.” That is to say, they are lawful for them when they complete their waiting period.


Thus, the Qur’an allows men to have sex with their female captives and slave girls, and the Hadith provides numerous examples of how this was practiced. Yet we must follow this fact through to its logical conclusion. Muslims decided to have sex with their captives, whom they were later going to sell. Some of these captives were women whose husbands and families had been slaughtered by Muslims. Others had husbands who had been captured by Muslims. Would these women gladly consent to sexual intercourse with men who had killed their families or taken their families captive, and who were simply going to sell them into slavery when they arrived at the next town? Certainly not. But since the Qur’an and Muhammad authorized sex with these women (and said nothing about seeking their permission), we can only conclude that Muhammad allowed his followers to rape their captives.

http://www.answeringmuslims.com/2014/02/does-islam-allow-muslims-to-rape-female.html
 

Past Member (0)
Sunday July 26, 2015, 11:08 am
N! NOW LETS SEND THEM OFF TO MEET THEIR NEW WIVES...ALL OF WHICH HAPPEN TO BE NAMED BUBBA!!!
 

marie therese Hanulak (8)
Sunday July 26, 2015, 12:47 pm
THE FACES OF EVIL. 6 DEVILS AMONGST MEN
 

Birgit W (160)
Sunday July 26, 2015, 1:08 pm
Muslims are not the only pedophiles on our planet. We have plenty of them here too.
Thanks.
 

Phyllis P (232)
Sunday July 26, 2015, 1:50 pm
As a victim myself, I have no tolerance. What ever punishment they receive will not be good enough
 

Colleen L (3)
Sunday July 26, 2015, 2:47 pm
As*holes. May they rot in Hel*. Thanks Stan
 

Hugh Smith (112)
Sunday July 26, 2015, 3:37 pm
Caste them
 

Hugh Smith (112)
Sunday July 26, 2015, 3:39 pm
Sorry folks I should have said castrate them
 

Janet B (0)
Sunday July 26, 2015, 3:59 pm
Thanks
 

David B (34)
Sunday July 26, 2015, 5:26 pm
it's amazing to hear you all using the term MEN for that trash after what they and I'm sure many others have done .Thanks Stan.
 

Eleonora Oldani (37)
Sunday July 26, 2015, 5:27 pm

Nancy - in such instances I love the Egyptian law - they would get the death penalty.

While I do "fully" ... understand ... that his opportunity can't be missed to bash Islam/Muslims - what do we do with those in this gang who are not Muslims? Do we brush their religions under the carpet? Oh I get it: they were under the spell of these bad Muslims!

What ALL of these so-called "men" did is abhorrent, has nothing to do with any of the religionS these men adhere to and must be punished with all severity. Those who ignored the reports have to face up to their responsibilities and actions must be taken against them too. That's the one and ONLY way to deal with such scumbags.

Period. Where's the problem?
 

Gerry W (0)
Sunday July 26, 2015, 7:28 pm
Who can we trust these days, not too many!
 

Past Member (0)
Sunday July 26, 2015, 8:12 pm
What is the matter, that the Police were unable to tag the effing lot of them. Turn it over to UCOS . I thought reports of this evil behaviour were reserved for India, it's men (?) and it's caste system.
 

Gloria H (88)
Sunday July 26, 2015, 8:39 pm
being Muslim has nothing to do with it. This is what pimps of ALL races, ALL religions, EVERY country do! These men are evil...but...so are their customers who know damned well that a girl/boy is underage. They know damned well that the girl/boy is on drugs..cause..who in their right mind would CHOOSE to have sex with numerous strangers??? Yeah sure...young people all want to have sex with any creep with a few dollars to pay for it--sarcasm.
Go after the pimps...AND go after the johns.
 

Sheila D (28)
Sunday July 26, 2015, 9:04 pm
We know these are not isolated incidences. Pedophiles are everywhere; in all cultures and religions. I'm thankful these six were found guilty. Thanks for the post, Stan.
 

Suzanne L (89)
Sunday July 26, 2015, 10:44 pm
Pedophiles may be everywhere but these behaviours are validated directly or indirectly in some cultures and not in others.
 

Roslyn McBride (26)
Monday July 27, 2015, 1:30 am
Extremely glad these men were caught.
 

Jonathan Harper (0)
Monday July 27, 2015, 2:28 am
Noted
 

Eleonora Oldani (37)
Monday July 27, 2015, 4:06 am

Penny dearest - I had to send you a star for your steadfastness in posting the same crap time and again - LOL!

 

Eleonora Oldani (37)
Monday July 27, 2015, 4:09 am

As this is an ever recurring subject whenever possible which is taken on by a few chosen one on rotation basis here on Care2 – bashing all the 1.8 Billion Muslims because of the crimes of a few - let me put in two links where one can get additional information regarding to what a number of members here say too – it is NOT a unique crime only performed by Muslims.

Kudos and Green Stars that you do dare to stand up against the ongoing hate and incitement campaign – I’m actually positively surprised!!

Those who are interested to follow the two links below and read the indicated comments by me will find quite a number of interesting links and answers. Unfortunately they don’t lead to more “Muslim rape gangs” but it shows that this is truly a worldwide phenomenon through all societies and religions, that they often have helpers and enablers in the law enforcement camp and – as seen in the Rotherham Scandal even in the all-white Christian Rotherham Council (my detailed proof in the comment of Friday June 5, 2015, 2:55 am in the second link “Rotherham Scandal II”)– and that these needs to be urgently addressed too.

It is quite interesting that every time such and similar evidence is provided and posted … there are no factual discussion evolving but one of the Islamophobic footsoldiers is sent to either go onto ad hominem attacks or to have another go at Muhammed (see e.g. the ad hominem attack my comment of Friday June 5, 2015, 2:55 am triggered by Penny and totally ignoring the subject of the evidence). While the later is not my cup of tea the former one was initially rather a bit of a nuisance; I assume nobody likes personal attacks. Today all it does it provokes from my side is a big yawn and a “oh’ déjà vu” – sometimes though a comment makes me also laugh at the unbelievable ignorance some display.

Rotherham Scandal I

Reference to the comments of
Monday June 1, 2015, 4:42 pm,
Monday June 1, 2015, 11:30 pm,
Monday June 1, 2015, 11:52 pm

Rotherham Scandal II

Reference to the comments of
June 5, 2015, 1:57 am
Friday June 5, 2015, 2:55 am
Friday June 5, 2015, 2:59 am

 

Sam H (410)
Monday July 27, 2015, 4:39 am
Absolutely Eleonora! Penny deserves a star like a baby deserves a star every time it needs its diapers changed!
 

Eleonora Oldani (37)
Monday July 27, 2015, 4:56 am

LOL - Sam; you seem to have kids as you're familiar with the concept! It works ...
 

Hilary S (65)
Tuesday July 28, 2015, 1:21 am
bob - you crack me up!

as to this story - i do believe these 6 creeps are just a drop in an ocean of abusers from the same community, hiding behind their misogynistic religious holiness.
 

Past Member (0)
Tuesday July 28, 2015, 4:45 am
Thank you Hilary.


 

Past Member (0)
Tuesday July 28, 2015, 4:50 am
Eleonora: "Unfortunately they don’t lead to more “Muslim rape gangs”.

Well, lady, you are unfortunately dead wrong again. The worst women trafficking starts at Balkans, in the lawless Muslim Kosovo. And the kidnapped/lured and traded women are Christians.

Everything happens like the article describes, just for export to other countries.

The problem is, that those gangs are not discussed either.
 

Gillian M (11)
Tuesday July 28, 2015, 11:23 am
I have no idea what eleanor is talking about, the crap is directly from the Quran so then she must be saying that the Quran is crap, something I totally agree with as well as extremely nauseous.

And as for going through the courts, what a joke or are you pushing this because of taqiyya, lies to forward Islam. You live in a country and you don't know that it doesn't happen. Or do you mean that the girls are actually sold as a temporary wife for a week or maybe a month before being divorced? That is equally sickening but then anything to do with Islam is.

Islam is the only religion which, not only allows, but encourages a man to have sex with a girl from birth. The age of marriage is 8 years old and the girl, if she survives her wedding night with the pervert, is unlikely to have children.
 

Eleonora Oldani (37)
Tuesday July 28, 2015, 4:23 pm

Well Bob - your answers show time and again that you don't even bother to read in order to at least not make again a fool of yourself. Or not to be caught with your pants down again - LOL. Would you have followed the link and READ what's in the links you wouldn't have made such a silly comment which has nothing at all to do with the info provided under the links. But OK - it's you prerogative ...

I think you should truly entertain my suggestion to get yourself a pair of suspenders ...

As for Penny - I think you should check to dose of the medication you take; they truly don't do you any good ... you have nothing but bad days since quite some time!
 

Eleonora Oldani (37)
Tuesday July 28, 2015, 4:29 pm

Oh and just as a side note, dearest Bob - who's fault is it again that we have today a "lawless" Kosovo ...?!

Not Timbuktu's for sure ...
 

Helga Ganguly (138)
Wednesday July 29, 2015, 3:42 pm
One of the finest men I have ever known is a Muslim.He could ably refute the sludge and nonsense and bile that Penny spews from her bitter lips. I went to school with Muslim foreign students when Iran was still under the Shah-our Shah. They would joke that their mothers got a new wedding ring each year because it was their right.In some ways it was a friendlier world. We freely exchanged knowledge of our cultures without demanding first that someone admit America was superior. What happened to those 20 year olds? I studied The Bible as Literature. Penny-have you read the pornography in that book? You don't have to dig far. I remember Sodom and Gomorrah when Lot housed 2 Angels of G-d and the men of Sodom old and young surrounded Lot's house and refused to leave saying ,"Bring out the strangers so that we may "know them." Well wink wink,nudge nudge. Say no more. That went way beyond the bounds of hospitality. So Lot offers the crowd his virgin daughters. But the crowd wants man meat. I trust you all know how this ends. Great holy book. Holy Cow!-sorry,I was thinking of my husband. (who never heard of cow worship-so don't get me started. Hindus are monotheists. .Brahma is the One G-d. Shiva,Krishna, Kali,Durga,Parvati,Ma Santoshi, etc,are other aspects and regional names. See? Easy peasy. I can not wait to hear you re -interpret Hinduism. Or do you just hate Muslims?
 

Helga Ganguly (138)
Wednesday July 29, 2015, 4:28 pm
Penny-did a Muslim dump you for another woman? You harbor a lot of personal anger. It makes me a teeny tiny bit suspicious. If not,do you know,actually know any adult muslim Families? I do. Have you ever traveled? Or are you just faking it after seeing or reading some very bad romance novels and swallowing them whole? As my Professor explained to me,Muhammad lived in a time when men were allowed to have as many wives as they liked and concubines,etc. were also accepted so declaring a limit of 4 wives was as radical at the time for the nomadic people to accept. He said 4 wives but only if you can treat them equally which would be nearly impossible. That's the explanation for the openminded and obviously not the copper pennies. That person,my Professor,who taught a class in Islamic Studies and was 1,000 times more eloquent than I am, made each class an adventure and a window into a different religion and a different world. A few years ago I looked him up in my Alumni Newsletter and he' had been made Professor Emeritus of my University and Oxford. I believe that makes him an expert, aside from my say so.
 

Helga Ganguly (138)
Wednesday July 29, 2015, 4:53 pm
I know many Afghan people who rejoiced when the Taliban was thrown out. They dug up their TV's and radios and hoped that war was over. Afghanistan was,not too long ago,not the cesspool it is now littered with bodies and the uneducated. It had schools for women as well as men and olive groves and fig trees,torn out and replaced by poppies. And exploding shells. Who brought the shells? Was it the evil Muslims? Or the people who wanted the land,the strategic land? You tell me. Ask the crippled children if they were born bitter or did they learn to be bitter at our hands? Women watch their children starve in their arms and soon they don't know right or wrong.They just want to live to feed their children.Muslim women are oppressed by muslim men,brothers,uncles,husbands.And what do you do? Turn a blind eye and call it "their " problem.Then you restrict voting for people of color,minorities, women, take choice away from American women, and waddle off to church,thanking Baal you're not a heathen. But what do I know? I still believe. And because MY G-d doesn't make junk, there is a corner in my heart for everyone. I was taught to love my fellow man. G-d never said I had to like all of them.
 

Helga Ganguly (138)
Wednesday July 29, 2015, 5:03 pm
As for these 6 miscreants,I don't believe in chemical castration or physical castration. I believe in the Lorena Bobbitt cure. Cut off the offending member in such cases only.Rape by men is incurable.You can stop taking pills. Cut off the prick and put it in a blender on Hi. Guaranteed never to reoffend.
 

Eleonora Oldani (37)
Thursday July 30, 2015, 5:12 pm

Helga - I just saw your comments and would love to send you a whole galaxy of stars: *******************

Each one of your comments is better than the previous one; shame that we don't read you more often! Especially your last posting is the perfect recipe to have no repeat offenders - LOL. And the one putting the jewel in the blender would be the victim ... justice served.

I especially like your reference to the 4 wives. It's funny how we forget that other religions know officially sanctioned polygamy too ... but this is a taboo. Equally taboo is that a very small minority within Islam practices polygamy. Actually it says in the Qur'an re the equal treatment of the wives "and you can NOT" ... therefore, by extension and interpretation of most scholars one has to stick to one. But such things don't qualify for propaganda and would hamper the pay-check!

I'm afraid with your other postings you're talking to a deaf person who has switched off that grey mass which one normally has in the skull. I've tried on numerous occasions but it only got worse.

 

Eleonora Oldani (37)
Thursday July 30, 2015, 5:18 pm

Penny – I was considering not to answer but I believe a clear word is in order as you try to intentionally give my comment about you posting crap a different meaning of which you perfectly well know that it is wrong.

I would never – not even in my worst moments of anger – think of insulting the religious feelings of billions of people by calling any of their holy scriptures “crap” and you know that. I do respect – as opposed to you – all human beings irrespective of their faith, ethnicity or social background. What they believe as well as their general spirituality is not for me to judge nor to criticize as long as it helps them to go through their lives and makes them better people.

As the Dalai Lama said so succinct when asked which one is the right religion: “The right religion is the one that makes you a better person.” There’s nothing to add to this words of a very wise and highly respected person.

My reference to “crap” was addressing your “compositions” which you’re incessantly posting and which you feel the urge to let us in on it. That’s your right as I respect Freedom of Expression. But don’t expect me to respect your utterances on such niveaux.

A discussion with a being like you is futile as you wouldn’t know compassion and empathy even if it stares you right in the eye. All you know is your propaganda agenda, hate and incitement of the worst kind. I have nothing but disdain for beings like you.
 

fly bird (26)
Monday August 17, 2015, 7:49 pm
Thank you, Helga, for sharing such worthy comments.

Eleonora, I concur!~! *******
 

Melania P (123)
Monday September 7, 2015, 1:13 pm
I hope these sick bastards burn in hell!
 
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